Tesla Model S Owner Explains Why He Pre-Ordered Porsche Taycan

JUL 24 2018 BY DOMENICK YONEY 149

And tells how much he paid for the privilege.

The Porsche Taycan, formerly known as the Mission-E, is probably the hottest all-electric sports sedan coming to showrooms in 2019. Is it any surprise that a Tesla Model S owner well acquainted with the thrill of electric torque might consider picking one up? Probably not. The upstart electric brand may have plenty of buzz, but Porsche has a long history to lean back on. Plus, the Taycan’s styling looks super fresh.

One such future owner is Jim Roger Johansen of Norway. According to Teslarati, Johansen wanted a sweet new electric sportscar, but the only Tesla that could fill that bill — the 2020 Roadster — is a bit out of his budget at $200,000. We sympathize.

Early in the year, Mr. Johansen made his way to his local Porsche dealership and let them know he was interested in their upcoming electric rocket. In April, he was informed that pre-orders were beginning for the Scandinavian country and if he wanted to keep his place on the list, he would need to fork over 20,000 Norwegian kroner ($2,440). He happily did.

Now, he and approximately 2,300 Norwegians are waiting for their own personal examples of the car. One, we should remind, that no one has even seen the production version of yet. That’s a pretty impressive achievement considering the 5.2 million population of the country. Anyhow, because of the scale of demand, Johansen doubts he will see his new car next year, and hopes it will at least arrive in 2020.

The situation reminds us that Porsche Taycan pre-ordering is already underway in the U.S. and that for $2,500, you too can be put on the official list. Of course, that is if your local dealer is still accepting deposits. We understand that some have already reached their limit and aren’t accepting more pre-orders.

If you do manage to make it onto the waitlist, let us know over on the InsideEVs Forum. We’d love to hear your (eventual) ownership story.

Source: Teslarati

Categories: Porsche

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149 Comments on "Tesla Model S Owner Explains Why He Pre-Ordered Porsche Taycan"

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If it is even closely as good looking as the concept the demand is way beyond of Porsche’s manufacturing capacity per year. Better get in line now if you want one. Otherwise you may have to wait years.

Since the tooling isn’t even installed yet(AFAIK) they have ample time to adjust production capacity to match the high number of reservations.

True on the auto side but they will most likely be battery constrained if there is high demand…

Porsche may make only as many as they wish to sell. Many (most?) of them will represent customers coming from a higher margined Porsche, to what is very likely the lower margined Taycan. Even if they know the touring market is going this direction, they still have shareholders.

Why assume the Taycan will have lower margin? We all know the performance benefits of electric propulsion; and knowing Porsche’s target audience, we can assume they will be willing to pay a premium for that performance, that easily makes up for initially higher production costs… I don’t expect Porsche to feel pressured to sell it at a less profitable price.

It would be very hard to say Porsche is doing any better than 20 to $30, 000 in cost for a 90 kilowatt hour battery. No Motors no BMS.

When the Taycan becomes available in 2020, Tesla should be around 100 $/kWh on pack level (that includes BMS), and others shouldn’t be too far behind. Anything above maybe $12,000 or so for a 90 kWh pack would be a really bad price at that point. Add savings on other components, and we should be well below $10,000 price premium over a mid-range ICE power train.

$2,500 deposit and production limitations? That’s absolutely scandalous.

Ron Swanson's Mustache

You dropped this:

/s

Production limitations are absolutely Scandalous!

Tesla B Taycan the Mission E to the woodshed, on this latest Porsche Deposit Debacle!

$2,500 deposit required: Porsche requires customers to fund operations, soon to be in Bankruptcy. /s.

*Porsche Two and a Half Times More Expensive than a Tesla*
(To Reserve, at least, compared to a Model 3, before, anyway….!)
🙂

It sounds like they are limiting reservations to a number they can deliver in a reasonable period of time plus early buyers will NOT be beta testers. The $2,500 separates the serious from the curious and no “loss leader” model that won’t be available for a long time is being offered. Porsche (part of VW group) is fantastically profitable for a car company and wants to stay that way

Sure, we know the lengths VW Group has gone for profits. VW’s “mission” is something Taycan will have to overcome.

Ah, so the car is very expensive, a bad value, and the buyers will be alpha testing it after they wait over a year to get their hands on one. Very good. 402 hp for ~$85,000 or so. This will be very profitable.

We can do it, so lets do it.

“Years?” We’re talking about Porsche/VW – they’ve been around for over a century and know how to build cars, unlike some other companies. I’m sure they’ll quickly adjust to what is almost certainly going to be incredibly strong demand.

Neither Porsche nor VW have been around for over a century.

You’re right, and I didn’t claim it. VW founded in 1937, Porsche founded in 1931. 81+87=168 years of combined automotive knowhow.

“We can do it, so lets do it.”/”Kind a Wierd”

Please keep your sock puppets straight when posting under multiple names….

We can do it, so lets do it.

I don’t have two accounts, so I don’t know how/why the name changed. Mods can confirm this.

you don’t grasp the simplest of things. Confirmed.

One wonders why Porsche’s Model S competitor didn’t come out in 2012 in that case.

Because they want to stay profitable.

But the Model S was profitable within a year of launch and Porsche knows how to build cars, unlike some other companies.

Heck, Tesla let the cat out of the bag way back in 2009 by showing off the Model S at car shows. If Porsche were so great at building cars at a profit, why didn’t the cut the legs out from under Tesla in 2011 by beating Tesla to the market with a car that beat the Model S specs? Same with the Model 3/Model E/Bluestar that they could have beat to market.

They could have “drown the baby in the bathtub” and undercut Tesla before they even got rolling.

They didn’t, because they didn’t have the vision, not because of economics. Now they are going to have to spend WAY more to now on each sale where they have to compete against Tesla than if they would have beat the Model S and Model 3 to market. That means less profit in the long run for Porsche.

Or, maybe they let Tesla make all the mistakes, all the while proving the whether or not a market existed, then went ahead with making the significant investment in developing an entirely new platform. Porsche is consistently the most profitable car maker for a reason – they aren’t stupid, and they make exquisite vehicles. Now that they know there’s a market (thanks Tesla), and all the pitfalls of building an EV (thanks Tesla), they’re setting about to build a car to their standards, which is to say, one with a fit and finish superior to a kit car and which has a positive margin. But you’re right – they should have just rushed in, impetuously designed something, and lose billions and billions of dollars, just like Tesla. Sounds like a great strategy to drown that baby (which has been doing a fine job of drowning itself, anyway).

They know how to build piston engines but not about fueling them, that is left to refineries. It remains to be seen if they know how to build electric motors and how to find partners for the charging infrastructure, partners that know what they are doing. They probably will do OK, but will they do it profitably? And fast enough not to miss the market? We will see.

“Miss the market” – so I guess every car company founded after Daimler and Ford missed the automotive market. Also, Apple missed the mp3 market because it followed Rio. I mean, you guys aren’t even trying anymore, but I guess that’s what dogma is all about – faith.

An electric motor is a bunch of copper coils surrounded by a stator – not exactly rocket science. And Porsche already makes them – makes them, not buys them – for the 918 and Panamera EV. So they probably have that part of the equation covered.

“An electric motor is a bunch of copper coils surrounded by a stator – not exactly rocket science.”, so if that is the case, why did Siemens need to Analyse each and Every aspect of their 60 kW Motor that weighed 50 Kg, and rethink the design, to end up with a new 50 Kg Motor that put out 260 kW? At just 2,400 RPM!

Might be mor to making a good and powerful and efficient motor than what we made in Science Class at High School!

I can’t speak for Siemens, but to suggest that building electric motors is beyond the technical know-how of Porsche is demonstrably false, given that, you know, they already build high-performance electric motors.

That must be why VW in Europe stopped taking orders for the Golf GTE when they couldn’t fulfil orders for more than a year , and why there is a six month waiting list for the eGolf ? Oh, wait , no….

Nice Move ! Now, All he needs to buy is a Charging Network to take it on kind of a Trip … I wouldn’t Pay 2 Cents For any Porsche , BMW , Or Most things That have anything to do with Germany ..Had Them all , Had My Fill ! They’re all Phony High Priced Trash to buy & Maintain…. Enjoy !

They building one plus these guys fly private or first class if you owed a Porsche

SUCKERS !

It’s not your money so no need to worry.

Jealous much?

Exactly…

Glad they’re “building one”, Will. Really looking forward to that second 350KW, in the United States.

Don’t worry…VW will be building out the charging network at no charge to the consumer as part of their billion plus dollar settlement with the US government. Things will be fine, no worries!

It should be obvious that a proprietary charging network is not a sustainable business model. Do you see Chevy-only gas stations? All the hoopla that people make about the Tesla supercharger network is short lived.

And yet, Porsche *is* building their own charging network…

According to them it is open to all CCS cars in America and Europe. In Japan Porsche will use Chademo on the car and on its chargers.

Tesla will be selling the network for more cash

Well who else could Tesla have built the supercharging network for during the last 6-years of hoopla? Technically, Tesla built the supercharger network for every fast-charging EV out there.

If you define competitive advantage, than you might find slowness to build networks has made Tesla quite the sustainable company. The Model 3 “cash machine” will let them depend upon public networks, at the time of their choosing.

Hoopla? Considering there is no other proprietary OR non-proprietary fast charging network to compete with the Supercharging network? Calling it merely hoopla tells me that you don’t understand what it really does- namely makes Teslas the only truly viable long distance EVs.

Also Porsche has said that charging wouldn’t be much cheaper than gasoline from their chargers…!

And it shouldn’t be since most people will charge at home. Outside of malls, supermarkets, etc… I expect there to be a charge for charging.

That would be from Porsche chargers – for the rest, it will be normal rates or free (like there are a lot of places in Norway).

Since he lives in Norway, I don’t think he will have a problem finding charging stations…

Norwegian Porsche Stealerships B Taycan potential premium/luxury EV orders away from Tesla and Jaguar.

Is this where Porsche starts to emerge victorious, in the 2 Door EV sports car segment?

Porsche Mission E-lon b-hind.

Victorious for about 20,000 vehicles.
Will it slow the bleed to Tesla, or will the sales come from other Porsche models?

Never mind, the demand for quality EV’s is higher then 20,000.

I feel like people who perpetually want a Porsche will be happy to have an electric option. I hope that it represents a shift in Porsche demand to electrics, not a “Oh, now that Porsche has an EV sports car, I can forget about Tesla” shift.

Used to know a guy who whined about his $2200 Porsche oil change. I felt like there was more in the service order than that, but hey, one less reason to gripe about the Porsche owner experience: reduced maintenance costs!

I like the Mission E name

Well at least 20k Porsche B Taycan victory laps, for the 2 Door production premium/luxury EV segment, until Elon starts delivering on the Rocketship/Roadster 2.0.

We can do it, so lets do it.

Well, Norwegians apparently hate Tesla because, just like everything else, it can’t deliver parts to repair its cars there:

https://www.bloombergquint.com/business/2018/07/24/norwegians-quietly-revolt-against-tesla#gs.DXZdr4c

Beautiful car, lets hope the production version looks half as good.

Assuming it looks like all the other cars in there lot for the pass 20 years, I would assume it will be.

I’d be interested to find out how it compares to Model S. Is Porsche really a competition or just a completely different class of car?

A lot of Teslas are bought because it is the only long range EV out there. So people buy it even though it isn’t what they actually would like to have.
With the little choice out there it doesn’t make too much sense classifying the cars buy much more than price.

You make a good point about limited BEV choices and their classification by price.
I disagree about why people buy Tesla. Some might get it for the exact reasons you stated, but others love what Tesla offers and will not buy anything else. It’s the “iPhone effect” in the automotive world.

Iphone jhas 15% globla market share. In Europe, Android have three times the Iphone in market share.

Yes, now the market share is different after everyone else caught up. Do you remember what it was when nobody else was producing smart phones with large touch-screens?

That situation never existed. Smartphones with large touch screens were a thing before the iPhone — Apple just made them mainstream.

15% global market share would be amazing for a car maker…

In terms of dimensions this is a 911 4door coupé, lets hope Porsche makes a smaller version… Porche Cayman 4door 😉
Something to compete whit the BMW 4 Grand Coupé and the Audi A5, more expensive of course.

The Mission E Concept measured: 190.9 L and 78.3 W.

911 (varies by model): 177 – 180 L.
Model S: 196 L & 86.2 W.
Model 3: 185 L & 73 W.

Right in the middle of the Tesla’s is the perfect size… S is too big, 3 is too small…

Oh, so you have the interior specs for the production Taycan? What are they? And you also have the exterior dimensions and curb weight? I do know that the Taycan seats only 4 and both Teslas seat 5.

That 86″ for the model S is including the mirrors, the car body is about 76 or 77″. If 78″ is the body only width for the Porsche, which it probably is, It is a wide car.

BMW, in any iteration, is no competition for Porsche, so we probably will not ever see a 4-dr Cayman.

I think a lot of people are going to be disappointed with the finished product. I think it’s going to end up smaller than people think, with a larger price tag, limited production, and a poor charging infrastructure.

Nice FUD…
Maybe you should just direct them to the local F150 store where there range will be unlimited…

You can already see it in the prototypes. Most of the cool stuff from the concept car is gone and it looks smaller than a Model S. Also, in true Porsche fashion, EVERYTHING will be optional.

What cool stuff is gone?

And now I get downvoted for asking a question? Words fail me…

You’re a blasphemer – the acolytes burn you at the stake. Never question the dogma of Pope Elon the Meglomaniacal.

My question wasn’t related to Tesla in any way.

Just the chance that you could have bad intentions towards Tesla is worth a downvote to some.

You didn’t agree that the Porsche is a crap car, so you must be a Tesla short that hates the environment. Tesla is hated and under attack by everyone, so it’s your duty to hate and attack everyone else.

That mentality isn’t unique to (some) hardcore Tesla fans (or rather day traders betting on Tesla, while the shorts will hate everything remotely positive you say about Tesla), but they can be pretty annoying, if you want to talk about EVs in general. Because to them the worst enemy isn’t rolling coal trucks, or V8 SUVs, but rather well made EVs not built by Tesla.

I believe they are talking about some of the distinctive styling elements. However, I believe the production version will be closer to the concept’s appearance than the heavily cladded and disguised mules.

It is supposed to be smaller, faster and more upscale than a Model S. Porsche will have a new Panamera-sized EV coming out shortly thereafter for that.

It isn’t faster.

Since when was speed the primary metric used to measure an EV’s worth? Isn’t that something buckle-dragging ICErs care about, and yet that seems to have become Tesla’s selling. Whether or not it is as fast as an S, who really cares whether or not your car can get to 60 in 2 seconds vs 2.5?

It doesn’t have to be rational — but many people *do* care about these things; and selling them on EVs is important.

Can a Tesla even make it around Nurburgring at speed? Fast is not just 0-60 mph once every 20 minutes after the batteries cool off.

The Model 3 almost certainly can, according to all reports thus far.

I believe that Porsche will provide a performance package people will not be disappointed in. Yes, the charging infrastructure will be poor initially, but give it a few years and it will grow.
As far as the size of the car – 911 comes in a small package and yet it is the most popular Porsche ever.

I’m sure there will be upgrades for a price, but everyone is comparing it to the Model S. If it’s not better than it all around, it will be nothing more than a low volume alternative for the enthusiast.

All Porsche models are low volume cars for the auto enthusiasts. Porsche produces relatively few cars as compared to other European makes.

Porsche delivered ~246000 cars in 2017. That’s not very low volume.

Yes, that IS low volume. If they only made one model, it would be OK, but this is with several models.
Manufacturers with smaller volumes makes either more primitive cars, or much more expensive ones.
Tooling and production line construction cost a lot of money. There is a certain volume needed to cover the cost and secure profit.

Funny when Tesla asks people for $2,500 to configure, the negative press is everywhere. Porsche does the same thing (worse actually since this is just to hold a reservation for a car 18 months away from delivery) and we get crickets from the media.

Porsche has been doing this for years for their hot models. Some recent examples, GT2RS, GT3, GT3RS Cayman GT4

So that makes it OK for them but not for Tesla?

We can do it, so lets do it.

Yes, because unlike Tesla, they are the most financially successful car company in the industry and consistently turn the most profits and highest margins. Oh, also they’ve been around for about a century and haven’t missed a delivery target in – when have they ever failed to deliver? Compare that to Tesla, which burns $500k an hour, has never turned a profit (despite $5b/year in gov subsidies), can’t build cars, and has a CEO who alternately shoots cars to Mars and calls heroes pedophiles. So, yeah, a $2500 deposit to Porsche is probably a little safer bet.

(⌐■_■) Trollnonymous

Nice ad hominem non sequitor – it doesn’t get much more illogical than that. Then again, most religious fanatics are necessarily illogical.

Are you really THAT DUMB?

Yes, yes you are.

We can do it, so lets do it./Kind a Wierd — you are mixing up your sockpuppets again.

VW admitted to cheating. Are you saying VW lied when they admitted to cheating, and didn’t cheat?

No, I’m saying it has absolutely nothing to do with this conversation or the point I’ve made. So, classic non sequitor screech to interject an ad hominem fallacy.

Brush up on logic – the world looks a lot differently when you live by it instead of unconsidered emotion.

Do you even know what ad hominem means?… He is talking about a company.

Do you think ad Homs only apply to people? Lol – I’m not sure YOU know what ad hom is.

To the best of my knowledge, the Taycan *already* missed the target. For a long time, it has been advertised as becoming available in 2019. Now they only talk about official unveiling in 2019, while deliveries have been pushed to 2020…

Crime pays

It’s not exactly apples-to-apples. Tesla asked for $1,000 deposit and then $2,500 to configure and order the car.
Porsche seems to be asking for a $2,500 initial deposit. They might ask for $5,000 to configure, only time will tell.

Tesla is a favorite company to bash because of the heavy short investments – any negative news will dink the stock a little.

Tesla model 3 performance is a more practical sports EV.

Might be more practical, but doesn’t look anywhere as nice as this vehicle. The Model 3 looks like a high greenhouse family sedan. If you don’t know what it was, it wouldn’t really standout from the crowd.

Greenhouse family sedan??? Beauty is in the eye of the …. no, you are crazy.

We can do it, so lets do it.

No he’s not – the 3 is a bland-looking car that shares the same “worn-bar-of-soap” design language as the long-in-the-tooth-looking S. I honestly cannot tell the difference between an S and a 3 without looking really hard.

Yet a 3/4 scale Panamara is design perfection apparently..

If you think that’s what the Taycan looks like, it’s time to get your prescription checked. Also, link that the Taycan is 3/4 size of the Panamerica?

For us blind old Bats, the TM3 Door handles are the “Tell”.

Door Handles From the Side, and the Nose from the front, and the limited or lack of rear badging after the “T” on the back!

TM3 handles well and drives quite nicely (although I haven’t pushed it really hard yet), but I wouldn’t bet against Porsche legendary performance. Porsche will most likely have better suspension, steering, and braking. Of course, it’s in a completely different price range.

And will surely be a better bargain/value car.
But, it’s still a good thing to see Porsche build out a Performance EV.

too bad the Model 3P is so unattractive… I guess I am not the only one, Autoweek said “CONS: Same ugly exterior”

http://autoweek.com/article/car-reviews/first-drive-tesla-model-3-performance

Great but more than the final look of this car, that no doubt will be beautiful, although much too small for my family, I’m interested to see the final Product details and Ts&Cs, especially the battery and drive train final specs and their Porsche Warranty coverage. And before any deposit, I would want to see a full end to end 800V/350kW charging cycle YouTube video, charging from # 0% to # 100% SOD, with a timer and a view of the actual Power accepted-in overtime. I can’t believe that with all test mules pictured on the NET recently, and the new openings of 800V/350kW capable chargers, nobody could ever film a full charge cycle of a Mission E. What is the problem ? The trade-off for this type of ultra fast charging (Say at 3.8C, if battery remains at 92kWh capacity charging at 350kW, versus 1.2C on current Tesla 100kWh Models S&X capped at 120kW SuperCharging power), is to achieve that either at the expense of the battery life-cycles, hence the risk of a very low Porsche warranty, and the need for full new battery replacements, at the usual Porsche GOLD PRICES, every few years, versus Tesla current 8 years… Read more »

800 VDC charging doubles the charging power compared with 400 VDC at the same current. Without needing to increase the current to increase the charging power, the C rate remains the same. So charging twice as fast at 800 VDC is no harder on battery cells.

Quadruples the charging power at the same current.

Nope. Power at same current is proportional to voltage.

C rate relates to power, not current. The pack voltage has absolutely no effect on the C rate. Only advantage of higher voltages is thinner wires/plugs for the same power.

Obviously there are plenty of Elon fanbois here.
1. I am very impressed to see that Porsche is taking pre-orders at the same style as Tesla.
2. In terms of production capacity, I have no doubt Porsche can handle the large number of orders.
3. Question about whether it will look like the concept; judging from Past Porsche releases like the 918 and all the pristine quality products that they currently sell. I have no doubt they will not disappoint. Their reputation is higher than most car makers, therefore even more to lose if they screw up.

Finally, I am glad to see Porsche and Jaguar coming in with their own innovative electric car. Next few years will be very exciting.

Are Elon fanbois the same as Tesla fanboys? How do I join either (or both)?
Love my Teslas, do I qualify?

Porsche is not taking preorders, they are sending you to a 3rd party dealer that may or may not take a preorder. That dealer may also, at their discretion, not sell you your car if there is more profit to be made by selling it on the open market.

RE: The Prototype

People can put to rest the image above. Look at the Turismo wagon, its height, normal door handles, smaller diameter wheels and higher front end. Taycan may have a lower front skirt, but nothing like the mule they keep shopping around.

Many “concepts” build up the impression of low, with super-size wheels. While your eyes may like it, don’t count on it.

” taking pre-orders at the same style as Tesla ” – not quite.

I inquired at a local Porsche dealer, and was told all 50 units allocated to that dealer have been taken. If Porsche really wants to sell this car to those who want it, they should have accepted all the orders and try their best to build and deliver them. I’m sure they have the capital and the capacity to build as many as they want.

Either Porsche wasn’t sure about the acceptance of the Taycan, or they don’t want to cannibalize sales from their own offerings such as the Panamera and perhaps the 911.

I believe here in the US, there are about 189 dealers x 50 = 9450. Now I’m curious how many actual deposits they have!?

The dealers are not even required to take deposits or make a list. It says that right on the Porsche site. You can bet that many of them will take any of them that they get and put a “market adjustment” on them.

Taycan “market adjustment units” will be measured in multiples of $2500. So when a Taycan buyer brags and says he/she “got lucky and only had only 4 market adjustment units, less than their 2011 Volt!” they will mean they only had to pay an extra $10K.

https://www.autoblog.com/2010/08/03/report-chevrolet-dealer-ready-to-charge-20-000-over-msrp-for-v/

it costs $1000 to deposit in the US…

The deposit amount (or lack thereof) is per dealer.

I’m on the list with my dealer, but they are not taking monetary deposits, yet.

(⌐■_■) Trollnonymous

What’s the price of the Taycan?

There are actually Two Prices, that need to be Taycan into consideration,

What price are you interested in?

The “price” before you buy it,
Or,
The “PRICE” after you bought it!

I think many Tesla owners have a Tesla just because it’s currently the only real option if you need a long range family car. I too have a Model S (AND live in Norway) and will swap my S for a 5 seater BMW BEV as soon as available.

So in 4 years?

I like to say “just around the corner”

ICE and Electric. Good business since.

There is no set deposit amount in the US. The deposit amount, or lack thereof, is per dealer.

I’m on the pre-deposit list at my dealer, and they’ve called to discuss with me, but they are not taking monetary deposits, yet.

It was a $5,000 deposit for me at my local dealer.

All 50 available spots were taken at a local dealer in San Jose. No word on extra availability.

And if the dealer wants to make extra money on them, they can mark them up at will. If you don’t like it, they will give you your money back and move on to the next guy.

No need to explain. Just the action says, “My tastes suck, and I love butt ugly cars.”

why was this article ever posted here. who cares that he ordered a Porsche. ok I personally didn’t order a Porsche – make that a news item “Tesla Model 3 Owner Explains Why He’s Never Wanted a Porsche”

My strategy was to go cheap on our daily drivers (Model 3 LR) and save the money for the Roadster. The Mission E is a great looker. If the production model holds true then they definitely are giving Tesla competition.

I didn’t know that the Model 3 LR is a cheap car. I guess I’ll go get two.

Porsche, maybe just not doing more than saying “We want to play, too!”

That is a picture of the concept Mission-E

The Taycan will just look like a panamera.

Nothing special.

Hard to say one way or the other based off of test mules. It would be fantastic if it looked like the concept. Stunningly beautiful. Panamera … that’s a dog of a car. IT’s the polar opposite. If it ends up looking like the Panamera, there’ll be a lot of cancelled reservations.

I hope they make a great car, and that the price is good, and that more people buy EV’s because they will have more options. There is a reason why there are as many ICE car makers in the world as there are today. People want choices, and EV’s will have to come in as many shapes and brands as ICE cars come in.

What is silly though, is this ongoing meme that EV sales are some zero-sum game where it is Tesla vs. [name ICE car maker]. By far the largest number of EV buyers from ICE companies will be current ICE owners as EV sales grow, not people who already own EV’s.