Renault & Nissan CEO Carlos Ghosn Eyes $8,000 BEV For China

NOV 7 2016 BY MARK KANE 25

Venucia e30 sales in China - September 2016

Venucia e30 sales in China – September 2016

A rebadged Nissan LEAF for China, offered as the Venucia e30 (aka the “Morning Wind” if you will) has not resonated well with the booming Chinese plug-in vehicle market.

Another Look At The e30 (Photo: InsideEVs From Auto China)

Another Look At The e30 (Photo: InsideEVs From Auto China)

The price tag of 242,800 yuan ($36,900) is simply too high for the Chinese consumer compared to what the car offers.

In 2015, only 1,273 were sold, while over the first nine months of this year 1,506 have been sold (good for around 25th on the Chinese sales charts).

The 2016 numbers are improved, as the e30 has moved outside of being available only regionally; however at the launch of the car over two years ago, Nissan said it expected to be building and selling 50,000 copies a year by 2018 – so the numbers are better, but also awful.

According to CEO Carlos Ghosn, the new answer to sell EVs in volume from the Renault-Nissan Alliance will be an affordable electric car sold, for about $8,000. Hopefully this time it won’t be another rebadge…we don’t need a Twizy clone for China.

“What we want to do is bring a $7,000-8,000 electric car without incentives,”

“If we are able to make this kind of breakthrough, it’s going to change the game,”

source: Automotive News Europe

Categories: China, Nissan, Renault

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25 Comments on "Renault & Nissan CEO Carlos Ghosn Eyes $8,000 BEV For China"

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The Nissan LEAF S (24 kWh) has an msrp of $29k. The Nissan Versa is a similar car at $14k msrp. Don’t tell me that the 24 kWh battery adds $15k to the cost of the car, if so Nissan must have the worst battery deal in the industry!

The LEAF is seriously over-priced. They should easily be able to cut $8k-$10k off the price. There’s you cheaper car, Nissan!

Not a chance. The new Nissan Note e-Power is a Note with a Leaf drivetrain, and a three cylinder, 1200 cc generator running at 2500 rpm, charging a 1.5 kWh battery. No EPA numbers, as it is only available in Japan, so far. But it got 87.4 mpg on the Japanese test vs 76.4 mpg for the Prius, so perhaps 58 mph EPA. Price is about $19,500 in yen. If they could sell the Leaf at that price they would.

How is it a LEAF drivetrain if it’s only 1.5 kWh battery and a gas engine?

The Leaf’s electric motor is still used to drive the wheels. The gasoline generator only creates electricity to run the motor and recharge the battery. It is a pure series hybrid, similar to the i3 REx, except without the plug.

With the extra conversion losses, I don’t see how this thing is more efficient than a Prius.

The electric motor is the least interesting part of an electric drive train. That’s standard, off the shelf stuff.

I don’t disagree with you. I’m just explaining what Nissan is doing, and that is to make a pure series hybrid, reusing parts from the Leaf.

will it more efficient than the prius on the Japan cycle official rated at 2.7 l/100KM to prius 3 l/100KM, it also test drive by a few people, what is you are overlooking nissan have never disclose there 1.2 liter 3 cylinder engine thermal efficiency, and the engine does not run continuous and is is set at maximum rpm of 2500.BUt to look at a 1.2 liter take a look at mitsubishi 1.2 3 cylinder engine which is very efficient.

By getting rid of the mechanical losses from the planetary gear boxes, and only running the motor at its most rpm.

most efficient rpm

Good point. I guess it could pan out on certain driving cycles. Would be interesting to see if this translates to the US driving cycles.

So how much do you think the ICE drivetrain costs?
It’s not free and it’s included in the e-Power price.

Nissan could most likely put out a $19k Leaf if they wanted. But they prefer to take it slow and make more profits than go all electric.

Thankfully the Model 3 and Bolt will stop them trying to sell a 29k vehicle that is worth 19k.

Nissan will need thermal management on the LEAF to sell more. People are fed up with battery degradation.

All EV’s have battery degradation. How manufacturers manage that is important. Reportedly Volt has much spare capacity, which hides the degradation. Maybe Tesla is the same, after all they sold a 60kwh car with a 75kwh battery, maybe all their batteries are significantly bigger than the amount they let the owner use? Undoubtedly early Leaf had a problem, but don’t hear the same reports for the improved lizard battery.

And they named it “Note”? A Note with batteries?

Also Zoe, car price is like it is batteri included + battery lease. Renault Clio is similar and cost 11.000 EUR!

Agree the Leaf is drastically overpriced and that is why many people who buy one can get up to 10k off MSRP…

At 200 per kWh a 24 kWh battery ks only 4800 and that is more than GM is paying LG…

Not sure what OEMs pay for motor inverter amd charger but DIY can get them for abot 6k…

Plus it was reported in another article that EVs only require 1/10 the production labor due to no ICE and complicated transmision…

So when comparing to the Versa you also habe to subtract pit a lot of labor ICE and trans…

But the big difference with EVs is that manufactures need to make there profit when selling since they wont be making it on repairs and maintance…

This is the bit that does not make sense to me, either. 8 years on you would think the vehicle costs would be pretty low. Battery costs should have come down and the motor, inverter, electronics should be solid, low cost parts by now. Given 200+ range, low cost vehicles coming on stream, they would command a sizable market if they dropped the price to $25k.

I agree incentives drive up prices, and I think it is a complicated situation of cutting into the ICE profits, but that is most likely going to happen anyway.

The other issue is how they manage resale values. There is a huge backlash if the new car cost less than the resale for your 2yr old vehicle.
As batteries become bigger and cheaper this will also become a problem. What does Tesla do when their $35k model 3 can do as much as their $70k model S? Don’t be surprised if they suddenly have a P200DL just around the time the model 3 launches.

The manufacturer does not have to worry about repairs and service, but they do have to worry about that at the dealer network. Tesla has shown that EV don’t need as much servicing, so expect dealerships will have to change as EV adoption increases. Nissan specifies 6month service intervals on the Leaf, which appear realistically to appease the dealer. I doubt my Leaf really needs a service every 6months, and the dealer even admitted that was the case, seemed like they thought it was a waste of their time, and minor service only made them $90 anyway (compared to same amount of ICE time costing about $350 or more).

I assume these will fit the Chinese definition of “low speed” vehicles, with a 62 mph limit.

Personally, I’d like to see this as the global limit for all personal vehicles. Bigger, faster vehicles should require a commercial license, and annual physical and mental evaluation. The catch being, if you want one you are crazy, and don’t qualify. 🙂

Sounds like dedicator ship to me if they are going to limit cars to 62 miles on hour. The reason being the speed limit is 70 in Vriginia.

I personally find the under powered low speed cars more dangerous to drive then one that is high speed with a lot of power.

You feel safer despite the fact that the momentum that must be absorbed in a crash goes up, and your reaction time goes down?

Lowering speed limits makes everybody safer, not just the driver.

So Nissan will focus on the low end of the market. That’s good. However, we haven’t heard anything lately about a Bolt/Model III competitor (other than Ghosn’s early comment on “we can beat the Bolt”, followed thereafter by a photo of him looking terrified while checking out the Bolt in person). I wonder what that means for the US market. Do they have something up their sleeves after all? Or will they slash the price of the Leaf, and stick with half the battery of the Bolt? Are they content in giving up the US market, so long as they are still in the lead internationally? I can’t imagine that lead would last too long, though, only going after the bottom of the barrel.

Morning wind? Hahahahaha, I let out a huge one of those every morning!

Well, we know what an $8000 Reva EV looks like in India, so the question is, what can you do to make it better in China?

Nissan reminds me of Nintendo, never drop the price, think they are the only game in town. Look how well Nintendo consoles are going against Sony and Microsoft, taken them a long time to realise the market prefers the more powerful system.
So now Nissan has seen that others can make a serious longer range EV, and the market prefers that longer range, so maybe they will wake up and start releasing information to keep their “fans”/”cultists”/”die-hards” loyal to their brand. At the moment it seems they are losing this market.