Electric Loading Claims 4-Minute Ultra Fast-Charge For Porsche

NOV 16 2018 BY DOMENICK YONEY 23

Requires a grain of salt.

Ultra-fast charging is the way of the future for electric vehicles and Electric Loading intends to be part of it. The French company has just inaugurated its new headquarters in Lieusaint, to the south of Paris, France, and took advantage of the opportunity to present its “Hyperload” DC ultra-charge station. They claim to be able to fill most electric vehicles in ten minutes or less and, in the case of the electric Porsche, 4 minutes. We’re not entirely convinced.

By “electric Porsche” we expect our source, Le Parisien, is referring to the Mission E family of products, including the Taycan. Indeed, the German automaker does say its electric sports sedan can ultra-charge but, more specifically, puts the time at 15 minutes to achieve an 80-percent charge. That’s significantly different from the claim here — over 300 percent different.

The figure from the German automaker Porsche was calculated using a 350 kW charging station. That is just a tad lower than the power level Electric Loading cites for its Hyperload equipment at 360 kW. A nice little boost, but not nearly enough to make up for the difference in claimed charging time.

With no passenger vehicles able to accept this level of power yet on the road — Porsche is only expected to begin delivering the Taycan in about a year from now (they are already accepting pre-orders, however) —  these speed claims are still immaterial. We believe, though, it would behoove charging companies and automakers to start grounding their claims in reality. If people are told they can expect their EV to recharge in 10 minutes, that ought to be possible in the real world. Giving hugely optimistic figures that have no chance of being realized by owners will only hurt electric vehicles and their adoption in the long run.

One thing Electric Loading does have going for it is the appearance of their equipment. The pencil work was done by Axena Design and you can get a better look at it in the video below, recorded, in part, at CES early in the year. They also claim it will be a lot cheaper to install: around 5,000 euros instead of the 50,000 euros it says other systems cost. We’ll reserve judgment on that claim for now, but will keep our ears open to see how that turns out.

Source: Le Parisien

Categories: Charging, Porsche

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23 Comments on "Electric Loading Claims 4-Minute Ultra Fast-Charge For Porsche"

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It doesn’t say so in the article (I think), and their site is “under maintenance” — but I suspect the “four minute charging” is the kind of spin pioneered by Fisker: four minutes… for 100 km.

As far as I can see, they claim €15,000 installation costs, not €5,000?

When I am driving long distance, I don’t need to charge in 5 minutes. 20 minutes is fine with me

Yes, and me too. It’s so infrequent, and I want a little break anyway.

But I care how much it costs. If it takes 20 minutes we’ll need four times as many charging points as if it takes five, and that’ll be much more expensive. It’s easy to forget how few cars on the road are EVs, and how fast it will grow. About as many EVs will be added to the roads next year as there are in total now. Even in Norway, where EVs has had more than ten times the share they do in America for the past ten years, electric cars are less than five percent of the fleet (but over 40% of new sales).

Charging time isn’t simply about latency. Time is money. It’s much cheaper to make fewer but more powerful chargers. The question is how much the batteries will be able to take.

More powerful chargers are more expensive… Don’t know the exact prices: but going by some remarks, it’s not at all clear that they are actually cheaper than building more slower stalls.

Something tells me that physics is going to call BS on the 4 minute charge. That is a massive amount of energy to move and store. If you were charging a 100 kWh battery that would be an a 1500 kWh charge rate.

And at a 15C charge rate, would damage most batteries.

Agreed. I’m guessing they might mean 10-70% for like an 80kWh vehicle (trying to be realistic). That would make it a 720kW rate. I’m not holding them to anything less than what they said though.

9C is still bollocks for any battery pack in actual use in a BEV though.

VW could maybe take it..? They choose to use the same cells in their BEVs and PHEVs. That simplifies the supply chain and increases parts volume, but also means they had to go with lower energy density and higher power density than optimal for a BEV (because PHEV packs are so small, but just be able to take at least 40 kW to make good use of regenerative braking).

The irony is that on current-generation 50 kW chargers, the e-Golf is a slow-charger! Its cells could take much more, but CCS (1.0) maxes out at 125A, so the low pack voltage makes it impossible to get near the rate the cells tolerate.

On a 500A charger the e-Golf should be able to charge MUCH faster. But that’d require a software update, which would have to be done at a service center since it can’t update OTA…

Isn’t Porsche also using cells of the PHEV-type?

Remains to be seen… But going by the charging rates they claim, I’d assume they are at least similar. (Even if not actual dedicated PHEV cells.)

“9C is still bollocks for any battery pack in actual use in a BEV though.”

CATL has been hawking their EnerSpeedy line for a couple years or more. Their marketing materials claim a10C rate. For mild hybrids they have a 48V battery they claim can do up to 40C.

They didn’t say this was achieved with a car that was actually in production so that is a false requirement.

Are you sure these are charge rates, not discharge rates? AFAIK 10 C charge is achievable only with LTO batteries (not suitable for BEVs because of low density and high price); and I’m not aware of *any* Li-Ion chemistry allowing anywhere near 40C charge.

It’s not just a software upgrade. The cabling and charging circuity at least would have to be beefed up as well. Not to mention cooling…

BTW, I’m not sure whether VW is actually using real PHEV cells in their BEVs. CATL for example also offers cells in the PHEV2 format that are actually optimised for BEV usage…

Yes, 1500 kW vs. their claimed 360. They talk about partial fill up, like some do with gasoline. Maybe it’s just a 25-50% charge to get you back home to your cheap overnight charger?

It doesn’t need physics to see it’s BS. They are actually only talking about 360 kW; and they are talking about existing vehicle models, which clearly wouldn’t take higher rates anyway.

I really don’t want to charge my battery in 4 minutes unless Porsche is going to replace it every year.

The article says:

“Giving hugely optimistic figures that have no chance of being realized by owners will only hurt electric vehicles and their adoption in the long run.”

I agree 100%. This kind of B.S. claim is only going to create a backlash against EVs if people actually believe such claims, then find out they are very far from the truth.

While I hope that some day we’ll see mass produced EVs capable of charging 300+ miles in 10 minutes or less, and in fact I expect that to eventually happen, I very seriously doubt that the battery cells in this car are capable of that. It’s going to take a significant advance or two in battery cells before they will be able to charge that rapidly.

Where is the SEC when you need them… BS Claims…

This is a French Company so whatever the SEC says, does or does not do is irrelevant. Go complain to the Bourse in Paris if they are a quoted company.

> We believe, though, it would behoove charging companies and automakers to start grounding their claims in reality. If people are told they can expect their EV to recharge in 10 minutes, that ought to be possible in the real world. Giving hugely optimistic figures that have no chance of being realized by owners will only hurt electric vehicles and their adoption in the long run.

Hear, hear. I can’t wait for the day to come where you been to hold Tesla to that same standard.

Unless you are talking about timelines, I’m not sure where Tesla is supposedly giving hugely optimistic figures?

I’ll wait for solid-state, thank you.