New Tesla Powerpack 2 “Provides Twice The Energy Density”, Shipping Now

3 months ago by Jay Cole 32

Tesla Energy Powerwall 2.0 debuts Friday, Powerpack 2.0 already shipping

Tesla Energy Powerwall 2.0 debuts Friday, Powerpack 2.0 already shipping

Perhaps not wanted to impede Friday’s big Tesla/SolarCity launch of the joint “integrated solar roof” project using Tesla Energy’s new Powerwall 2.0 – which we will cover/livestream this evening from 5:30 PT (note time change from earlier/later 7PM), Tesla has let slip details on its first significant Powerpack upgrade.

Tesla's CEO introduces the world to the Powerpack last year. Now version 2.0 hits the market with double the density (and 21-70 cells)

Tesla’s CEO introduces the world to the Powerpack last year. Now version 2.0 hits the market with double the density (and 21-70 cells)

Powerpack 2 …perhaps not the catchiest title, but it gets the job done.

The most significant change is in the energy density of the industrial-grade energy storage system, which has doubled – enabling 200 kWh of storage and an output rating of 50 kW.

Version 2.0 of the Powerpack also has a new Gigafactory-built inverter, a package the company says “is the lowest cost, highest efficiency and highest power density utility-scale inverter on the market,” while being easier to install than the previous generation.

The units actually started shipping in September, and Tesla notes that it has already delivered over 300 MWh worth of battery storage to ~18 countries.

Here is Tesla’s blog update in its entirety:

Gaining Momentum with Tesla Powerpack

Ahead of tomorrow’s solar roof and Powerwall announcement, we wanted to provide some exciting updates on our commercial and utility energy product, Tesla Powerpack.

Powerpack Installation

First Powerpack “Grid-scale” Installation in Asia/Pacific was recent put into service in New Zealand (details/video)

This September we began shipping version 2 of our Powerpack system. With a new energy module and power electronics, Powerpack 2 provides twice the energy density and a more seamless integration into multiple levels of the grid. Powerpack 2 is also now matched with a new inverter, designed by Tesla and manufactured at the Gigafactory. It is the lowest cost, highest efficiency and highest power density utility-scale inverter on the market. It also significantly simplifies the installation process of the entire Powerpack system by integrating a number of previously independent components into the inverter itself.

The Tesla inverter paired with the Powerpack 2 allows storage to be available to the utility industry at price points and with functionality previously unknown. The combined system is now a cost-competitive alternative to other traditional utility infrastructure solutions such as building larger substations, bigger wires and more power plants. Furthermore, the Powerpack system interface and software controls give utilities and grid operators high fidelity control, allowing for better energy management and dispatch, which improves grid performance, efficiency and reliability at a low cost.

The benefits of this pairing are already being seen in projects such as Southern California Edison’s Mira Loma substation and the Kauai Island Utility Cooperative. The Powerpack systems for these two projects are being built now at our Gigafactory and, when deployed later this year, will be the two largest lithium ion battery storage installations in the world.

And this is just the beginning. To date, nearly 300 MWh of Tesla batteries have been deployed in 18 countries, and we anticipate the impact and growth rate of energy products around the world to be far greater than that of electric vehicles alone. As we continue to innovate, scale and reduce costs of commercial and grid-scale systems, we will significantly accelerate the adoption of renewable energy sources to power our world, ultimately getting us to 100% renewable energy grids.

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32 responses to "New Tesla Powerpack 2 “Provides Twice The Energy Density”, Shipping Now"

  1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

    Who cares about energy density for stationary storage? Tell us the price.

    1. ClarksonCote says:

      In most cases, energy density increases usually also translates to cost savings per unit energy delivered.

      1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

        Not necessary really. It varies. You may just switch to different chemistry and get improved density, but increased cost.

    2. speculawyer says:

      Yes and no.

      As ClarksonCote points out, increased energy density can help lower the price because you are physically using less raw materials.

      And it reduces shipping costs (OK not a big deal).

      But Li-Ions just are much better than lead-acid because of their cycle life and better ability to discharge deeply. And less maintenance.

  2. Kdawg says:

    I’d like to see (at least 1 prototype) of a Tesla version of a solar powered Supercharger. So put up a large Solar City canopy, connect it to a bunch of PowerPacks, and see if you can charge Teslas daily without a grid-tie.

    1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

      You can, no problem.

      You will need just 40 PowerPacks that can provide 1,000 kW for 4 hour duration (4000 kWh)
      https://www.tesla.com/powerpack/design
      Who cares about that meaningless $2,000,000 price tag, in perfect future as show to us by Great Leader Saint Ellon money is not an issue.
      Actually 4 hours is way too little, you would need at least 40 hours. Multiply the numbers by 10.
      Solar panels cost just too little in comparison to bother to count them.

      Well, in this imperfect world under control by Big Oil conspiracy, you may just use cheap diesel generators as Tesla does at peak times when grid connection can’t cope:
      https://forums.tesla.com/forum/forums/telass-harris-ranch-supercharger-trolled
      But it is just temporary measure to ensure bright future under the rule of our Great Leader Saint Elon the Greatest Liberator! Send all your money to him right now!

      1. ClarksonCote says:

        So you’re assuming such a design needs to charge 40 100kWh Teslas in a 4 hours?

        That seems a bit excessive, don’t you think?

        1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

          Typical supercharger station may have some 8 stalls or around it. 1000 kW that 40 powerpacks can output is just barely enough for 8 x 125 kW stalls. You may need more at times as chargers are not 100% efficient. Reducing number of stalls is not really an option, as single car may spend some 30-60 minutes charging unlike 2-5 minute refueling.

          This is just back of envelope calculation to show how unrealistic it is, few percents here or there don’t change the outcome. No, it wasn’t me who requested this grand “battery charges battery” project.

          If you think supercharger stations can’t be full, just check San Francisco Bay area. They are overcrowded by charging Teslas all the time.

          1. MorinMoss says:

            You’re overlooking the fact that cars charge throughout the day & the pricing varies quite a bit. Solar is particularly useful during times when grid power is high and non-productive when prices are low.
            Now that Tesla intends to start charging cars delivered after Q1 2017 for using the SuperChargers, panels & batteries at busy chargers will soon make financial sense.

      2. Kdawg says:

        I don’t want to see this prototype in a major city center in CA where there are charging lines. I’m thinking like one in a remote destination in AZ, just off the freeway somewhere between 2 major cities.

      3. Ahldor says:

        Do you have any clue about how the grid works? You call backup diesel generator cheap energy?? Man you really dont have a clue. Your estimation about needed battery capacity at SC is also off by an order of magnitude, because you are just lost in this matter.

        1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

          I have some limited clue how grid works. Obviously you don’t, if you think underground power lines are made from rubber and you can just pump another megawatt out of them just by whim, without spending months and millions for upgrades, and you are lucky if upgrades are not needed all the way to power plant.

          Driving up with diesel generator at peak times as Tesla was probably doing is just many times cheaper.

          1. Ahldor says:

            I never said the grid is cheap to build. It cost alot of money to build. But what makes the grid much more expensive is making it so that it wont collapse as the power generation and power demand are changing relative to each other all the time. This is where batteries as stationary storage starts to make sense. Because backup power is ALWAYS expensive, hence being backup power.

            If only a few percent of the top demand power could be cut off using batteries, millions of USD would be saved in less need for back up power and less need for grid regulation. Basically a relatively small amount of batteries can save the society a whole lot of money. The biggest winners will be the grid users.

            1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

              Right.

              The cost/benefit analysis for using battery storage for grid stabilization and peak shaving is much, much better than trying to use it for bulk storage.

              That means you only need enough storage capacity for a few minutes, not for hours or days.

              Prices for batteries are going to have to come down quite a bit before we see utilities starting to use them for, say, storing energy from solar farms overnight. But using large battery packs for grid stabilization and peak shaving is cost-competitive right now, in many if not most markets.

      4. Paul Smith says:

        Well, leaving your deep hatred and jealousy aside, there is no proof in the video that was happening, and nobody tried to find ou the truth, and this is one instance. Maybe the grid was down, maybe the store was undergoing renovations, who knows. You sure don’t.

      5. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        zzzzzzzzzz said:

        “…in perfect future as show to us by Great Leader Saint Ellon”

        More smoke signals from the Cult of Elon Musk Haters… or is that steam coming out of his ears? LOL!

        You’d think someone this jealous of Elon would at least know how to spell his name! 🙄

    2. speculawyer says:

      Meh. Not worth spending the money on those batteries. Install superchargers and install a big solar PV canopy but let the grid do its job of balancing the electricity needs instead of using a battery.

      The only sensible reason for a battery would be if the AC connection isn’t enough to power all the superchargers simultaneously or to avoid demand charges.

      1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

        People running grid are not idiots and don’t like provide balancing for free. They have all kind of payment plans for reserve power generators and pay them monthly for sitting and doing nothing, and just being ready to power up you generator on demand. It may be even diesel generators like in UK. Cost of capital makes more difference here than fuel cost.

        They have demand charges for such smarties and it is not news for industrial customers who may pay around half of the bill in demand charges. Netmetering in the US just entrenched some completely distorted ideas how grid works into people minds.

    3. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      Kdawg said:

      “I’d like to see (at least 1 prototype) of a Tesla version of a solar powered Supercharger. So put up a large Solar City canopy, connect it to a bunch of PowerPacks, and see if you can charge Teslas daily without a grid-tie.”

      The problem is that you need a solar farm — not just a canopy — about the size of one or two football fields, to power a single Supercharger. Of course, if you have battery packs to store the power, you can get away with a smaller solar farm… but then you are limited to a smaller number of cars you can charge per day.

      In most areas, it won’t be practical to power a Supercharger station with on-site solar panels. You would want to put your solar farm where land is very cheap, probably far away from the highway. If you set up a system using only a solar canopy for power as a demo, I doubt it would take long before people realized that it was out of service most of the time, due to having insufficient stored energy to fully charge a pack. If it was a motel, the “NO VACANCY” sign would be lit most of the time.

      Things would be even worse on cloudy days.

      1. MorinMoss says:

        One advantage of a solar canopy, especially in hot, sunny places is you get free shading along with whatever power is generated, even if it’s not enough to offset what you’re drawing from the grid.
        About half of the Lower48 is hot & sunny for most of the year.

  3. DJ says:

    So when are the power walls getting the same upgrade?

  4. realist says:

    Musk quoted here from the May 2015 Shareholder Conference Call:

    “The response has been overwhelming, okay, like crazy. In the course of like less than a week, we’ve had 38,000 reservations for the Powerwall, 2,500 reservations for Powerpack. The Powerpack, it should be noted, typically this is bought by utilities or large industrial companies for heavy industrial work. So, typically Powerpack, it’s like at least 10 Powerpacks per installation. So if there’s 2,500 reservations, actually 25,000 Powerpacks.
    Powerwall also we suspect is probably an average of number of Powerpacks, it’s probably 1.5 to 2 per installation. So, 38,000 reservations is more, like 50,000 or 60,000 actual Powerwalls.
    So, I mean, there’s, like, no way that we could possibly satisfy this demand this year and we’re basically like sold out through the middle of next year in the first week. It was just crazy. We had 2,500 requests from companies that want to distribute and install the Powerwall and Powerpack. We can’t even respond to them. We have to, like, triage our response to those who want to be a distributor.
    So, it’s like crazy off the hook. Yeah. And it seems to have gone super viral.”

    Oddly, this huge “backlog” hasn’t materialized, and except in response to questions there was no mention of Tesla Energy at either the 2016Q2 or Q3 conferences. Musk was just babbling.

    Total storage battery revenue was immaterial from May of 2015 through today (if the actual Q3 storage battery sales are reported in the 10Q then I’ll come back here to acknowledge I was wrong, but I doubt I’ll have to do this).

    The same author of this article stated in 2015 that “Tesla Powerwall Sold Out Through Mid 2016”, when in fact nothing of the sort was true.

    I’m not saying the author was intending deceit. I am saying that nobody typing up another pro-Tesla insideevs article stops to analyze what’s been said by the company and whether it makes sense. Musk was just making it up on the spot with that Powerwall assertion in 2015 but you bought it. Much of the present storage battery promo from Tesla may be no different: all hot air.

    1. Kdawg says:

      “Oddly, this huge “backlog” hasn’t materialized”
      ———–

      Well reservations don’t equal revenue. When did Tesla first actually start delivering Powerwalls? What is the actual data of units sold/delivered? All I could find was 2,500 sold in the first quarter of 2016.

    2. speculawyer says:

      As I’ve said many times, I think the initial PowerWall/PowerPack announcement was just a dog & pony show meant to assuage investors that spending huge amounts of money on a gigafactory was a good idea and not a white elephant. Many people worried that they would build it and then lack sufficient demand for batteries. This helped show that they additional demand beyond just for their cars.

      1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        But unfortunately, it didn’t actually show demand. It only showed interest. The people showing interest were not paying earnest money for a reservation, like those reserving a Model ≡; they were just clicking on a website.

        Elon’s characterization there about the demand being so high they couldn’t handle the orders… well, to put it kindly, that seems to be 99 & 44/100% hype.

        My reading of the situation (Note: Opinion, not fact) is that interest dropped radically when the actual retail cost turned out to be considerably higher than the wholesale cost Tesla initially quoted.

        1. MorinMoss says:

          “Elon’s characterization there about the demand being so high they couldn’t handle the orders… well, to put it kindly, that seems to be 99 & 44/100% hype”

          And I wish he’d stop doing that; makes him sound like a huckster & con artist.
          It’s fine to say there’s lot of interest but if no one’s putting down cash, it’s nothing more than free publicity.
          I read tons of car news & have gone to some shows – but I haven’t owned a car in over a decade.
          I go to home & building shows & found a quiet place at work to watch the Tesla solar tile reveal – but haven’t owned the roof over my head in 20 years.

    3. viktor says:

      Sure, Tesla haven’t said mush about the powerpacks and powerwalls but if they now have deliver nearly 300 MWh it means 3 000 powerpacks or 46 000 powerwalls. Of course the deliveries is a compilations of powerwalls and powerpack but exactly how this is I don’t know. In the summer it was reported that a lot of powerwalls was spoted in Germany and they have bean delivered to a lot of other countries to https://electrek.co/2016/08/30/tesla-powerwalls-are-being-delivered-in-volume-in-germany/

  5. speculawyer says:

    Hopefully the Gigafactory will push the prices of these down. Then they should install these at islands all over the world so they can run on wind, solar PV, and use the battery as back-up for times of wind and sun shortages.

    Islands generally generate power with diesel and that is VERY expensive, dirty, and carbon intensive. Combine this pack with solar PV AND wind (preferably both onshore and offshore) such that islands can slash their diesel burning.

    1. Ocean Railroader says:

      Here is a 65 megawatt heavy fuel power plant in Jamaica http://www.jamenergy.com/index.php/projects/kingston Haiti also and https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electricity_sector_in_Haiti

      I personally would rather see the fuel go towards a cruise ship.

  6. Tyl says:

    Here’s what jumps out at me, a single family home owner.

    Power pack 2 provides twice the energy density and a more seamless integration into multiple levels of the grid.

    more seamless integration

    into multiple levels

    Am I one of those multiple levels?

    Will power packs soon become available for single family homes? (we’ll need about 200kWh of storage with two Tesla MS’S & all the regular home power needs)

    Solar + PowerPack = off grid?

    We’ll find out more tonight!!

  7. Jason says:

    Twice the density based on what measure? Doubt the power grid battery is the same that they use in their cars, but great if that is the case.

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