In Attempt To Boost Sales, Tesla Offers Up To $30,000 Discount On Inventory S/X, 0.99% APR

2 weeks ago by Eric Loveday 136

P100D Badge – Deal Applies To Model S P100D And Model X P100D Only

Tesla is attempting to boost end-of-quarter sales with such deals as $30,000 off select inventory vehicles and 0.99% APR.

In typical Tesla fashion, the automaker is attempting a last-minute push to get sales on target for Q3 2017.

Tesla

The Tesla Model S P100D

This time around, Tesla is offering some very enticing deals, which leads us to believe one of two things:

  • that the Model 3 is indeed maybe cutting into Model S/X sales in the United States, or,
  • at the very least that production of the 3 has made it more difficult for Tesla to deliver custom order Model S/X cars in this quarter before September 30th.

Since most Model 3 orders won’t be delivered anytime soon and especially not by the end of the quarter, Tesla is likely feeling the heat of expectations as the quarter comes to a close (end of September).

The automaker is stepping up its incentives to buy certain models with deals we’ve never seen before. AmpedRealtor posted this email outlining the deals from a Tesla sales associate over on the Tesla Motors Club Forum:

Hi [AmpedRealtor],

I hope this email finds you well.

I’m reaching out because we just announced an incentive on Model S and Model X P100D that I thought you may be interested in.

We are offering showroom incentives up to $30,000 off the original configuration price. This means you can lease Model S P100D for $1,500/month and Model X P100D for $1,600/month with 10,000 miles per year. Alternatively we are offering .99% APR financing or a cash purchase with the discount. These incentives are available for deliveries by September 30th 2017.

Lastly, we’ve reintroduced the Tesla Referral Program. You will receive a $1,000 credit towards the purchase of either a new Model S or Model X and Free Unlimited Supercharging.

It would be my pleasure to help you explore the options for a new Model S or Model X. If you are interested we can schedule a time for a call or if it is more convenient we can communicate via email.

The up to $30,000 deal applies only to inventory Teslas (maybe only demo cars) and only the highest end versions, those being the Model S P100D and Model X P100D. We should point out that the wording specifically says “up to” $30,000 off. We assume the max discount would only apply to demo cars with higher mileage (a few thousand miles or so). But still, if you’re in the market for a top-spec Tesla on discount, now’s clearly the time to buy.

A couple examples of eligible Teslas are posted below. You can check more new inventory vehicles here. Additionally, there’s an exceptional Tesla deal-tracking site here with listings from all around the country.

Tesla Model S Inventory Listing

Tesla Model X Inventory Listing

Source: Tesla Motors Club Forum via Electrek

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136 responses to "In Attempt To Boost Sales, Tesla Offers Up To $30,000 Discount On Inventory S/X, 0.99% APR"

  1. Clive says:

    Wow… That’s free money.

    Cannot fathom what that will do to resale values.

    1. JakeY says:

      Almost Nothing? These are inventory cars and the discounts are proportional to the condition.

      It’s not a general discount on the model itself (which would affect resale values a bit). The general price drop on the 100D and P100D would have a bigger effect, although those drops are relative modest.

      1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        Yeah, I think you’re probably right. As the article says, that steep discount may apply only to demo units, and perhaps only to the oldest of those at that.

        Perhaps this is nothing but yet another sensationalist headline regarding a “nothing” issue.

    2. pjwood1 says:

      If you anyone thinks “30k” applies to a base level 75 Model S, I have sad news. The images posted are ~130-150k cars.

      The other companies are doing so poorly, you see television ads and still they aren’t selling. Imagine if Tesla did that? Then, wait times would go back up to 6 months.

      1. Elooney Muskey says:

        Thanks for the laughs. These are hilarious.

        There was a line to buy these cars, because as you all say, Tesla sells every car it makes. But Tesla decided to hold back these cars and age them for 1-2 years or sometimes few months, so they can stick an “inventory” label on them, and sell them at $30k discount later.

        What a disruptive idea! Having their own stores does help them in this grand new scheme of losing more money. A dealer could never have come up with such brilliant ideas. “Hey, why don’t I hold these 2017 models for 2 years, hide them someplace and maintain them, then sell them in 2020 as ‘aged’ discounted inventory”, said no dealer.

        1. Mint says:

          Are you really so dense as to think these cars were simply sitting around doing nothing?

          They’re demo/showroom cars. You think they should run their stores without any cars instead?

          Where talking about a total of 34 cars in the US (mostly P100D X’s) with discounts over $25k, and another ~50 with $10k-20k discounts. That’s not even half a percent of a quarter’s sales.

          1. Elooney Muskey says:

            Are you really as big an idiot as I am thinking? Do you think dealerships run without showrooms?
            Are you really a fool to think that these are the only ones at big discounts? There are hundreds and thousands more. You just need to ask. This smoke and mirros game works only on fools like you.

            1. Nix says:

              There currently are only 7 Model S cars with discounts between 15K and 30K. The rest of the 200 Model S cars have $1K to $12K discounts, with 150 having $2K or less in discounts.

              There are only 50 Model X SUV’s with discounts between 15K and 35K. The rest of the 300 Model X SUV’s have $3K to $13K in discounts, with 200 having a discount of $4k or less.

              By far the vast majority of cars have $1-4K in discounts. So pretty much everything you ranted about is proven absolutely false by just looking at the cold hard numbers

              https://ev-cpo.com/classic/

              1. Mystery says:

                That’s a crapload of unsold Model S & X, hence it’s clear we are well past Peak Model S & X. Why don’t you track how fast those 500+ are sold, to real end user customers and when?

                1. Nix says:

                  That is a very small number of unsold cars. Tesla is on track to sell 100,000 cars globally, and there are 1,000 new inventory cars in all their locations around the world.

                  100,000
                  vs
                  1,000

                  That’s 1% of global sales in inventory. That is just 3 and a half DAYS worth of inventory! Please name ANY car company with 100K yearly sales with just 3.5 days of inventory.

                  Standard for the industry for GOOD sales is nearly 20 times larger, at 60 day’s worth of supply. Currently the industry average is 74 days. If Tesla were simply average, they would have to have over 20,000 cars in inventory to have a 74 day supply of cars. They have 1,000.

                  https://www.cnbc.com/2017/09/01/labor-day-car-deals-abound-as-dealers-seek-to-unload-inventory.html

                  Do you know who has a lot of cars on the lot? That would be the Chevy Spark, with 11K cars on the lot and just 750 sold in July. IF they ceased Spark production completely between now and the end of 2018, they would STILL have inventory on the lot. With them going back into production (according to rumors) their days on lot supply is measured in years, not months, weeks, or days. It is crazy. And the Bolt shares an assembly line with the Spark. Not a good situation.

                  1. Dav8or says:

                    Hey expert on all things automotive- The Bolt does not share an assembly plant, or line with the Spark. It is shared with the Sonic. I know, they both begin with an S, so it’s confusing and all, but still…

                    If you’re going to spout off and bad mouth all things not Tesla, do a little checking first.

                    1. Nix says:

                      Dav8or, you are correct, I did make a mistake at the very end of my post. My bad. Thank you for the correction!

                      Anybody reading my previous post above, please disregard the part that said:

                      “And the Bolt shares an assembly line with the Spark.”

                      This statement was clearly false.

                      ___________________________________________

                      With that said, I still stand by the rest of my entire post, and my main point of my post still stands.

                      By any measure of industry standards, Tesla’s inventory level is incredibly low. Especially when compared to some of the worst performers currently in the industry, like the Chevy Spark that is off the charts, and the Chevy Impala who is also at the bottom of the pack with 190 days of supply.

                2. ffbj says:

                  Well, they did not shut down production for 3 weeks this Summer, like just about everyone else did.

                  When Chevy is discountinuing models left and right, has over 100 days of inventory, well that’s no biggie. Tesla has some excess inventory cars from demos & showrooms, it’s over for Tesla.

            2. Paul Smith says:

              Bought short huh? Heeheehee.

            3. Get Real says:

              The E-lunatic troll strikes again by babbling unintelligible anti-Tesla FUD on inside Evs!

              Meanwhile Tesla and most people keep moving forward.

            4. Mint says:

              Well, I guess you really are that dense.

              Show evidence of these “thousands” of Teslas at big discounts. I know you won’t, because it doesn’t exist.

              FYI, I couldn’t care less what you think of me.

    3. FISHEV says:

      It’s only for the P100’s for which Tesla is likely finding less demand. Losing range for a, literally ludicrous, acceleration boost alway went against the basic market of EV, to cut emissions as much as possible and be energy efficient.

      So it doesn’t look like the P100’s stacking up is related to the Model 3 sales especially since the AWD won’t be available until late 2018.

  2. Tom says:

    Model S sales continue to fall. That deterioration is likely accelerating.

    1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      Tell us again, Tom, how you’re actually a supporter of Tesla and not a serial Tesla bashing troll.

      We should believe you, and not our own eyes, right? 🙄

      1. Tom says:

        I could bore you with the math but you can’t do it and won’t believe facts. You’d prefer to just bully people and devalue electric cars. However I offer you an exercise. Go click on the big orange linky thing at the top of this page that has the monthly scorecard. Add months Jan through Aug for the Model S for 2017. Then do the same for 2016. Year over year sales are down not just for August to August (a single month can be flukes) but year to year for the whole year. This is also true worldwide if you care to look. But you won’t. But let me help. In the US Model S sales peaked in Q3 of 2016. The last 4 quarters are the following according to this forum’s scorecard:
        Q3 2016—-9156
        Q4 2016—-7650
        Q1 2017—-6100
        Q2 2017—-5095

        So is it constrained production? Lost cars in the mail? Or perhaps there rather remarkable 25% market share in their luxury segment is just about all a reasonable person can expect? Is it seasonal with tax credit bumps? Well previous years had that happen Q4. Well stuck in the mail? Then wouldn’t the roll over quarter be better?

        As I’ve stated before, There’s ample reason to see that worldwide sales overall for Tesla are hanging around 25,000 +/- per quarter and that there appears to be a general shift to higher end S models and of course Model X but that there’s a question regarding whether this shift in sales is demand driven or production constrained. Tesla used to say they had about 100,000 in capacity for production but it’s not clear if that’s still the case. I have no reference for that assertion however. A reasonable manufacturer would in the situation of constrained production remove lower end models. So a shift to X and high end S would make sense there.

        It’s also important to understand those 4 quarters in the context of worldwide sales and other hiccups. But I think if you take the time to look you’ll see worldwide there’s a similar trend. Approximately steady overall sales of S and X with a shift to X and S reducing.

        Now then about your repeated comment methodology. I’ll suggest again that perhaps you could find some kind of reason or logic to include in your attacks. Something. Anything. Generally on these kinds of things when people give short TROLL!!@#@ rebuttals they given because of a finite set of situations. 1. They are dumb/illiterate. 2. perhaps mentally ill or some other malady or trapped in some kind of delusional cult worship. 3. Perhaps they own stock in the company and have a vested interest. The latter has been asserted about you by others on this forum. However that makes no logical sense. If you did then you’d really believe in the long term prospects of the company and stock and not resort to the daily minutia of trying to bully people on the internet. So that explanation is kind of flawed unless it’s accompanied by option 2. Option 1 is ludicrous since you’ve posted logical comments in certain situations as long as others bow to your rather weak insecurities and Trumpian distaste of all facts that are outside your self aggrandization issues. That really only leaves option 2 which leads me to believe you are really just an alt of Donald Trump since you have exhibited a sense of attack in every direction not 100% in your agreement as ‘fake news’ and idiots and trolls and FUD and whatever method of bullying you can muster. But you cannot do it to me. You’ve likely chased off hundreds of readers, caused irreparable financial harm to the operators of this medium, and done damage to EVs by perpetuating the blind cult persona that is such an easy target to those opposed.

        But at least you got off a ‘TROLL!!@#@ FUD@#$!!! comment or two. So you got that going for you, which is nice.

        1. Nix says:

          Are you seriously crying like a little baby about Tesla UPSELLING customers into more expensive Model X sales?

          Do you have any clue about how the automotive industry works? Upsales are a HUGE POSITIVE for any car company!!!

          Putting buyers who would have previously bought the less expensive Model S into X’s is a massive win for Tesla. This is why you are, and will always be a loser troll. You mistake a massive success for failure.

        2. bro1999 says:

          Damn, PP just got PWNED.

          1. Get Real says:

            Tell us again bro troll, how many Bolts is GM selling out of the US???

          2. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

            ROTFL!!
            😆 😆 😆

            Maybe on whatever planet you live on, that’s true. Thankfully that has no impact on reality.

        3. Tech01x says:

          What BS.

          You do know that Model S and Model X are assembled on the same general assembly line, right? A production slot can be either a Model S or a Model X… so talking about the “peak” of Model S is nonsense.

          Further, InsideEVs only counts U.S. deliveries. Tesla delivers to the world. So when one looks at total units, the first half of 2017 is 60% higher than first half 2016.

          And the Model S is the #1 selling plug-in vehicle in the U.S. and there is still a 3rd month of a quarter to go. Maybe you should look at the data again. The first two months of Q3 is running substantially higher than the first two months of Q1 and Q2. Now, the battery pack situation likely explains this… which means the Q2 delays is showing up as higher deliveries in Q3, pushing the 1st two months of a quarter to very high numbers. It is similar to Q2/Q3 last year, but last year’s effect was bigger as the factory was still ramping the Model X from a much lower production rate.

          1. Tom says:

            Perhaps you’d like to see the worldwide sales figures where in fact the Model S peaked in Q4 2015 rather than 2016. I was being kind so as to offer easy reference. As stated, 25,000 per quarter appears to be about the run rate for their manufacturing capability. If it were me, and I could sell an X instead of an S I’d do that and shift that production away from S. But I don’t know what the constraints are. Demand or supply. Hard to believe supply if in fact there are inventory vehicles at all.

            But here’s a simple worldwide sales graph for the numerically inclined. The rest of the posters in this forum I suppose will resort to option 2 above.

            Will they be able to pull off a big Q3 worldwide? I don’t know. I would think maintaining this level of sales would be considered a great success in the light of decreased sales from all their competition. It would still amount to an increase in market share. But it isn’t reasonable to simply deny basic numbers that have been widely available and published. Well not here they haven’t been discussed because PP and his cohort would rather resort to option 2 and try to scream fake news from their Trumpistan tower of small egos.
            https://seekingalpha.com/article/4086094-tesla-q217-delivery-recap-raising-2017-delivery-estimate

          2. Mystery says:

            Congrats, you win as sucker of most koolaid into the TSLA ‘reality distortion field’

        4. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

          The troll known as “Tom” posted more FUD:

          “The last 4 quarters are the following according to this forum’s scorecard:
          Q3 2016—-9156
          Q4 2016—-7650
          Q1 2017—-6100
          Q2 2017—-5095”

          Tom, rarely have I ever seen a more perfect example of the adage “Figures don’t lie, but liars do figure.”

          I’ve spent enough time wading thru the sewer over at Seeking Alpha to be able to spot one of the typical Tesla basher FUD B.S. claims.

          Auto sales are highly seasonal. Trolls like you can always pull out sales figures for 4 quarters which falsely make it look like sales are declining, for very nearly every model of car. I guess you were hoping I wouldn’t know that, huh?

          Here are the relevant figures, which Tesla haters like you hate, absolutely HATE to see posted:

          Tesla’s annual automobile sales totals:
          2012: 2650
          2013: 22,300
          2014: 31,655 (+41.95%)
          2015: 50,580 (+59.8%)
          2016: 76,230 (+50.7%)

          1. Mystery says:

            Tom is definitely right about you. You bait & switch deflect worse than DJT, and try to pull the wool over people’s eyes to push your TSLA like the Musk maid you are.
            You are too illiterate to do simple Math so why don’t you ask a 1st grader to help you or the insideEVs staff to add their Model S and X figures YoY and YTD. Model S is Down over 10% for the Whole year, and Down 20% Aug. There is Zero accountability regarding the Non US figures out of the claimed Tesla quarterly number, Because they refuse to Tally By Each Intl country for Real End User Customer registrations leaving them Room they need to Pump up the Vague overall sales numbers to show quarterly growth. That’s not going to happen this Q3 unless there is some ‘Voodoo’ smokescreen. So they can stop with the ridiculous claims that Model S & X has not hit Peak, because they are on a downward slope as shown by InsideEVs USA verification.
            You keep trying to obscure and cling to the Only thing that still shows Model S & X growth which was Ovwrall tesla-claimed (not InsideEVs USA-verified) Jan 2015 -Dec 2015 vs. Jan 2016 – Dec 2016. Which is 18 freaking months behind. And avoid Tom & InsideEV’s factual proof.
            So actually you do fall in Tom’s #1 classification (Dumb & Dumber)

    2. CDAVIS says:

      @Tom said ” Model S sales continue to fall. That deterioration is likely accelerating.”
      ———-

      Wrong… the opposite is true:

      “…Tesla (Nasdaq:TSLA) delivered just over 22,000 vehicles in Q2, of which just over 12,000 were Model S and just over 10,000 were Model X. This represents a 53% increase over Q2 2016…”

      source: http://insideevs.com/tesla-reports-q2-sales-22000/

      1. Get Real says:

        OOPS, Tom the anti-Tesla troll, the Mystery troll and Jd for that matter just got slammed….by none other then by the InsideEvs Tesla sales scorecard!

        You have to wonder why all these anti-Tesla troll new usernmames are suddenly carpet bombing the Tesla threads here and over on other pro-Ev websites like Electrek.

        They must be getting pretty desperate to stop the progress of EVs and Tesla in particular as the floodgates start to open.

        I wonder if they are fossil fuel or Ice industry shills or just loser shorters?

        Of course its also possible they are the same troll posting under multiple usernames as a classic FUD tactic.

        1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

          The anti-Tesla trolls are very upset about how well the Model 3 rollout is doing, because that absolutely cuts the legs out from the mantra they chant about how Tesla is in trouble and will collapse any day now.

          Go Tesla!

          1. Mystery says:

            Again, trying to Pull the Wool over the sheeple koolaid drinkers’ eyes. What rollout are you talking about ~105 cars to employees who are Silence of the Lambs armor-mouthshut-mask balls-cut-off to ever speak a bad word about anything on their alpha Model 3s. Or do you claim 200%+ exponential growth from 30 to 75, means that will continue to infinity forever, as you seem to assume for almost 5-year old Model S.
            Let the Model 3 success or failure play out openly and transparently, hopefully to Tesla’s benefit, without your / Musk weasel misdirection & your ridiculous sissified cheerleading

    3. William Edwards says:

      I would like to suggest that any fewer number of sales for the Model S or X may have more to do with a new model arriving than anything else. Much like several of my coworkers who have been planning on getting a new Android handset…they keep looking at the rumor mills of what is coming and keep delaying their purchases. Once the phones start shipping and there are helpful reviews by people who are in the know, then the pull the trigger.

  3. Bill Howland says:

    Not that I’m in the market for a car right now (2 ev’s is adequate for me) – I didn’t see any rhyme or reason for one car having a $30,100 discount, and then a more expensive ($141,000) car having a $6,500 discount.

    1. georgeS says:

      @Bill H.
      If I remember correctly you bought one of the original Tesla Roadsters. Yes?

      A 130 grand P100D for 100 sounds good if one had the money. Count me out.

      I still say a used 90D in 1 or 2 years will be the best used CPO buy out there.

      285 miles range , 4.4 0-60 and AP1….and that’s the “non P” version.

      They will be 50 K in a year or 2.

      I’m not sure I can trade down to M3.

      1. Bill Howland says:

        georgeS: Yes. You have a point, but in my mind the most value item in a TESLA is the WARRANTY. I wouldn’t want to buy a Tesla without a NEW CAR WARRANTY.

        1. John says:

          So let’s do quick math-

          $100k for a new car with warranty, or $50k for a CPO car without a warranty. That’s a pretty expensive warranty. You can replace 2 batteries for the cost of the warranty…

          (By the way, do you know why dealers of every product ever made try and sell you a warranty? Answer- because the house always wins…)

          1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

            Correct me if I’m wrong, but every single Tesla CPO car comes with a limited warranty.

            Yes, you can buy a used Tesla without a warranty; just not thru Tesla’s CPO program.

          2. Bill Howland says:

            John – you have your opinion, and I have mine. Since I am already an experienced Tesla purchaser, I’ll stick to mine.

  4. John Ray says:

    I’ve been watching these deals for awhile. With this much of a discount and a decent money factor and residual plus the federal tax credit you should should be able to get a lease for well south of $1,000. Curse GA and our stupid lease laws.

    1. Elooney Muskey says:

      Yeah, riding on taxpayers’ back while driving a $1000 a month Tesla was fun while it lasted.

      1. John Ray says:

        Don’t hate the player, hate the game.

      2. Big Solar says:

        lets drop the EV tax credit and also at the same time drop oil subsidies and see what happens then.

        1. Mark.ca says:

          What happens is loony will be out of his job. I hear when oil starts to make the cuts, the paid trolls go first.

      3. John says:

        I always love this argument. Selectively choose who you’re gonna ding an entity for using tax breaks and subsidies (while writing off your mortgage interest and taking child tax credits). Big Oil has been sucking off the subsidy tit since before you were born.

        I live in Reno, a rising tide lifts all boats. We have the Gigafactory here now, my house value has gone up 30% this year alone, along with all the haters’ homes in the area. The ROI for the $1.5 billion spread out over the next 20 years for Tesla will likely quadruple that cost in the form of local business success, home values, increased sales and property tax revenue, and job creation.

        Nice attempt, though. (but not really..)

        1. ffbj says:

          It’s really one of the arguments of desperation, along with, evs pollute more.
          In a way it’s encouraging since it shows how worried legacy companies really are.
          They’re so pitiful, and by extension so are those that so slavishly support them.

  5. Carmi Turchick says:

    What this looks like to me is that they are clearing out the demo fleet that had the previous generation autonomous chips and replacing them with cars that have the “2.5” version, likely because there will be a significant performance difference with their next big software update.

    I do not see the Model 3 eating much into the highest end S and especially X sales, these people can probably buy both. Some of the people looking at the Model S 75D may decide they want the smaller but fully upgraded Model 3 that will price out about the same instead (the dual motor P version coming in about six months). I probably would too since it will have better acceleration, handling, range…and I would not need a larger car. Especially if I could only stretch to $70,000 and that meant no autonomous on the Model S but yes, autonomous capability on the Model 3…

    1. Mystery says:

      It’s nice to have so-called “1st world probs”, vs SE Texas disaster, etc.. Reality is everyone who wanted a Model S or X has already bought one (Waiting List = 0), that’s why the FireSale to prevent disasterous Perfect Storm Q3 conf call (downward slope from Peak Model S & X from here) and undisclosed production / quality Model 3 issues (as would be normal for new release). Real value is how quickly that Model 3 Reservation List (which does not translate into Actual orders – as how quickly Model X list reached 0) dwindles.

      As for “3rd world problems”, almost everyone who wants / needs a car has one, except maybe in SE Texas (don’t think a 6-figure electric car makes much sense there right now).

      Model S & X are luxury niches that have been out there for years, and there’s no Need for replacement cycles like smartphones. Which negates the whole “green tree-hugger” phony smokescreen.

      1. pjwood1 says:

        Cheer up, Mystery. Scott Pruitt is now leading the EPA. That means that no matter what toxins are floating up from the refineries, your first world problems won’t include being kept out of the water.

        1. Artful Dodger says:

          “Drain the Swamp”, indeed. ‘MURKA is on tilt, and dirty MURKY water is FLOODING the swamp. SAD.

          1. ffbj says:

            I think they should change one of their chants
            too: “Build that Sea-Wall!”.

      2. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        As I’ve observed before: It’s not so much that “Mystery” seems to be yet another serial anti-Tesla bashing troll; it’s that he seems to be almost completely disconnected from reality regarding Tesla’s business.

        Zero demand for the Model X? What planet are you living on, dude? YTD U.S.-only sales for the MX are, according to InsideEVs’ estimate, 12,170; not that far below Model S estimated sales of 14,770.

        I’m not going to waste time pointing out all the other errors in your post; there are far too many.

        1. Mystery says:

          As has been clear via all the shady twisting of statements, you can’t apparently read (Waiting List != Sales). Everyone who wants a Model S or X already has one, so the Waiting List is 0 (advertising which Tesla doesn’t do would Not generate 6 months of backlog). Try some math, and insideEVs own figures show USA decline YoY of Over 10% YTD in Model S deliveries, with some increase in Model X, but that’s not going to save their Q3 (due to high Sept 2016). unless there are more smoke and mirrors nonsense (like 1,800 new Reservations per day, which is a joke, when it is right after the Model 3 event), but the poorly educated eat it up, and call $1k Reservations as Orders.

          1. Stimpacker says:

            So not true.
            My friend just ordered a well optioned Model X and was given a waiting period of 8 months.
            Quite surprising.

            1. Mystery says:

              Well, that sucks for your friend. A sample size of one (would qualify as poorly educated). Did you read the headline of This Article? Why don’t you read the desperation and goosing for virtual referral sales in the email text? OR better call your local Tesla salesperson, like I have. Waiting List equals 0, otherwise Tesla would be touting this fact. They will be lucky to flatline keep Model X sales constant YoY.
              It’s all on Model 3 demand and delivery, and how long it takes to Model 3 Waiting List = 0.

              1. Stimpacker says:

                So what did you learn from your local Tesla salesperson?

                Why would any company delay the sale of a high tiered product intentionally? So easy for you to dismiss. You need to go back to elementary school.

                Funny, you can twist anything to bash Tesla.

                One car on fire means electric cars are bad.
                One car crash on autopilot means Tesla is too aggressive in pushing out beta firmware.
                One discount on a fully loaded car means Tesla is desperate.

                Keep trolling.

      3. ffbj says:

        Regarding what you to say about Tesla, well I’m going to disregard that, but you do bring up an interesting question, and that is what is going to happen in TX, in regards to transportation. It’s and interesting and critical question and complex and difficult to address, since there are so many variables.

        I do not hold dim view of Tesla in fact maybe it appears dim because their future is so bright you gotta wear shades.
        https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8qrriKcwvlY

        Actually people might want to look into getting an ev in TX, not a Tesla the less expensive ones. With 500k cars totaled there will be a boost in demand, though that demand may take so time to fully appreciate, as no need for a car if you don’t have a job and no garage or place to park it.

        1. Mystery says:

          Yes, it is an interesting question and glad there can be reasonable discussion about real needs, not “1st world probs”. Yes, EVs may be a good solution, don’t know what happened to Houston superchargers (if any underwater / destroyed / repairable). We will see how many Model3 $1k reservations convert to mass market orders, and how long that lasts until Waiting List = 0. Which should be the primary determinant of TSLA stock price, not Model S & X mystery non-US sales claimed with no independent end user customer verification. enough smoke and mirrors, misdirection.
          Tesla has already succeeded with their rich demographic (just they shouldn’t claim to be “green tree-huggers” if they are going to replace their cars every 1/2/3/4/even 5 years). That’s a phony excuse. Tesla has virtually unlimited access to capital apparently due to track record, Musk’s contacts, and hyperbole, so don’t bet against their technical or engineering. Where they can fail is lack of market reality assessment, international culture/respect/rules, and hubris pride (as they admit with X wing doors etc).

          1. floydboy says:

            They admitted no such damn thing with regard to the doors. The doors were a given from the get go. Musk was referring to the amount of tech they stuck in the car all at once.

  6. kent beuchert says:

    I seriously doubt that Tesla will still be
    producing Model S vehicles much longer – they seem to be following the strategy of upgrading the Model 3 into Model S territory. Besides, the two cars are virtual clones of one another. That leaves the Model X in limbo – it would disappear as well. Besides, Tesla faces a very uphill battle once their 200K unit production mark is hit, which will occur before one full year of Model 3 production – that $7500 govt subsidy goes away, and by then the avalanche of electrics from the world’s automakers hit the road, including BMW’s Model 3 killer – their electric Series 3, with a reported 80kWhr battery and stronger motor. With a $7500 price advantage it will sell VERY well. Tesla also no longer can garner $150 million a year selling zero emissions credits in those few states that have them.

    1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      Is there some sort of anti-Tesla troll network, where they all agree to wait until a specific date to come and make Tesla-hater posts to InsideEVs all at once?

      Nobody who has even watched a video review of of the Model S and the Model 3, let alone taken a test ride/drive in both cars, could possibly think one is merely a clone of the other.

      And, NEWS FLASH! Sales of the Model S have only increased since the final Model 3 reveal! The Model 3 hasn’t reduced demand for the Model S any more than the BMW 3-Series has reduced demand for the BMW 5-Series. In both cases, rather the opposite!

      1. Nix says:

        Yes, there very much is a place the trolls pool their drool before being sent here. Seeking Alpha just ran a story about this with links to both insideev’s (towards the bottom) and elektrek.

        It is no coincidence that we are now knee-deep in utter moronic toxic drool. They followed the slime path directly from this story:

        https://seekingalpha.com/article/4103674-tesla-discounts-piling

        1. Jelloslug says:

          Every gloom and doom article posted on seeking alpha has never managed to come to fruition. You would think people would get tired of being wrong all the time…

          1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

            Yup. During the months I was holding my nose and reading all the (mostly negative) Tesla-related blog posts and the hundreds of daily comments on them over on Seeking Alpha, nothing amazed me more than to see the same anti-Tesla FUDsters repeat the same B.S. on a daily basis, sometimes in dozens or even scores of posts.

            How in the world would anyone think it’s a good return on their time to do that? Surely no matter how much they post, no single FUDster can possible affect Tesla’s stock price by as much as a single penny… so how can that possibly be worth their time?

            I honestly wonder if some of them aren’t paid Big Oil shills. Our own “zzzzzzzzzzz” seems to be, or at least he writes like he is!

        2. Prad Bitt says:

          Of course they are networked. But it is worse than what you can discorer on line. I suggest you lookup “Outfoxed” to have a glimpse of how they are well managed, like a little army against EVs,health and public good.

          1. Nix says:

            Prad, you are absolutely correct. It is much bigger in both organization and scale than just one website. The seeking alpha article just explains the specific timing of their arrival in this specific story today.

            There are a wide range of both coordinated, and uncoordinated attacks against EV’s, and it is no coincidence that their focus is on the fastest growing EV company, and the only volume company that only builds pure EV’s.

  7. Get Real says:

    Dream on all you new trolls/haters/shorters.

    It’s going to be so much fun watching your pin-heads explode over the next 12 months as Tesla builds up to producing hundreds of thousands of Model 3s and continues t have robust sales of S and X cars.

    Why don’t you do everyone a favor and invest the rest of life’s savings into the laggard OEMs and fossil fuel companies.

  8. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

    WOW! That’s a pretty steep discount!

    Seems odd that Tesla would be, apparently, not doing the normal (for Tesla, that is… not normal for other auto makers!) end-of-quarter push last quarter, yet apparently pushing rather desperately this quarter.

    I’m guessing that when Elon said Tesla was “entering production Hell”, he was not joking.

    1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      On second thought… probably not. The steep discount in the headline probably refers to only a few, or a relative few, specific demo units which Tesla wants to phase out in favor of newer models.

      Interesting that over on the Tesla Motors Club forum, they’re talking about rollout of Autopilot Hardware 2.5, and 3.0 is in development. I don’t think there has been a peep about that here on InsideEVs!

      1. unlucky says:

        It’s probably only a few specific cars. That’s how dealers usually do it, right? Advertise huge discounts but most of the vehicles are discounted a lot less.

        But if they didn’t have inventory piling up they wouldn’t have even done this. Now it’s hard to say Model S/X sales aren’t softening.

        1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

          No, it’s easy: Model S/X sales aren’t softening. 😉

          But seriously, Unlucky, unless your definition of “softening” is different than mine, then no, those sales are not softening. What is happening is that Tesla’s production is finally catching up to the demand for Models S/X. Or at least, the amount of demand Tesla can generate without spending the big bucks for TV ads and slick magazine ads.

          Hey! Maybe it’s time for Tesla to put a new model into production. There’s a thought. 😉

    2. BenG says:

      This is in fact an end-of-quarter push. September US sales always jump as Tesla firehoses the US market trying to make their quarterly target.

  9. Bacardi says:

    “Prepare for the worse”, demos will full options such as full autonomy and $4500 upgraded wheels, $4000 rear facing seat, etc…In car dealer speak, that’s most likely how to qualify for $30K off…

  10. Jd says:

    This is funny. All the delusional people who think Tesla can do no wrong… Guys the ship is in trouble. If this model 3 launch doesn’t go perfectly… Your going to be crying in your self driving cars.

    The facts are Tesla burns cash like it’s going out of style. Takes too long to come to market. Did the most expensive thing which is educate a market… And proved a small niche market. The big auto manufacturers sat back… And now that Tesla is going to run out of tax credit they can release cars that are eligible and completely rob Tesla of market share.

    This isn’t chess it’s checkers. All of you smug people thought the big auto manufacturers are dumb… Nope they were waiting for the right moment.

    Tesla can’t turn a profit with cars costing 130k. Tesla can’t turn a profit with have virtually ZERO competition. They have had the segment all to themselves and they have had the most loyal clinetele.

    They will not fare well with true competition from Mercedes eq line Audi’s new electrics and the new Porsche sedans. Also Cummins has beat Tesla to the punch in the truck segment.

    The road ahead is not impossible for Tesla but it’s going to get VERY TOUGH. They have enjoyed easy Street… I know you guys hate Tesla shorter and many of you talk about how people who are shorting it are doing and how people should invest in oil companies… Blah blah blah… But how many of you are going to go spend your life savings on Tesla stock on Tuesday.

    That’s what I thought.

    1. William says:

      Did you ever think to consider that the demographic of Tesla investors that you are referring to, don’t spend their “life savings” on any one given or particular stock? Even if that particular single investment day happens to be on a Tuesday, after a National three day holiday weekend.

      Tesla investors are largely of the institutional variety (59%) , thereby leaving only retail investors (41%), to invest their “life savings” in a one time Tuesday Tesla Trade. Please use your failed Tesla EV investment strategy stereotype, on some other unsuspecting blog, where the Longs do not belong. Seeking Alpha may be a more suitable fit to your blogging investment speed and strategy.

    2. Mister G says:

      Jd, Tesla would be thrilled to have more serious competition in EV market, Tesla knows and has always said that they alone can’t sustain ICE to EV transition, Tesla wants real competition yesterday. But I don’t think Tesla is going to fold because they are a solar energy company, battery company, data company, and tech company all bundled into one.

    3. Nix says:

      Jd drooled “Tesla can’t turn a profit with cars costing 130k.”

      Actually, they can. Tesla has a 25% gross profit margin, EXCLUDING zero-emission vehicle (ZEV) credits. So they absolutely can make money selling a car for 130K.

      For example, VIN 200701 had an original price of $161,500, and has been discounted $28,300 down to $133,200. Ignoring that highly optioned cars have higher gross profit margins, just using Tesla’s average of 25% profit margin, Tesla’s cost is around $120K.

      They are STILL pocketing more than $13K off the deal, PLUS how much ever they sell the ZEV credits for. Lately, that’s been over $6K per car.

      Tesla is likely still clearing over $20k in gross profits including ZEV credits even with $30K in discounts.

      https://www.fool.com/investing/2017/08/07/tesla-inc-lowers-the-price-for-its-model-x.aspx

      Let me guess. You came here from seeking alpha, which explains why you can’t do basic math.

    4. Tech01x says:

      Jd,

      So funny… you wrapped up a bunch of Seeking Alpha delusion in your comment. Let’s see… unable to analyze the business? Check. Ascribing way too much credit for German vaporware? Check. Unable to project the data and trends into the future? Check.

    5. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      “I know you guys hate Tesla shorter and many of you talk about how people who are shorting it are doing…”

      I don’t hate the average Tesla stock shorter. Shorting stocks is an important part of the market, and helps keep stock bubbles from happening.

      What I do hate is how people motivated by trying to depress Tesla’s stock price come over here to a forum for those interested in EVs, and pollute or derail useful and interesting discussion by posting FUD and B.S. which they know perfectly well is completely untrue.

      Expressing an honest opinion, even a negative one, is one thing. But FUD is a disinformation strategy, and one of the goals of that is to intentionally disrupt any useful or interesting discussion on the forum’s topic.

  11. Get Real says:

    Look, another desperate non-EV driving troll who has re-registered under a new username to post there pathetic, self-serving FUD.

    Get a life loser.

  12. Assaf says:

    Haha, $1500-1600 is approximately what we’re paying on our 2017 Leaf for a YEAR, not for one month.

    It remains to be seen whether Tesla can do affordable at all.

  13. Get Real says:

    Tesla is going after BMW, Mercedes, and Audi primarily.

    But Tesla is also an energy company and may become a semi company.

    Tesla is really becomjng an ecosystem type company kind of like Apple.

    1. Mystery says:

      Do you Even know what the word Ecosystem means? Partners would have to contribute and participate with room for them to succeed and profit. Apple has an Ecosystem and $850B market cap, Tesla has Suppliers and Eastern european construction & other labor issues (per CBSN insider report), that would scare off any USA tech ecosystem millenials.

      1. Get Real says:

        It is the Mystery Troll who is hopelessly confused about Ecosystem here, you should go back to Seeking Liars for a more clueless people.

        NOT a “Business Ecosystem” of suppliers, but rather a highly integrated Hardware/Software Ecosystem on their products including cars/supercharger network/coming autonomy/solar/battery storage/and possibly insurance.

        1. Mystery says:

          Your level is ignorance is impressive. Do you even own an iPhone? Name the companies in any “Tesla ecosystem”. They are supplier partners, like NVidia, who are not even allowed to sell any services/SW/HW independently, nor related/integrated to Tesla car. That is Not an Ecosystem.

          1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

            Irv, cleanup on aisle 6. A troll keeps pooping in here.

          2. BenG says:

            Panasonic is the obvious answer, the leading Li-ion battery company, a tight partner of Tesla’s in the Gigafactory. Their symbiotic relationship reflects ecosystem type development.

            1. Mystery says:

              Again, that is not currently an ecosystem. Tesla owns the Gigafactory with Panasonic, who made massive investment. That is a partner / supplier. Panasonic does Not make anything that they sell independently that integrates with a Tesla car. Tesla has likely exclusive or majority final say-so about what comes out of the gigafactory and who it is sold to. Not an Ecosystem. Also, the Pusher of TSLA stock pulls out another classic bullying deflection/misdirection, when facts are clearly against.

  14. Bob Strayer says:

    Tesla recently updated the autonomous hardware to 2.5. They need to flip their inventory.

    1. unlucky says:

      Why didn’t they draw down their inventory ahead of time?

      1. Nix says:

        Because they still needed demo cars. Chicken v. Egg. They need 2.0 demo cars to show customers who are ordering 2.5 cars that will be built at a later date.

        You can’t wait until the car is built to have a customer demo it, when the customer is finalizing the order months before the car is built. So you have to keep 2.0 cars around for demo cars until they start building enough 2.5 cars to replace their existing demo cars. So no, they can’t get rid of them ahead of time and then have no cars to demo.

        1. unlucky says:

          I don’t really see it the same way. You didn’t have trouble selling people on AP HW2.0 cars using AP HW1.0 cars. I don’t see how this is much different. I don’t see a need to unload a lot of cars quickly, to discount deeply.

          But in the end it isn’t all that many cars, it’s not an enormous difference either way. And I think my belief that moving 210 cars (or whatever it is) would make any kind of difference in S/X sales is probably not supportable.

          I abandon my idea that this has to have something to do with S/X sales levels.

          1. John Ray says:

            Actually, they didn’t tell those who had AP1cars on order that AP2 was coming. I have a friend with an X who was griping about it until I explained that he was better off with AP1 for now. Sounds like AP2 is now obsolete.

      2. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        “Why didn’t they draw down their inventory ahead of time?”

        Hmmm, wasn’t there an InsideEVs article just a few months ago claiming that Tesla was stockpiling pre-made (“inventory”) Model S’s and maybe X’s, in anticipation of the production slowdown associated with putting the Model 3 into production?

        Well, I can’t find anything like that by Googling (other than a Seeking Alpha blog post… and who wants to read FUDster cabbage like that?).

        Maybe that was just a rumor?

    2. Someone out there says:

      They could just replace the PCB in the demo cars, no need to replace the whole car.

  15. Bill Howland says:

    JD you may be right that TESLA constantly loses money – but the point is, their UNIQUE business model means it just doesn’t matter.

    As long as Wall St. Loves Tesla, or nothing dramatic happens to Wall St. itself, nothing is going to change..

    Mr. Musk, making 20-30 times what a normal car CEO makes, tends to prove there is some merit in their game plan, at least for Mr. Musk.

    He has managed to come up with a rather impressive charging ‘network’. In NYS, for the vast majority of the state, there is NOTHING ELSE.

    Diane’s Auto, the SOLE fast-charger ‘near’ me, only 150 miles away, is now defunct. So now in my neck of the woods there is NOTHING but Tesla.

    1. Assaf says:

      Guess we’re lucky to be in the Pacific Northwest, where chademo’s are fairly thick on the ground.
      Just completed two 600-mile round trips from Seattle to Oregon and back in our 2017 Leaf last month.

    2. unlucky says:

      https://api.plugshare.com/view/location/114014

      Is there some official word that the Diane’s Auto one won’t be fixed?

      1. Bill Howland says:

        An orange flag used to always come up in Ithaca, but now it has been taken down. Your link refers to the only BOLT dealership remotely near me (but still further at around 180-200 miles away) of the ONLY current fast charger accessible to me.

        The comments indicate how popular the site is, as would be imagined.

        On a long trip – I’m not sure there wouldn’t be a long line for this one charger.

        Tesla has the only decent network in my area.

    3. Someone out there says:

      It would have to be a pretty unique business model if you can consistently lose money and it wouldn’t matter.

      1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        It is pretty unique to have a business about which so many people keep repeating the Big Lie that it’s “losing money”, when it’s really investing money in continuing growth; so many people repeating that Big Lie so often that some people actually believe it!

        1. Mystery says:

          Again, Pulling the wool over the koolaid drinkers’ eyes. Tesla does Lose Tons of Money (can you Not Believe their Quarterly Reports?). That is the Truth, they choose to make massive investments to grow their potential business or just keep innovating endlessly. Musk has unlimited capital, connections, friends, and had govt subsidies with Obama, so TSLA stock doesn’t matter how much money they lose, looks like they will Always be kept afloat. So all that matters is continued innovation (with whatever smoke and mirrors deflection & misdirection necessary), to overcome when they start to fail on expectations (peak Model S & X earlier than pumped up, and poor market share in China failure). They also don’t know, nor can trust how long it will actually take to Model 3 waiting list = 0 and/or production/quality mishaps, which if they come earlier than Wall St expects, would be the primary determinant of a major downgrade, with little other smoke & mirrors weapons left to escape transparency.

  16. John Ray says:

    This is a common strategy to move demo models. In fact, I got an email this week from my local BMW dealer who had some pretty sweet lease deals on service loaners. I guess I am saying don’t read too much into this one way or the other.

  17. Doggydogworld says:

    If you sum the quarterly numbers since 2013, Tesla has produced ~18,000 more cars than they’ve delivered. Most of this came in the past 9-12 months. I’m not sure why they built up so much inventory, but it must have been intentional.

    This may be an attempt to finally start clearing the inventory out, or it may just be the normal end-of-quarter sales push.

    1. Nix says:

      Source?

      I think you might be confusing US vs. global sales numbers with production numbers. Tesla has approx 1,000 total inventory cars in all locations around the world.

      https://ev-cpo.com/classic/

      1. Doggydogworld says:

        I’m not confused, Nix. You’re being fooled by Tesla marketing department.

        Andreas Hopf on Seeking Alpha tracked down the number of produced and delivered cars for (almost) every quarter since 1/1/13:
        http://imgur.com/a/tNC9s

        Yes, he’s a grumpy bear, but numbers are numbers. Please check his work. I did. Tesla’s quarterly shareholder letters have most of it. I also tracked down good estimates for his two missing numbers, they reduce his cumulative “produced but not sold” by ~700 to just over 18,000.

        Furthermore, “Finished Goods Inventory” in the latest 10-Q wa $1.45 billion. 18,000 cars at an average build cost of just below $75k comprises 1.3 billion of that. The rest is used cars taken in trade plus a few Power Walls and such. If you look in the last four 10-K/Qs you’ll see Finished Goods Inventory has tracked Andreas’s “produced by not delivered” number pretty well. So it all checks out.

        The question is not whether Tesla has 18,000 cars in inventory, but “Why”? A few thousand were in transit to customers on 6/30/17. Another 1500-2000 (6-8 per store) are demos and loaners. Where are the rest? And why did they keep the factory cranked up as inventory kept building? 18,000 cars is 70 days worth of sales!! That’s no different those dumb old last-century legacy carmakers with their “stealerships”.

        I have my guesses, but the whole thing is really quite puzzling.

        1. Nix says:

          Well, thanks for proving my comment earlier about this place being infested with desperately seeking alpha trolls.

          If you aren’t reading desperately seeking alpha for just humor value, you are doing it wrong.

          No, I’m not going to click on click bait that exists just to get clicks. seeking alpha is purely a click factory, where people write crap that will make them money on the number of clicks they get. Being right or wrong has nothing to do with it, and this guy has a 50% success rate on his investment calls. AKA, you could flip a coin and get the same results.

          Sorry you are so easily suckered into believing click-bait. Let me know when you actually have a real source.

          1. Doggydogworld says:

            Nix – the link isn’t to Seeking Alpha. It’s to a pic of a spreadsheet. A handy shortcut to save you from opening 18 individual “Update Letters”, which are available here:

            http://ir.tesla.com/downloads.cfm?NumberPerPage=50&Year=&SortOrder=FileDate+Descending

            I opened the letters. His numbers check out. I also read the 10Qs and 10Ks:
            https://www.sec.gov/cgi-bin/browse-edgar?action=getcompany&CIK=0001318605&type=10&dateb=&owner=exclude&count=40

            As an investor I learn the most by reading opposing viewpoints. If I find their argument is based on incorrect facts or assumptions, I’m encouraged. If I find their facts are correct, I re-evaluate.

            Long-term investing is a search for truth (among other things). Ignoring the other side’s arguments by closing my eyes, putting my hands over my ears and yelling “I can’t hear you, I can’t hear you” is a money-loser.

            If you choose to ignore facts, that’s your business. But why all the insults? They only make you look bad.

            1. Nix says:

              Seeking alpha deserves 100% of the insults I lay upon them. Listing your source as seeking alpha in your post, and YOU look bad, not me. There is absolutely nothing wrong with me pointing out a much deserved lousy record of seeking alpha trolls, and holding them accountable for their long, long record of getting it badly wrong over and over regarding Tesla. Yes, record matters.

              _________________________________________

              I did a basic sanity check on those figures based upon median “New Inventory” pre-discounted prices on Tesla’s website, and compared this against the numbers in Tesla’s SEC reports.

              For Tesla to have 18,000 more new inventory cars warehoused somewhere in some dream world hidden site (on top of the ~1K cars they list as new inventory) and still reconcile to the figures in their quarterly reports, they would have to have:

              1) zero parts inventory to build new cars with
              2) zero cars in their Tillburg factory still being finished for delivery
              3) zero cars in their US, Germany, China, etc distribution centers
              4) zero cars being used in any service centers as loaners
              5) zero cars sitting on any gallery floors as display models
              6) zero cars being used in any sales locations as test drive vehicles
              7) zero cars in transit, either sitting sitting in foreign customs lots, or sitting in lots in the US awaiting a ship, rail, or truck transit, or actually in transit.
              8) zero inventory in battery cells being used to build various packs or powerwall products.
              9) zero inventory in powerwall and similar energy products
              10) zero inventory in solar cells or solar roofs or solar panels
              11) Zero display items of any of their energy products.
              12) Zero of their energy or solar products in transit or in the process of being installed, or still in accounts receivable and not yet otherwise booked as being moved from inventory to sold product.
              13) That Tesla has no test vehicles, have never crash tested a single car, and has never loaned out cars, etc

              It simply doesn’t pass the initial sniff test to even dig into figuring out how this guy is either misinterpreting or intentionally twisting the numbers.

              I’ve debunked enough bullcrap from seeking alpha trolls with horrid records of getting everything wrong to already predict the outcome. I’ll waste my time proving absolutely without a shadow of a doubt that they are full of crap. And there is absolutely no hidden inventory of 18,000 unsold vehicles. All to have those who willfully remain blind to the truth because it doesn’t fit their agenda continue to post their bullcrap repeated anyways. Despite being completely debunked.

              So if you choose to buy into the latest FUD, from the same folks who told us no volume production Model 3’s until 2019, that Tesla would be bankrupt before building a single (enter list of every car Tesla has built), then go right ahead. Tie yourself to that sinking ship.

              1. Doggydogworld says:

                Nix, thanks for looking into this. Let me be clear — this is not 18k “more” cars. It’s 18k total. It includes loaners, demos, in transit, etc.

                Comments on your individual points. I use Finished Goods Inventory (FGI) which was 1.47b on 6/30/17. 18k cars * $72k average build cost is 1.296b.
                1) Manufacturing parts aren’t counted in FGI
                2) Unfinished cars aren’t counted in FGI
                3) My 18k cars includes cars in distribution centers (part of “in transit”)
                4/5/6) My 18k cars includes loaners, display models, etc.
                7) My 18k cars includes cars in transit
                8/9) 3 months of energy storage production is ~20m
                10) Solar is not part of FGI, it’s in “solar energy systems, leased and to be leased”
                11) De minimis (1-2m)
                12) see 8/9 and 10
                13) If they count beta cars for crash tests in their production numbers, this could explain ~200 of the 18k.

                You didn’t mention trade-ins and lease returns, which also count in FGI. I don’t think they’ve taken that many cars back yet, and they seem to resell quickly. Two months of 2014-era sales would be about 4000 cars. Average carrying cost of 40k yields 160m.

                So:
                1296m – never titled inventory (incl. in transit, loaners, showroom, etc.)
                160m – used
                20m – energy storage
                ——-
                1476m – total

                That’s pretty close to the 10-Q. I’d like to see your estimates.

                As I said above, I think 3500 were in transit on 6/30/17 (need to double check). They’ve got less than 300 stores, 6-8 demos and loaners at each would be another 2000.

                18k is ~70 per store. Perhaps they’ve been building inventory ahead of shutting down the assembly line to re-configure and/or move it? They’ll need space in Fremont to expand Model 3 from 5k/week to 10k later next year. Just a theory.

                1. Nix says:

                  Well, you’ve unwittingly debunked yourself.

                  When you say Tesla has “70 days of sales” worth of inventory, you instantly discredit your claims when you include in those numbers cars in transit, display cars, demo cars, service loaner cars, crash test cars, cars destroyed because they were pre-production cars that could NEVER be sold, etc, etc.

                  You absolutely cannot include as days worth of sales inventory, cars that are being used for other purposes other than primarily being available for sale as if they were unsold inventory.

                  So this is a big fat nothing-burger. You’ve taken everyday normal cars that are normal part of operating a business, like cars in transit and demo/service loaner/crash test/pre-production/etc cars and made ALL of those cars sound like some huge 70 day backlog in unsold cars. With the implication of there being some problem with Tesla not being able to sell their cars.

                  You’ve unwittingly proven such claims of 70 days of unsold inventory is a COMPLETE misrepresentation of the actual numbers. As for the rest of your math, once you utterly fail in such a massive way, misrepresenting by your own admission thousands upon thousands of cars as days of inventory when they aren’t sales inventory, all the rest of your math instantly becomes suspect.

                  There is no way I’m going down this silly rabbit hole with you, when you can’t even bother correcting your most blatant misrepresentation, that cars ordered by customers and are in transit should somehow be counted the same as unsold cars on some new car dealer’s lot. Given Tesla’s proven conversion rate on deliveries, implying any such parallel with your 70 day comment is absurd.

                  __________________________________

                  I’m going to write this one off as lack of due-diligence due to Harvey. Because this is below you.

                  1. Doggydogworld says:

                    Nix – I never once said “70 days of unsold inventory”. Stop misquoting me!

                    Tesla says they produced 246,300 cars from 1/1/13-6/30/17.
                    Tesla says they delivered 228,100 cars from 1/1/13-6/30/17.
                    Carrying cost for the 18,200 car difference (~1.3b) is consistent with 1.47b Finished Goods Inventory.

                    Do you agree Tesla has 18k cars in inventory? This fact comes straight from Tesla press releases and SEC filings, if you dispute it you need to show different numbers from Tesla.

                    If you accept the 18k inventory, but say Tesla needs that many to operate their business, then I respect your opinion. (Doesn’t mean I agree, just that reasonable minds can have different opinions).

                    1. Nix says:

                      Doggy, now you are just digging your hole deeper. You posted not just once about 70 days of sales inventory, but twice, including this gem saying those numbers are the same as unsold inventory on dealer lots:

                      “18,000 cars is 70 days worth of sales!! That’s no different those dumb old last-century legacy carmakers with their “stealerships”.”

                      That is YOU pretending that cars ordered by customers, and in transit for delivery are the same as cars sitting unsold on traditional dealership lots.

                      http://insideevs.com/in-attempt-to-boost-sales-tesla-offers-30000-discount-0-99-apr/#comment-1308536

                      ________________________________________

                      When I get something wrong, here is what I do:

                      “Dav8or, you are correct, I did make a mistake at the very end of my post. My bad. Thank you for the correction! ”

                      http://insideevs.com/in-attempt-to-boost-sales-tesla-offers-30000-discount-0-99-apr/#comment-1308427

                      If you don’t have the intellectual honesty to even retract the most clearly blatant of your errors, saying that cars that are ordered and are in transit to customers are the same as unsold traditional dealer lot inventory (much less all the other cars you are clearly miscounting too), then there is ABSOLUTELY ZERO reason to accept anything you’ve presented.

                      I have absolutely zero reason nor motivation to dig through the entire rest of your mess, when (like I predicted) you simply go into blind denial when you are proven wrong.

                    2. Doggydogworld says:

                      Nix – there’s no reply button on your post, perhaps some kind of nesting limit. So I used the reply button on my prior post.

                      You are correct. I considered Tesla’s 70 days to be “no different than a legacy carmaker” because both inventories include factory-ordered cars. But Tesla has a higher proportion of factory-orders than a legacy carmaker, so they are not directly comparable.

                      I hereby retract my comment that Tesla’s 70 days of inventory is “no different than a legacy carmaker’s”.

                      Side note: I complained about misquoting because you used the word “unsold”. Even though cars in transit are technically unsold, I never used that word as it would have been misleading.

                      Now, what are your thoughts on the 18,000 cars in inventory?

        2. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

          “The question is not whether Tesla has 18,000 cars in inventory, but ‘Why’?”

          Anti-Tesla FUDsters have been claiming for years and years that Tesla is making more cars than they can sell at retail price, and darkly insinuating that Tesla is clandestinely selling them on some mysterious “gray market”, or somehow hiding them in invisible parking lots.

          Of course, any rational person knowledgeable about Tesla’s production would immediately recognize that this can’t possibly be true. There are actually people over on the Tesla Motors Club forum who track individual VIN numbers; it is literally impossible that 18,000 cars could have escaped their notice! Or even 180 cars, for that matter.

          Doggydogworld, this is the second recent post of yours that reads like an anti-Tesla FUDster’s post. I hope this is just a temporary aberration on your part, and that you haven’t really joined the ranks of the serial Tesla FUDsters. We lost Sven to that group; he made many valuable and interesting contributions to our forum before he was seduced into being a serial Tesla bashing FUDster.

          I sincerely hope you’re not following him.

          1. Doggydogworld says:

            The numbers are right there in Tesla’s quarterly update letters and SEC filings. All you have to do is add them up. Numbers have no bias, they aren’t bears, or trolls, or FUD.

            If you can point me to a specific Tesla forum thread or person who will engage in factual discussion, using actual numbers, I’d be much obliged. I’m looking into this to learn the truth, not promote any particular point of view.

            1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

              Why should I waste my time closely examining yet another case where Tesla haters twists figures and facts to support their lies? I spent too many months reading blog posts and comments on the sewer known as “Seeking Alpha” precisely so I could spot that B.S. when I saw it. And I’m looking at it right now.

              As I think I very clearly explained to you, Doggydogworld, it is literally impossible for that many VIN numbers to have escaped the notice of people on the Tesla Motors Club forum who track those numbers. You’re arguing as if that’s just a opinion, when it’s a fact.

              Your assertion boils down to arguing “I can make 2 + 2 = 6 f I repeat it often enough!”

              Nope, you can’t. It will always equal 4.

          2. Doggydogworld says:

            Further note to both you guys. I’ve argued against this particular Seeking Alpha bear many times. I checked out these numbers thinking I’d catch him in another distortion or exaggeration. But guess what? His numbers are rock solid. And when I cross-checked against Finished Goods Inventory in the SEC filing, I found more confirmation.

            I don’t ignore facts just because I don’t like them, or don’t like the person who brought them to my attention. Facts are Facts. And the fact is Tesla says they built 246,300 cars since 1/1/13 and delivered 228,100. The difference is just over 18,000. Calling me names doesn’t change that.

            1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

              The Tesla haters are often clever. I admit to having been fooled by one of their arguments, which was backed up by real figures.

              It was only later that someone else explained the larger context for those figures, showing that was yet another case where “Figures don’t lie, but liars do figure.”

              You (or I) not being able to figure out where the fallacy lies, does not mean there’s no fallacy there, Doggydogworld. Even smart people get fooled occasionally.

            2. Nix says:

              doggy, you are absolutely twisting and misrepresenting the facts by claiming that cars out of delivery, in transit, physically delivered to customers but awaiting loan funding to be counted as sold, demo cars, service loaners, etc, etc are some sort of “70 days of sales”.

              Since you’ve already grossly misrepresented cars that are part of the normal part of manufacturing, service, and demonstrations, and have nothing to do with traditional days of backlog in sales, frankly there is zero point in figuring out where all the errors are in the rest of your numbers.

  18. Nix says:

    I can’t wait for the same trolls who complain that you can’t get a discount on a Tesla, to now cry endlessly about discounts on select Tesla’s.

  19. Four Electrics says:

    A refresh is coming.

  20. Buster says:

    Here’s a fact: I flew out of Burbank airport last week and very near the airport entrance there as a parking lot of at least 50 brand new Model Xs, maybe 100. If all Teslas are ordered, what are these doing sitting in a storage parking lot?

    1. Some Guy says:

      Here’s a thought: maybe a local delivery hub? or a place to store them until it is enough to put them on a ship for export? Tesla produces “on order”, aside from a few demo units.
      Drive by any ICE car stealership in the US, and there are often more than 100 UNSOLD vehicles on the lot. As a matter of fact, in the entire US of A, there are currently around 3 million + unsold vehicles sitting on lots, waiting for a buyer.
      Around any major ICE car manufacturing plant in the world, there are lots with 1000s of unsold / unshipped ICE cars. Those companies are doomed by your own logic, then. (At least one thing we can agree on, although for different reasons, possibly…).

      1. John Ray says:

        Don’t kid yourself, Tesla builds inventory cars. Go to ev-cpo and see for yourself.

      2. Doggydogworld says:

        You’ve fallen for the myth, Some Guy. Tesla has an inventory of 18,000 never-registered cars. 70 days of sales. It’s not “build to order plus a few demos” and hasn’t been for at least a year.

        See my comment upthresd for details.

        1. Some Guy says:

          What is this, “make up a random number, call it math and pray that someone is to believe it so that the losses on your shorts stop growing further”-day?
          Inventory of 18000 cars @ at least 100 k$ each would be 1.8 billion dollars in assets. That would show up at some point in a quarterly report, wouldn’t it? Or are you claiming that Tesla is cheating the SEC, or that the SEC is not doing their job properly?
          And by the way, I’m not falling for any myths, as I’m in the battery business myself for almost two decades now. Tesla’s and Panasonic’s tech is by far superior to anything I have seen elsewhere and thus the company will continue to grow…

          1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

            Yup. What Doggydogworld is claiming, whether he understands it or not, is that Tesla is committing fraud in its SEC filings.

            If he really believes that, then — as I believe I have told him already — he should file a report with the SEC. And not waste time pointlessly arguing about it on public forums!

            I hope he does file a report. Perhaps somebody at the SEC will get a laugh out of it before they toss it on the “crackpot complaints” pile.

          2. Doggydogworld says:

            Some Guy – you carry inventory at cost, not MSRP. Tesla’s ASP is ~95k, with 25% gross margin that’s $72k average build cost.

            18,000 * 72,000 = 1.296b
            Tesla’s finished goods inventory is 1.470b.

            The extra 174m is used cars plus a few Power Walls and such. The math checks out and supports the 18k number you get if you add up the quarterly numbers Tesla publishes for produced and delivered.

            I’d like to hear your explanation for that 1.47b of finished goods inventory that does not include 18k never-titled cars.

    2. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      “If all Teslas are ordered, what are these doing sitting in a storage parking lot?”

      There could easily be that many, or more, Tesla cars waiting on a ship to take them to a single overseas port, either to Europe or China. Doesn’t seem at all unusual to me. Tesla doesn’t send cars overseas one at a time!

  21. leafowner says:

    I do not see what the big deal is here. The Model S & X sell in total less than 10k units per month globally. The Model 3 will be selling 40k+ per month. Even though they may lose some sales – they will more than be offset by the M3. They may not make as much profit on each – but their cash flow and economies of scale will make everything they produce less expensive and thus increase profitability even at a lower price for the S & X.

    Move on folks….nothing to see here.

  22. Mister G says:

    Car guru rebuilt a flooded Tesla for $6,500 now that is impressive, check him out on youtube

  23. MikeV says:

    Now if only the charging time improved somehow to few minutes rather an hour or two, plus the waiting to get to the charger, will be greatly helpful for long distance travel. I am Tesla fan too.

    1. BenG says:

      Recharge time for the Model S is more like 15-20 minutes than an hour or two.

      The best strategy is to refill every 150 miles or so, keeping the battery in a lower state of charge so that it refills more quickly. Just stop to stretch your legs for 15-20 minutes every two hours and you are good to go.

  24. Scott says:

    I have a Model X with a MSRP of $113K. With recent bundling, it has been reduced to $105K. Musk wants to give customers the savings as production and batteries are becoming more competitive. As old gasoline cars MSRP’s keep rising, Tesla prices keep falling. EV’s are becoming more competitive even without subsidies but big Oil still receives billions in subsidies. Competition at the pump is the only way to get rid of Big Oil monopoly!

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