Volkswagen Plans Massive Electric Car Offensive: 1 Million EVs By 2025

OCT 5 2018 BY MARK KANE 197

Volkswagen targets production of 1,000,000 BEVs by 2025

A year ahead of its massive BEV offensive, Volkswagen Group shared some base targets. The German group intends to base its all-electric cars on a dedicated platform, the modular electric drive matrix (MEB) that will be used not only by Volkswagen, but also Audi, Skoda, Seat and maybe other brands within the group. The total investment is around $7 billion.

The first MEB-models from Volkswagen will be available in 2020 (probably late 2019). The target is to sell 150,000 electric cars in 2020, including 100,000 I.D. and I.D. SUV. Today, Volkswagen is below 100,000 plug-ins annually (all BEVs + PHEVs).

The family of I.D. concepts currently consist of several models:

Production of affordable, long-range electric cars is expected to increase and hit more than one million by 2025.

The first wave of MEB-cars is expected to be around 10 million globally (all brands), which probably means that the platform will be utilized through around 2030, without major upgrades besides maybe higher-capacity battery modules, we assume.

The MEB platform will enable VW Group to produce electric cars of various sizes and classes:

  • battery capacity of up to more than 100 kWh (111 kWh in case of concepts)
  • batteries will be liquid cooled/heated and should withstand entire life of the car
  • range: from 200-340 miles (330-550 km) in WLTP
  • rear-wheel drive or dual motor all-wheel drive configurations
  • fast charging at up to 125 kW (DC)
  • on-board AC charging at 11 kW (option of wireless charging in the future)

Interesting is that there will be 22 kW DC chargers for home use, combined with energy storage systems:

“Volkswagen also plans to produce wall boxes that offer 22 kW (DC) charging capacity and work in a bidirectional manner, allowing energy to be supplied to the grid. At night, electric vehicles connected to the bidirectional wall boxes will serve as a storage battery for surplus capacity.”

Volkswagen: charging speed comparison

If you’re wondering whether there will be enough electricity for all of those cars, Volkswagen says that’s not a problem:

“Even with the anticipated increase in the number of registered electric vehicles, the available power grid will be sufficient. Take Germany as an example: one million electric vehicles would consume approximately 2.4 TWh (2,400,000,000 kWh) of power per year. Annual energy consumption in Germany is 517 TWh. Thus energy consumption will only rise by 0.5 percent due to the use of electric cars.”

Volkswagen: Rolling Chassis with the Modular Electric Drive Kit (MEB) – First pure EV platform for high volume

Volkswagen MEB

10 million EVs on Volkswagen MEB platform FEATURE – Autogefühl

Volkswagen: Building of a Service Platform

Press blast

VOLKSWAGEN ACCELERATES E-MOBILITY FOR THE MASSES

Oct 4, 2018

  • The ID. family is set to make e-cars affordable for millions of people. The first vehicles of this new generation of e-cars will make their debut in 2020.
  • A global sales volume of 150,000 e-cars is planned for 2020, set to rise to more than one million by 2025
  • 100 percent electric: The ID. family is based on the modular electric drive toolkit (MEB), specifically developed for electric vehicles
  • No compromises: The ID. family pushes the boundaries of e-mobility in terms of range, interior space and dynamics
  • The first wave across all Volkswagen brands will include around 10 million global e-cars based on MEB technology
  • The ID. family will feature new E3 end-to-end electronics architecture and a new operating system called vw.OS
  • The battery’s modular layout allows scalable ranges from about 200 to 340 miles
  • Volkswagen is investing nearly 7 billion dollars into e-mobility, 1.5 million of which is budgeted for component production plants in Braunschweig, Salzgitter and Kassel
  • Volkswagen is a member of Ionity, a joint venture working to develop and expand the network of charging stations on highways throughout Europe

Wolfsburg (October 4, 2018) — Individual mobility is on the threshold of a new era: Electric drivetrains and digitalization are set to bring about the most fundamental change the car industry has ever seen. The sales volume of battery electric cars (BEVs) rose by 60 percent in the past year and 2018 could be the first year that newly registered electric cars reach the one-million mark—a target Volkswagen hopes to hit with the global ID. family by 2025.

“As early as 2020 we intend to sell 150,000 e-cars, of which 100,000 will be the ID. and ID. SUV,” says Thomas Ulbrich, Member of the Volkswagen Brand Board of Management, E-Mobility division. “Speeding up the shift to e-mobility will help us to meet the extremely ambitious CO2 targets that have been set in Europe, China and the USA.”

Globally, more than six million new Volkswagen vehicles roll out of production plants and onto the road each year. The brand’s scale helps make technical innovations affordable for the masses—and it will be no different for the electric vehicles in the new ID. family. Volkswagen’s aim is to make electric cars attractive to as many people as possible, thus paving the way to mass electric mobility.

“The ID. will prove to be a milestone in terms of technological development, “says Christian Senger, Head of the Volkswagen E-Mobility product line. “It will be the first fully interconnected electric vehicle that is 100 percent suitable for day-to-day use, and millions of people will be able to afford it.”

With the I.D., the I.D. CROZZ, the I.D. BUZZ and the I.D. VIZZION, Volkswagen has already presented four concepts. The development of the vehicle technology is virtually complete, as are the designs of the various models. Contracts with the battery suppliers have been signed. Volkswagen is investing more than one billion euros to prepare its plant in Zwickau for the production of MEB vehicles. The company is also committing itself to developing a comprehensive charging infrastructure. In short: Volkswagen’s e-mobility offensive is taking shape on all fronts.

MEB Architecture

Volkswagen: Rolling Chassis with the Modular Electric Drive Kit (MEB) – First pure EV platform for high volume

The technological backbone of the ID. family is a newly developed vehicle platform: the modular electric drive matrix or MEB for short. Volkswagen is one of the most successful platform developers in the automotive industry. One example of this is the modular transverse matrix (MQB), probably the most successful vehicle architecture in use at present: around 55 million vehicles are being produced by the Group based on the first generation of MQB. Volkswagen is now applying this same platform strategy to the era of electric vehicles. The MEB is not just the technical building block for all models in the Volkswagen ID. family, but for many electric cars produced by other Group brands, including Audi, SEAT, Škoda and Volkswagen Commercial Vehicles.

The MEB has two major unique selling propositions. First, it is not a platform for vehicles with combustion engines that has been retroactively modified. Instead it is a modular assembly matrix designed specifically for pure electric cars, which enables Volkswagen to utilize this technology to maximum effect. Second, the vehicle concept and design can be structured in a more flexible way than ever before—the spectrum ranges from compact cars to SUVs and MPVs. This will enable the Group to achieve economies of scale, thereby making electric cars cheaper and more affordable for many people.

The MEB—designed with purely electric drive systems in mind—enables the size of a vehicle’s wheelbase to be increased while reducing the body overhangs, resulting in more dynamic proportions. In addition to allowing the designers to create a standalone design DNA for the new zero-emissions vehicles, the chassis design leads to much larger and more versatile vehicle interiors.

The zero-emissions drivetrain in the ID. family primarily consists of an electric motor integrated into the rear axle with power electronics and a transmission, a high-voltage flat battery pack installed in the vehicle floor to save space, and auxiliary powertrains integrated into the front end of the vehicle. The power electronics are effectively a link that controls the flow of high-voltage energy between the motor and the battery. The power electronics convert the direct current (DC) stored in the battery into alternating current (AC). Meanwhile, a DC/DC converter supplies the onboard electronics with 12-volt power. The single-speed gearbox transfers the power from the motor to the rear axle. The motor, power electronics and gearbox form a single, compact unit.

The electric motor of the I.D. concept car showcased at the 2016 Paris Auto Show had a power output of 168 hp. The I.D. prototype can accelerate from 0 to 62 mph in less than eight seconds, with a top speed of 99 mph. Electric motors offering either more or less power may be considered for the 2020 series version. In parallel to this, the ID. family will feature a range of battery sizes. The battery’s modular layout allows scalable ranges from about 200 miles up to more than 340 miles on the WLTP (Worldwide Harmonized Light Vehicles Test Procedure) cycle. It is installed centrally in the underbody, which saves space, significantly lowers the center of gravity, and gives an optimal weight distribution of close to 50:50.

The MEB architecture will also enable new assistance, comfort, infotainment, control and display systems to be integrated into vehicles across the board. The I.D. concept presented at the Paris Show, for example, featured an AR (augmented reality) head-up display which projects information such as visual cues from the navigation system into the virtual space in front of the vehicle.

To control the huge range of features on board the ID. models, Volkswagen has designed the completely new end-to-end electronics architecture, called E3, as well as a new operating system, called vw.OS. The new E3 architecture consolidates the control units known across the industry today to create a much more powerful and centralized processor unit. The new operating system will allow Volkswagen to keep the vehicles fresh during their entire lifecycle by making the systems compatible for updates and upgrades accessed via the Cloud.

Battery Technology

An EV’s battery system must meet high expectations—and not solely in terms of achieving the best possible range. Drivers also expect that they will operate in all conditions and temperatures, and they want the charging time for the cells to be as short as possible. The batteries in the ID. family will meet all of these expectations.

The largest automotive manufacturer in Germany is now applying its extensive experience from decades of development, production and scaling of engines and transmissions. This know-how has been used in the past few years for fully electric models (BEVs) and plug-in hybrid vehicles (PHEVs), including the e-up! and e-Golf BEVs and the Golf GTE, Passat GTE and Passat Variant GTE PHEVs. Each of these is equipped with high-voltage batteries that are reliable and extremely safe.

These batteries are primarily produced at the Volkswagen component plant in Braunschweig. Volkswagen Components, the business unit responsible for the drive systems, is currently expanding the Braunschweig site to be able to build up to half a million battery systems per year in the future. In addition, a pilot line for battery cell production is currently being built in the Salzgitter factory. The Volkswagen Components business unit also produces the electric motors and I its plant in Kassel has been restructured for this purpose. All told, Volkswagen is investing 1.5 billion dollars in electric mobility at its sites in Braunschweig, Salzgitter and Kassel.

The Volkswagen Components business unit has developed a completely new battery system for the Volkswagen ID. family that is both less complicated and significantly more powerful than previous systems. Unlike the batteries used up to now, the MEB system has the benefit of being scalable, which means it is relatively simple to integrate it in different performance levels into the ID. models. For example, if a prospective ID. owner is less interested in having a car that can travel great distances—because they primarily use it in the city and only travel short distances—they can opt for a battery with a lower energy yield. This makes the vehicle cheaper. Drivers who frequently drive longer distances would be more likely to opt for a larger battery. This gives the vehicle owner more flexibility. It is exactly this ability to customize performance that makes the new battery system so attractive.

In addition to scalability, there are other advantages to the new battery system, including weight optimization (thanks to an aluminum housing), the adaptability of various cell types, and integrated cooling. The battery can be used to drive one or both axles. As the cell modules are arranged in a similar manner to a bar of chocolate, the batteries are also easy to install. Volkswagen has also been able to increase the charging capacity to up to 125 kW—a value so far not achieved by mass-market EVs, which will shorten the charging time.

The battery housing includes integrated battery cooling, a connection box for the high-voltage and low-voltage electrical system (AC, DC and 12 V), and the newly developed MEB cell modules, which consist of individual battery cells. The cell controllers (CMCe)—control units to monitor the cells (voltage, currents and temperature) and cell balancing (ensuring the cells are uniformly used in day-to-day operation)—are integrated in the longitudinal beam of the battery housing. The battery electronics unit (BMCe) is integrated in the rear part of the battery system as a further control unit. Cell module connectors are used to link the cell modules to one another; measuring cables communicate with the battery electronics. The battery housing is closed at the top with a cover that is easy to remove in the event that maintenance is required.

Either pouch or prismatic cell types can be used, resulting in high flexibility in collaboration with cell suppliers. Volkswagen created the Centre of Excellence for battery cells in 2017 to aid the development of lithium-ion batteries by providing detailed specifications on the product. In this way, the Centre of Excellence is responsible for all battery cells used by the Volkswagen Group.

A lithium-ion battery cell consists of an anode (carbon, copper foil), a separator (porous polyolefin film, ceramic-coated), a cathode (lithium metal oxide, aluminum film) and an electrolyte (organic solvent, lithium conducting salt, additives). When charging, the lithium ions migrate from the cathode to the anode and are stored there. Electrical energy—supplied by the electrical grid—is then converted into chemical energy. The electrons flow through the electrical circuit, while the lithium ions flow through the separator. During the discharge process—to operate the electric motor—the lithium ions migrate back to the cathode. The chemical energy is then converted into electrical energy once more. In this case, the electrons flow through the electrical circuit and the lithium ions flow through the separator in the opposite direction.

Charging Infrastructure

Volkswagen I.D. BUZZ at IONITY ultra-fast charging station

For Volkswagen, e-mobility is more than just a good e-car. All the relevant parameters must work together: the vehicle, the mobility services, and the infrastructure. The Volkswagen brand is building its own charging and energy ecosystem in the form of hardware and software for the vehicles’ environment as a whole—at home, at work, in the public realm, and on the highway. As many activities as possible are bundled in-house in order to ensure the quality of all services.

According to current surveys, most ID. drivers in Europe will only have to charge their car once a week, as the majority of commuters do not travel further than 30 miles per day. Based on analyses by Volkswagen, it is estimated that around 50 percent of all charging processes will take place at home and another 20 percent will take place at work. Volkswagen will thus offer a modular program of wall boxes which can be mounted in carports, garages or company parking lots. While a vehicle is charged at 2.3 kW via the standard 230 V grid, the wall box will allow the ID. models to be charged at a rate of up to 11 kW (AC)—this charging capacity is sufficient to fully charge the Volkswagen’s battery overnight (which is often cheaper) or during the working day. The starting price for the Volkswagen wall boxes will be about $350, plus installation costs. Volkswagen also plans to produce wall boxes that offer 22 kW (DC) charging capacity and work in a bidirectional manner, allowing energy to be supplied to the grid. At night, electric vehicles connected to the bidirectional wall boxes will serve as a storage battery for surplus capacity.

A quarter of charging processes will take place at public quick-charge stations, while 5 percent will occur on highways—in both cases at a rate of more than 125 kW. It will be enough to charge once for a 340-mile stretch. If the ID. vehicle is charged at a quick-charging station with the aforementioned 125 kW rate, charging will be completed in about 30 minutes.

Expansion of the charging infrastructure is of utmost importance. One step towards achieving this in Europe is the Ionity joint venture. Through Ionity, Volkswagen is cooperating with the BMW Group, Daimler AG, and Ford Motor Company to create a reliable network of powerful quick-charging stations along European highways. A total of 400 quick-charging stations, dubbed the ‘filling stations of the future’, should enter into operation by 2020. The ID. models will be able to charge batteries at these charging points with at a rate of up to 125 kW.

Overall, it is critical that the expansion of the charging infrastructure must be massively pushed in all countries. It goes without saying that Volkswagen is contributing to the expansion of the charging infrastructure: All 4,000 authorized Volkswagen dealers in Europe will be equipped with on-site charging stations. Volkswagen will also expand the network of charging stations at its production sites in employee parking lots from 1,000 to 5,000 by 2020, and provide regeneratively-generated power at the company charging points wherever possible.

In the future, the Volkswagen “WE” mobility platform will offer the “We Charge” app-controlled service to answer owner questions about charging. “We Charge” will ease range anxiety by showing the most suitable charging point, reserving it, and navigating to it. The “We Charge” functionality is currently planned for the European market, and will be facilitated through Volkswagen’s shareholding in Hubject – eRoaming. The platform makes it possible to charge electric vehicles throughout Europe no matter who the provider is, and utilizes 300 partners and 55,000 charging points. Payments are currently made via RFID or smartphone app with a QR code. In the not-too-distant future, the system will be revolutionized with “Plug & Charge”, which uses block-chain technology to facilitate billing and payment for the charging process directly via the ID. model itself.

Volkswagen I.D. and „People’s Wallbox“

The future of e-mobility provides several other smart solutions. Integrated into the home power network, zero-emissions vehicles will stabilize the power grid by storing surplus capacity in the power network, which frequently accrue at night and so far remain unused. Volkswagen wants to go one step further than simply providing wall boxes: The company is also planning to design a digitally linked home energy management system (HEMS), which can be used to reduce energy costs for households and mobility alike. The HEMS manages the energy demand of the e-car and the house heating pump while incorporating photovoltaics and household batteries. In the evening, the user will enter the range they require for the following day and at what time. The ID. vehicle communicates with the HEMS and establishes the best charging cycle on the basis of the current electricity price and availability. In the event of a power outage, the HEMS can, fall back on the available residual energy of the ID. vehicle to temporarily power the home.

Even with the anticipated increase in the number of registered electric vehicles, the available power grid will be sufficient. Take Germany as an example: one million electric vehicles would consume approximately 2.4 TWh (2,400,000,000 kWh) of power per year. Annual energy consumption in Germany is 517 TWh. Thus energy consumption will only rise by 0.5 percent due to the use of electric cars.

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197 Comments on "Volkswagen Plans Massive Electric Car Offensive: 1 Million EVs By 2025"

newest oldest most voted
REXisKing

The only reason I now believe them:
1) The car looks good, so it’s meant to be sold in numbers.
2) Tesla is at a yearly build rate of 300,000 cars, so, they’d be insane to ignore Tesla’s massive success.

Vexar

Talk is still cheap, though. 1 million of these BEV models would make me very happy. I see battery contracts in the works, marketing… just gotta convince the dealers now. At least they are showing it with links on their website easy enough to find:
http://www.vw.com/electric-concepts/section/id-crozz/
Oddly, when you go to the BMW website (and they are not related), the layout is nearly identical.

yo

In the EU auto manufactures don’t have to sell through independent dealers like in the US…

Ricardo

And yet they still choose to. Why? Because they are silly? Do the math for crying out loud.

theflew

You don’t have to convince dealers if this is one of the few products they have to sell.

Al D

VW isn’t worried about cash-strapped Tesla. VW is trying to get the jump on the big manufacturers. I see Tesla having a problem surviving beyond 5 years due to production exceeding sales. I believe Tesla’s lack of financial support and the upcoming competition from all the big manufacturers, including the Chinese, will likely have a major impact on Tesla. That’s one big reason why I wouldn’t buy a Tesla if I wanted an EV.

drpawansharma

You realize that we have been hearing prognosis like this for past 10 years

Dam

Yeah and you will see wtih Q3 result, it s the end of the road

SteveSeattle

This is not very ambitious considering the size of VW group and that Tesla has shown that if you develop a compelling car people will want to buy them.

eject

I do think it is ambitious although not extreme.

antrik

As far as I can tell, the planned EV volumes in relation to VWs total volume should put them right in line with the overall market, if EV share continues to increase exponentially, as it has over the past several years. So the plans are not particularly ambitious — though still better than most other legacy makers it seems…

eject

They are planning to be at 25% electric output in 2025 (the 10% is just the ID.). This is way above average. The VAG is the world largest manufacturer. The number two, Toyota, will be able to meet regulatory demands in 2025 just using their hybrid technology so they won’t be forced to build any pure BEV.

antrik

The overall EV market share will reach around 25% in 2025, if we continue to see roughly doubling share every two years. So again, VW’s plans are right in the middle.

It’s certainly true that not all legacy makers will ramp up enough to reach that value: but that just means they will lose market share to more aggressive players — such as Tesla, BYD etc. — rather than dragging down the overall EV penetration.

(The PHEV vs. BEV distribution is another question… I personally think that by 2025, the vast majority of EVs will be all-electric — but that remains to be seen.)

Al D

I wouldn’t go overboard in the EV market if I were a major manufacturer because I’d have so many ICE and hybrid vehicles making money for me. Tesla doesn’t have that luxury.

mike

I just wish they would actually make something already.
It seems every month that VW has yet another press release about something they’re thinking of hopefully doing in five years, maybe seven.
Now is the time to stop talking and do something.

AlanSqB

They could quite possibly be on their 1 millionth demo vehicle by 2030 at the rate they are going.

I agree. Get something to market or shut up VW.

Nono13

To be fair they have already 2 electric VW cars. Plus the Audi E-tron is in production since a month ago, with a maximum charge of 150 kW (best rate to date).

Pushmi-Pullyu

The e-Tron is just a compliance car. Audi isn’t even going to stock it at dealerships; it will be special order only.

Sales of the e-Golf in the U.S. are not much better. Perhaps in Europe it sells better, but here it’s just another compliance car. In fact, sales have been tapering off over the past several months.

If VW follows through on the announcements here, then it’s going to be the first major auto maker to sell BEVs which will actually compete in a meaningful way with their own gasmobiles. Contrary to comments above arguing that this plan is not very ambitious, it’s by far the most ambitious plan we’ve seen for putting BEVs into mass production! And if the reports of VW investing $48 billion (!!) to ensure future battery supply is true, then VW’s output of BEVs will dwarf Tesla’s output within a few years.

Link

They are building the capacity of 70k e-Trons annualy, these aren’t compliance car numbers. They adapted their whole Brussels factory, making it EV only and transfered production of the Audi A1 to Spain. They aren’t doing that for a few compliance cars.

The e-Golf is completely sold out in Europe, that’s why they aren’t shipping anymore to North America, it just sells too well localy. Given that the e-Golf gets discontinued once the ID Neo arrives it might actually be sold out for life.

antrik

The $48 billion in battery contracts (*not* investments!) seems to be about as much as they need for the “first wave” of 10 million MEB cars from 2020 – 2026; which should amount to some 2.5 million in 2025 I think. That might be enough to more or less match Tesla’s output (depending on how fast they scale), but not to “dwarf” them.

Bimberle

“it will be special order only”
And that’s ok for Tesla but not VW because…

Dav8or

The same way the critics said that GM wasn’t serious about the Bolt because they weren’t offering any good lease deals, but Tesla doesn’t offer leases at all.

antrik

GM offers good lease deals, but only in ZEV markets. And such a differentiation indeed *does* show that it’s a compliance vehicle, not a serious competitor.

antrik

Because Tesla only has one class, rather than treating EVs as second-class…

antrik

Clearly, they are doing a lot. Creating a platform, creating several cars using the platform, building a charging network and a billing solution, building up production capacity, preparing future buyers… What more are they supposed to do?

Link

Build a few of the cars by hand, sell them to their own employees and call it a world wide launch, obviously…

antrik

Normally I’d downvote a comment like that for the derisive tone — but in view of the obvious double standards of certain posters here, I guess it’s kinda fair…

Salem

A car takes 5-7 years from idea to first car rolling of the assembly line.
Audi is already producing their first EV, Porsches debuting theirs next year and prototypes are already being photographed. The VW I.D. is coming early 2020. All of these are close enough that testing has already begun.

antrik

5-7 years? 4-5 years is what I have seen mentioned in other places… Which fits, since apparently VW started working on MEB in late 2015; and the Mission e concept was also unveiled in 2015.

(The e-Tron is a different beast: it started life earlier than that — by the looks of it, originally intended as a compliance car only…)

eject

Before unveiling a concept for production they have easily invested two years without leaking any info about it.

antrik

When they unveiled the Mission e concept, it was likely just a quickly put together prototype, before they decided to actually turn it into a production vehicle and started working on it seriously.

eject

That is where you are wrong. They certainly did build a specced out prototype first. They had all to stuff necessary anyways.

antrik

Yeah, just like all the other EV concepts presented by various VW brands over the years have clearly been proper prototypes of cars that have been in the works for two years and scheduled for production…

Pushmi-Pullyu

You appear confused. Concept cars rarely become production cars, and that’s doubly true for the massive numbers of VW’s previous vaporware EV claims. In fact, these days we’re often seeing “concept cars” which are nothing but renders; the computer-age equivalent of an artist’s concept drawing. That doesn’t indicate any time, energy or money has been spent on developing hardware at all.

Concept cars which get turned into production cars are usually changed quite significantly. It’s rare to see a production car which closely resembles the concept car it’s developed from.

eject

That is why I typed “concept for production”

antrik

And what makes you think the Mission e concept unveiled in 2015 was a “concept for production”?

John Doe

If they make 1 design study/prototype for each model they sell – that equals a lot. It’s not like they make only 20-30 vehicle models a year..

Jax

They need 5-7 months, not years.

antrik

Hahaha, that’s a good one 😛

Speculawyer

Well….they DO have some EVs on the market. They are just really lame. VW has the eGolf that is largely like the LEAF delivered 5 years later. It’s so lame that it sells in the double digits per month! Sister companies Audi & Porsche have some PHEVs that are OK but nothing great.

If they really want to sell electrics, they need better designs and cheap battery production.

antrik

The e-Golf sells very well in Europe — so well that there is a large back-log of orders. (But then again, that’s true for almost BEVs in Europe…)

Phteven

The eGolf is an excellent car. It’ll soon be eclipsed by newer models at the same or lower prices with bigger batteries and faster charging. But that doesn’t change the fact that it’s extremely practical and a pleasure to drive.

groingo

Do you notice all these lofty time lines keep getting longer and longer, shut up and build the dam cars!

Brian

Actually, quite the contrary. I have noticed that the target date for MEB has remained at 2020 for several years now.

Neophraz

https://www.greencarreports.com/news/1086902_volkswagen-will-be-the-biggest-electric-car-maker-in-2018-it-says?fbclid=IwAR0Q-7ToRy0IPx_HpdY2Al1fbwRL3I4krEipViwtUKbdg3tBp5MxEilSOSk
their target date just keeps getting moved further and further into the future while their hot air blow harder and harder.

Nono13

Why are you lying ?

amt

I THOUGHT TESLA WAS THE ONLY ONE THAT IS NEVER ON TIME …R O T F L M A O….People Just Don’t Get it . These Time Lines are NEVER Written In Stone …It’s Impossible ….

Clive

I’d hate to sit in that back seat.

eject

It won’t offer a huge amount of space but it will be more comfortable than in the Model 3.

antrik

What makes you think that?

eject

They said it offers the same amount of space on the inside as the Passat. In the Passat, even in the Golf, an adult can sit in the back with their knees in a natural angle and their hair not touching the roof.

Clive

It looks the same as the Model 3.

Bad angle regardless.

mjpk

They have said that the seats are just illustration purposes, so seat angles and such will likely differ.

amt

Very Offensive ! To All…

Clive

I am more interested in them actually executing these plans instead of BSing with all this modern day Buzz !

Scott Franco

I love how these press releases just assume Tesla does not exist.

Clive

True.

Tesla is smiling big time right in their face.

EV Tart

You are wrong. The company’s full strategy assumes that Tesla does not exist.

Scott Franco

🙂

Clive

Exactly !

Clive

Oh but they do exist

William

Tesla is the proverbial “new kid on the block”, and he has the cool new car (Model 3) that EVerybody wants to check out, except the legacy ICE OEMs.

eject

Tesla really isn’t a huge deal in Europe. In the EV market it is 1st. Nissan 2nd Renault 3rd BMW. Tesla hardly makes it into the top 20, this is no joke. Also Tesla operates in a price segment VW doesn’t with the exception of Porsche and very few high end Audis.

antrik

Tesla is not big in the largest European markets (especially Germany), since the buyers there in the higher-priced segments tend to prefer local brands. In those markets that have the highest BEV penetration rates, Tesla is among the top sellers though. The more affordable Model 3 with its broader reach is likely to be much more of competitor — and VW knows that.

eject

You can’t expect VW to design cars in such a way that they only will sell well in markets that have strong incentives to go EV. Those incentives will be gone at some point and you can’t live off of Norway alone anyway.

Andy

Even the base Model 3 is going to be significantly more than most VW models (in europe at least) though. There’s definitely a threat there, but the Model 3 still isn’t economically competitive for most people. It may skim off some higher level Passat purchasers though.

Nono13

Don’t forget that sedans are not that popular in Europe. Model 3 will sell well there (here for me) but maybe not as much as many think.

It may have been different if it was already sold in Europe but due to the delays, some people will buy a Kia Niro EV or Hyundai E Kona instead. And remember small SUV are a big hit here.

antrik

Everything so far suggests that just like the IONIQ, the Kona and Niro BEVs will be sold in small numbers regardless of actual demand — so they won’t really be competing with mass-produced vehicles like the Model 3. (Or presumably the ID., when it arrives…)

John Doe

Yeah, and that is too bad. They offer competetive EVs with a very good range, and highly competetive prices. The EV models could have sold a lot more. Some people in Norway pays $12k extra to buy a good spot in the waiting line.

antrik

Problem is that they are most likely offering these good prices only because they don’t intend to sell them beyond what they need to fulfil ZEV mandates and emission standards… If they wanted to sell larger numbers, they’d have to be profitable on their own, not just indirectly by saving on fines.

Dam

Tesla only sells in two small & heavily subsidized EU markets.And the brand is unknown by most.Sedans are poor people cars there too, and dying anyway

antrik

Actually, sedans are rich people cars, if anything. There are virtually no cheap sedans in Europe — but quite some premium sedans.

Pushmi-Pullyu

“Tesla really isn’t a huge deal in Europe.”

Not in terms of sales numbers, no. But then, you could have said the same about Tesla in the U.S. last year. What’s Tesla’s market in Europe going to look like in a couple of years? 🙂

However, Tesla most certainly is a huge deal, even in Europe, in terms of putting pressure on legacy auto makers to start making and selling BEVs in large numbers… as this article so spectacularly demonstrates!

Gibber

The real pressure comes from that to produce a profit, now that China has mandatory BEV sales figures and a potential market that could be somewhere close to 500 million cars, all the legacy manufacturers are jumping on board the bandwagon.

antrik

Yet the MEB vehicles will be available in Europe first; and even by 2025, they expect the Chinese market to be “only” about half of all VW EV sales… China clearly matters — but MEB doesn’t seem to be chiefly about China.

Dam

Tesla is irrelevant

EV Tart

This is true. That is why they keep saying , reality will become true when they make EVs , which are designed as EV’s and can drive 300 miles . till VW does that , its not reality.

Clive

Take a long look 👀 in the mirror Dam

Pushmi-Pullyu

It is rather cynical of them to so proudly proclaim all of their “innovations” in building BEVs which were obviously copied from Tesla. 😉

batteries will be liquid cooled/heated and should withstand entire life of the car

range: from 200-340 miles (330-550 km) in WLTP

rear-wheel drive or dual motor all-wheel drive configurations

fast charging at up to 125 kW (DC)

Yeah, all that is quite familiar to Tesla fans. It’s also amusing to see VW brag about the “skateboard” layout for their BEVs (altho they don’t use the term), as though they thought that up themselves.

But hey, I still think VW deserves kudos for being the first major auto maker to commit to building BEVs in large numbers, even if they’re just copying what Tesla has done. At least they picked the right company to copy! 🙂

Scott Franco

I watched the vid. Points:

We stopped using the same chassis for Golf that was used for ICE engines as well, and are now using
a custom design for EVs – Copied from Tesla.

We moved the passenger compartment forward because we don’t need as much space for the engine – Copied from Tesla.

We are using the skateboard design – copied from Tesla

We moved the seats higher to accomidate the battery, because people want to sit higher anyways – copied from Tesla.

We made the battery an integral part of the chassis – copied from Tesla.

Its takes time to copy all that stuff from Tesla, so we really won’t be shipping until 2020. But we are going to be going gangbusters by 2025. By the way, all our business plans assume Tesla stands still.

Vexar

GM invented that skateboard design, just like IBM invented relational databases: they were the first to publish the idea, not the first to implement!

Scott Franco

Sure, and Exxon invented LION batteries (yes, they did). Kodak invented digital cameras. Lots of big companies are first to see what is going to eventually kill them.

Pushmi-Pullyu

Yeah, Kodak invented the digital camera… and then ignored it. Took the words right out of my keyboard, you did! 🙂

theflew

Actually Kodak invented the digital camera and was one of the leaders. They rode the wave until smartphones crushed all point and shoot cameras. Smartphones were convergent tech that took out phones, MP3 players, PDA’s and cameras. The only cameras surviving are pro consumer which was a market Kodak wasn’t really in.

John Doe

They were crushed by Asian manufacturers that had 12 hours days, and used highly underpaid workers.
They were also very smart when it came to integrate cirquits, special made for cameras.
Kind of what happened to DVD players as well. Highly integrated and highly specialized factory, in a low cost country, with almost no labour laws.

eject

There was a A class Mercedes in the 90s that had a battery floor. Back then it was NiMH and they only made a handful but the design is obvious and old.

AzzyLand

You are right. I found a pdf about it. Quite interesting.
http://www.meridian-int-res.com/Projects/AClass_EV.pdf

antrik

How do their business plans assume Tesla stands still?

We should applaud them for understanding (and advertising) what makes a good BEV — most legacy makers still haven’t managed that…

Pushmi-Pullyu

That would be like applauding the forger for his skill at copying the original.

Admittedly there is some skill involved there, but no vision or creative talent.

antrik

OK, you convinced me. All combustion cars ever are forgeries of Daimler’s design, and no other combustion car maker ever deserves any credit, since they just copied Daimler’s original, no vision or creative talent. End of discussion.

Nono13

All these points are just the logical approach when one considers the difference between an ICE and an electric motor with very heavy batteries.

Speculawyer

Well, in their defense, good engineering designs will tend to converge. Those are all largely obvious things to do…and that’s why most of them are not patentable .

Pushmi-Pullyu

“…all our business plans assume Tesla stands still.”

Yeah, this is the flaw with VW and other legacy auto makers imitating Tesla; they are aiming to match what Tesla’s tech is is now, not what Tesla’s tech will be when VW’s mass production BEVs start entering the market.

But hey, at least (assuming these announcements are true) VW is making a serious effort, which is more than you can say about any other legacy auto maker!

antrik

Yeah, I’m sure Tesla’s tech in 2020 will be totally different, and VW will rue the moment they decided to “copy” Tesla’s present approach, instead of coming up with something completely different…

theflew

I didn’t know Tesla designed a platform they could use for several different models. That’s the real achievement. As far as battery placement where else were you going to put them?

Dave86

LOL!!!!!

The giant Volkswagen company plans to start doing in 2020 what tiny start-up Tesla is doing now?

So the question is: when will Tesla start selling one million cars per year? Most likely sooner than Volkswagen’s planned year of 2025.

Volkswagen should plan to have 50% of their cars sold in 2025 be BEV.

Andy

Good job VW have their 9 million other vehicles to fall back on then.;)

Scott Franco

“tiny start up”???

Dam

15yo startup LOL

Pushmi-Pullyu

I guess he didn’t got the memo that Tesla now has the #4 best-selling car in the U.S. 😉

antrik

25%, 50%… Not that much of a difference 🙂

(25% is the 2025 target across the entire VW group. More for Audi and especially Porsche; less for the cheaper brands.)

Lou Grinzo

So much for my hope of seeing a “we’re all in this together” mindset flourish on this site.

If VW sees a veritable buttload of EVs, great! Ditto for GM, Ford, Hyundai/Kia, etc. If Tesla sells even more than we expect, great! I don’t give a rat’s you-know-what who sells them, as long as a lot of them wind up on the road, including cars, school buses, long-distance trucks, the whole smash.

John Doe

Could not agree more. We need volume EV production. Model 3, LEAF and to a certain degree i3 and Zöe is the slow start to volume EV production. We need 3-5 million EVs a year, to really see the big change.
Then we need production like that for years to weed out ICE cars from the total number of cars on the market.

YVES LAURIN

I million cars per year is not feasible for Tesla right now, they need more manufacturing plan

Jax

They have one in China…

Andy

They are planning on one in China. Difference there. Production is scheduled to start in around 3 years with full production around 2023/4, so they’ll be at around 1 million all going well at about the same time the ID line is, all going well.

Pushmi-Pullyu

Yeah, they are planning one in China and one somewhere in Europe, but those have yet to be built.

I wonder if Tesla will use the “Production line inside a tent” idea to get production going in Shanghai before the actual factory is built? I can certainly see an advantage to them doing that!

John Doe

Would that not be a risk due to climate and humidity?

I have been to a few electronics manufacturers in China, and due to the high humidity they did not have to install expensive ESD floors in the production facility. But they had to invest in post production equipment, for storage and packaging, to prevent moisture to come in contact with the finished product during shipping.

The same was the production of frames for printers, copiers and what not. Without proper facilities they got rust problems with welding joints. We traced back problems to the source.

GuyMan

Given the upcoming trade wars, we’ll see how well that works out for them… Before it’s all said and done with China, I wouldn’t be surprised if a few US companie’s Chinese facilities get “nationalized” just for good measure.

Personally, I would keep going with a factory design, but you might want to slow up putting steel in the ground, if you’re a US company in China.. IMHO, trade and relations are going to get much worse before they have any remote chance of improving in 2020, given the current political climate, and relations with China

antrik

Actually, the trade war is a reason to *accelerate* the Chinese factory, since that’s the only way to stay relevant at all in the biggest EV market by far…

GuyMan

I agree China is the biggest EV market, and manufacturing in country would be a viable way around tarriffs.

But it’s MHO, that things are going to get way worse and go beyond tarriffs before this is all said and done. And US companies are going to be removed from China, and US citizens also barred from the country. We’ll see in 2019, if my pessimism is warranted

Bottom line, I would be cautious putting large sums of fixed capitial in China these days, and there are many other venue’s in AP

antrik

Not right now — but it won’t take long. They will be at or near 500,000 next year. 2020 might see a bit of a slowdown, since Model Y probably won’t see huge numbers yet; but for 2021, a million seems pretty safe…

amt

Sold By 2025 …Yea, Sold As Teslas By Tesla ……..lmao

Jax

Tesla should sell 1 million in 2020.

antrik

Doesn’t seem likely — unless they ramp up Model Y production very fast, or ramp Model 3 production way beyond original plans…

Latest estimate from Elon was some 700,000 – 800,000 cars in 2020.

theflew

Like to know where they are going to build that many. They’re struggling with a third of that at Fremont.

Gibber

Safe to assume all of us here are fans of the BEV so it’s easy for us to forget that the general public is still very leery of BEV ownership. Saying VW should be building five million BEVs would mean you assume they could find a willing buyer for each one.

theflew

I think the key word is they are planning. I’m not sure Tesla does a lot of that up front years in advance. VW will never call a car roll out “production hell”. This is how you roll out a product when you’ve done it millions of times before.

antrik

Of course Tesla is planning in advance — one model at a time. Sure, established makers tend to do some rough planning beyond models they have currently in development; but other than that, there is not much difference.

EV Tart

The news should be VW plans to do this again , with all investments in marketing and none in core EV technologies

Scott Franco

Notice also how the radiators are getting bigger and bigger on BEVs, as I talked about a while back. The idea that “BEVs don’t need air intakes” was and IS a canard. Both for driving and especially high power charging, BEVs are increasingly all about getting rid of heat. See also the “Model 3 on the autobahn” video. To really drive the car flat out, and to charge at sub-15 minute levels, it is ALL ABOUT getting rid of the heat.

EV Tart

The reason big radiators is that , it was made by the marketing department , with little less knowledge. The engineering is sill busy with minimum funds allocated for ICE engine. All remaining funds goto lobbing to govt and cheat devices

eject

The radiators are also for harvesting heat in moderate climates, they are gas/liquid heat exchangers and work both ways. You have to keep the battery at approx 40°C which in most of the world most of the year is 25°C over ambient. Doing this with resistive heating is inefficient so you use a heat pump and that needs a heat exchanger.

Tid

I am pretty sure 40°C is the upper limit of the battery’s operating range, not the temperature you want to keep the battery at.

eject

The exact temperature depends on the chemistry but around 40°C is ideal for charging and discharging NMC. Both the Audi and the IPace aim to keep the battery within that temperature.

antrik

I don’t think there is a single “ideal” temperature. AIUI, it’s a trade-off between maximal power and minimal degradation…

antrik

Not sure the radiator on this is really bigger, as opposed to simply arranged differently…

HVACman

There are typically at least 3 “radiators” in an EV: one for the battery cooling, one for the power electronics/motor cooling, and one for the AC/heat pump refrigerant condenser. So lots of outside air – over 2,400 cubic feet per minute on hot days – has to flow through these radiators. It can be pulled through a traditional front grille or pulled in from below the bumper or pulled in through side vents near the headlamps. Most use some combination of two or all three concepts. Most of the ones that use the traditional front grilles also incorporate active shutters behind them to partially or completely close off the opening and clean up the front aero when less cooling air is required.

antrik

Do the motor and battery cooling loops really have two separate radiators?

Note that the topic was radiators, not grilles…

Speculawyer

They certainly need air intakes. But they don’t need traditional grilles because they don’t need big radiators. If they have really big radiators then they are probably doing something wrong. For example, the one above seems ridiculous. Tesla doesn’t have a radiator like that.

antrik

Tesla’s seems less prominent, because it’s more angled, and has more depth rather instead of frontal area I think — I’d be surprised if it actually has less cooling surface area…

Scott

1 million sounds like a lot but it will still be less than 10% of VW production. With the rate evs are growing 10% in 2025 will be way behind the overall market. I expect VW to increase this target over the next few years.

Andy

VW group sell over 300 different models. Do you really expect them to convert 150 different models to EV in a few years?

To put that in perspective, that 10% could be 30 different cars, in six years.

scott

no, but I expect them to reach more than 10% EVs by 2025. And I think they will exceed that. If not, they will be losing market share because I expect EVs to be 20-30% of the overall market by 2025.

Andy

20-30%?

Where are these EV’s coming from? VW has one of the most ambitions EV plans of the established manufacturers so… We’re looking at closer to 10% realistically.

antrik

If the established makers indeed fail to ramp up fast enough to satisfy global demand, the Chinese will be very happy to jump in…

Pushmi-Pullyu

It’s said that New York City went from a city almost entirely served by horse-drawn vehicles to one almost entirely served by motor vehicles in the space of 13 years.

If legacy auto makers are not prepared to shift that rapidly from almost entirely gasmobiles/diesel-mobiles to almost entirely BEVs, then they’re going to fall behind and lose market share as the EV revolution advances.

Sure, over the next 2-3 years, the EV portion of the market is still going to be fairly small. But I think it’s increasingly obvious that the EV revolution has finally started to show the classic “S-curve” of accelerating adoption, and it won’t be long until “10% of production shifted to EVs in a few years” is going to be far too slow at converting factories to building BEVs.

comment image

antrik

EV adoption has been on the exponential part of the S-curve for years.

antrik

The 1 million figure is for ID. only. Across the entire VW group, the plan is for 3 million.

scott

well that’s good if true, but not what the article says “Production of affordable, long-range electric cars is expected to increase and hit more than one million by 2025.”

where did you get the 3 million number?

eject

They said in other releases that they want to be at 25% BEV in 2025. Since they produced 10.6 million units in 2017 you would assume that they plan for about 12 million units in 2025 and a quarter of that is about 3 million. The current EVs will be still on sale although some of them in recycled form at the VW family members Seat and Skoda. This also includes light trucks, lorries and vans of which they do make BEV versions not based on the MEB at all.

antrik

Don’t remember exact source — but I’m quite certain I’ve seen it mentioned at least once. It would also fit better with 25% across all VW brands by 2025, which is another figure VW mentioned a couple of times in the past; and also with 10 million MEB cars from 2020-2026.

Scott

Ok. That’s better. I think about 25% is where the market will be in 2025. So that would put VW on a good track.

eject

The haters will be woken up with a bang.

SansIce

Yata Yata Yata – same #**& different day. I will believe it when I see it.

Speculawyer

Will they have the battery manufacturing capacity?

EV Tart

No , only marketing budgets

antrik

The press release *explicitly* says they have the battery contracts in place.

Speculawyer

That may or may not work. Contractors sometimes come up short. There is a lot of investment & risk involved….are people going to invest hugely in a big battery factory and assume that VW will have the sales volume to support it?

Ask any car company about contractors….sometimes it work, sometimes they deliver parts that just don’t meet the specs.

EV Tart

So VW will bring costs down for EV’s and make it a reality by having battery contracts ??? Does it even make sense ?

antrik

Yes, when VW is in the market for some 250 GWh of batteries, that’s a pretty good reason for suppliers to scale up capacity and bring down costs.

Pushmi-Pullyu

The PR mentions a pilot project for making cells, but mostly VW will be relying on existing battery manufacturers. However, if the reports of VW committing $48 billion (!!) to ensure near-term battery supply are even remotely close to being true, then VW is essentially subsidizing battery manufacturers building out a lot of new high-capacity factories.

Seems like a strange way to do business; wouldn’t it make more sense for VW to partner with battery makers, as Tesla has partnered with Panasonic? But since VW is doing that pilot project, it seems pretty clear they are keeping their options open. Who knows? They might decide to shift to the Tesla/Panasonic business plan in another couple of years or so, depending on how things work out for them — or don’t.

https://cleantechnica.com/2018/05/04/volkswagen-doubles-ev-battery-order-to-48-billion/

antrik

Yes, they said they *might* consider building their own production for “next-gen” (i.e. solid state) batteries. For now, they are doing some of their own research, which they hope to apply even in “traditional” cells produced by contractors. (Kinda like Tesla…)

I don’t know why you think that would be a strange way to do business. Do you think it strange that Qualcomm, Apple, Nvidia etc. do not build their own chip foundries?…

EV Tart

Since battery is the Sigle biggest cost , the manufactures will make money. Can you give one reason , why Samsung will make such investments and not sell at the highest cost , they can get ??? You understand business .

battery is not in oversupply….

Link

Because they have a contract with VW.

theflew

Single biggest cost, but they are also the biggest commodity. You can buy cells from many suppliers.

John Doe

Battery cells are a comodity, and they source cells from at least 4 manufacturers.
If one manufacturer is too expensive, they will have their income reduced by a few billions. As a cell manufacturer, economy of scale is important. If they produce less then the factory is designed for, cost pr unit will rise.
Eventually, I would think it could be economical to produce their own cells. But when you buy, you can buy the best tech, and don’t have to worry about R&D costs, and if they have the best tech.

I would not rule out a cooperation between brands in the future, to get volume up and cost down.

Surpriced me that Bosch did not want to invest in batteries. They had done research and had test production going. Investments was too huge, compared to the profit they would make, they claimed.

Give it 5 years, and we will see what would be the best move.

theflew

They are partnering it’s just with 3 partners. Being co-located like Tesla and Panasonic is a different thing.

Fungus

This has to be the longest article of bullcrap copy paste blabla ive ever scrolled thru to get to the comment field.

You could have saved your copy finger at stopped at the ingress….

«VW gonna make a lot of BEV’s in the future. X amount in 2025, and Y amount in 2030»

Where is the NEWS in VW daydreaming about the future?
What about writing articles about what VW actually do, NOW? TODAY?

2030… pfffhh, Do you know how many generations of technology evolvement that might have passed by 2030?

antrik

There is actually no mention of 2030 in the press release. It doesn’t go beyond 2025. It’s about exactly *one* generation of technology: the first generation of their MEB platform.

And there is a lot of interesting info in the press release that hasn’t been published on this site thus far, to the best of my knowledge. You may not appreciate that, but others do.

antrik

Some important clarifications:

The 1 million figure is for the ID. vehicles only — across all brands, VW is targetting 3 millions per year by 2025.

The “first wave” of 10 million cars based on MEB is planned for 2020-2026. (According to https://edison.handelsblatt.com/erleben/vw-startet-countdown-zur-grossen-elektro-offensive/23093964.html ) Apparently that simply refers to the first generation of the MEB platform.

The first ID. model will start production in November 2019, and come to market in Q1 2020.

The 30 minutes charging is to 80%, not full.

(⌐■_■) Trollnonymous
Tronald Dump

Yada, yada, yada….please change the record…

(⌐■_■) Trollnonymous
antrik

He wanted you to change the record, not just skip to the next track 😛

(Your reply did strangely crack me up, though 🙂 )

Dam

I love my Multivan but I cannot wait for this awesome ID Buzz

Henry

The tiny upstart Tesla is already on its way to 1M annual production by the time GF3 goes online in ~2020. What’s taking VW so long ?

Pushmi-Pullyu

To paraphrase an older comment from abc123:

Tesla is creating market demand whereas Volkswagen is merely responding to market demand. Therefore, VW will always be behind the curve when it comes to producing and marketing plug-in EVs.

Well, maybe not always. But certainly for the next 10 or perhaps even 15 years.

antrik

I’m not sure I entirely agree at this point. All this PR they are doing lately sounds like they have actually come around to actively trying to crank up demand… No longer “yeah, we will make some BEVs too”, but rather, “our BEVs will be great, you should seriously consider them!”

Diesel

This is great VW now start selling a car. We have seen the MEB before and the hype. Give us something to buy.

Speculawyer

That list of specs for the MEB platform is pretty funny…it basically exactly describes the current Tesla specs.

antrik

If they can indeed bring it to much cheaper cars, that will be a major breakthrough though.

theflew

You mean the greater than $50k Tesla’s? I can guarantee there is a whole lot of cars around the world sold for a lot less.

Pushmi-Pullyu

WOW!

It looks like one major auto maker — Volkswagen — is finally getting serious about making and selling compelling BEVs in large numbers! In the past, VW has been the “King of Vaporware” when it comes to making announcements about putting EVs into production but not following through. However, I get the sense that they are serious about this. Here’s hoping that this isn’t just a massive case of greenwashing!

There’s far too much in these various announcements to cover in one comment, but I’m pleased and excited to see VW’s plan for facilitating use of public chargers from a variety of vendors, with a centralized billing system. That is something for which there is a crying need, and I hope VW can succeed at that.

* * * * *

“As early as 2020 we intend to sell 150,000 e-cars, of which 100,000 will be the ID. and ID. SUV,” says Thomas Ulbrich, Member of the Volkswagen Brand Board of Management, E-Mobility division.

Again, I hope that’s really true and not just more of VW’s vaporware.

Okay, I’ll say it: Go Volkswagen!

Kieran973

And from 2018-2020, we vow to sell 0 electric cars!

Link

E-Golf, e-Up (Citigo/Mii), e-Tron, e-Tron Sportback, and Taycan will be sold between 2018 and 2020.

antrik

AIUI, the Taycan won’t actually go to salesrooms before 2020…

Kieran973

In the US? Besides $70,000 luxury cars, what are they selling here? They just discontinued the e-Golf….

ffbj
Robert

Who cares about 2025, todays date is October 5 2018. What have they done today? I know they sold 14 E Golfs.

Paul GOVAN

Neverending jam-tomorrow promises – year afer year, decade after decade from the Boy Cried Wolfsburg brigade. Why do so-called “journalists” continually consent to parrot these anytime-but-now PRess Release promises ?
Beggars belief.

Paul G

G2

Wait, watch, and shoot as required.

G2

Let’s congratulate VW Group on ‘Talking the Talk’ and watch them like hawks to see they ‘Walk the Walk’ and not pull another ‘Clean Dieselgate’ debacle.

yo
For those in the EU… An updated eUP (which they obviously still dont produce according to the trolls) https://pushevs.com/2018/10/04/more-info-about-volkswagen-electric-triplets/ From a forum linked in that article… VWs BEV EU plans… Volkswagen close contact has created a table with all future VAG BEVs he could find in the system. Sorted by the launch date. These are just the vehicles that are produced in Europe. USA, China are not there. The biggest part has already been in the media, what was new to me is the Transporter / Multivan in 11/2020, another VW MEB SUV in 02/2021 and the E5 Avant. As always: unofficial data without guarantee 😀 2018 10/2018: VW Nutzf. eCrafter 10/2018: VW Nutzf. MOIA transporter 11/2018: Audi e-tron 2019 08/2019: Porsche Taycan Turbo 10/2019: e-Up! (PA2) 10/2019: Skoda Citigo 11/2019: Seat Mii 11/2019: Porsche Taycan 11/2019: Audi e-tron Sportback 2020 01/2020: VW Neo 04/2020: Audi e-tron S 04/2020: Audi e-tron Sportback S 08/2020: VW Crozz 11/2020: Seat MEB short tail 11/2020: Porsche Taycan Cross Turismo 11/2020: VW Nutzf. Box truck long overhang 11/2020: VW Nutzf. Combination long / short overhang 11/2020: VW Nutzf. Multivan long / short overhang 12/2020: Skoda MEB SUV (2 variants) 2021 01/2021: Audi e-tron GT… Read more »
antrik

Two interesting bits from the press release that might get lost in the noise:

* VW intends to offer V2H (vehicle-to-home) capabilities.

* Aside from the drivetrain, the MEB platform will also be a first for VW in using a central controller / OS, to offer flexibility and OTA upgrade capability. (Much like Tesla… What a coincidence! 😉 )

Bob Wilson

The electric power chart is fun:

11 kW ~= 46A @240VAC, NEMA 14-50 range, installed in 2016
22 kW ~= 92A @240VAC, my home service was upgraded to 200A in 2016

CU

“A global sales volume of 150,000 e-cars is planned for 2020, set to rise to more than one million by 2025”

That is a dissapointing low target! Less than what Tesla will produce.

Niki

Tesla will produce 1 million BEV’s in 2020 or 2021…

viriato

The big boys are on march.

In Europe, all the makers must sell at least a 20% of their cars under a 50 gr CO2/km, 30% in 2030, so if you gonna need lot of EVs to accomplish the rules, why not push the change far away, and get as soon as possible the benefits of mass production an big volumes for electric vehicles?.

Ricardo

Except for a few obvious trolls, it’s nice to see everyone happy and excited about new choices and possibilities. Let’s hope Hyundai too can join our party soon. We know they have good stuff.

Al D

The Hyundai Kona and Kia Niro EV’s also look very promising. Within a few years, there will be dozens of EV’s available.

Dima

Most people in Europe drive far shorter distances compared to Americans. So the EV uptake is easier in terms of range issues in Europe than in America.

On the other hand, there is less disposable income for buying new cars in Europe compared to the US.

James

Doesn’t seem particularly ambitious. 10M would be better.

antrik

By 2025? That would be close to 100% of all cars across the entire VW group… I don’t see that happening before 2029 or so.

James

If it took Dieselgate for the ID program to be born, so be it. It’s not a Tesla story where s modern day Henry Ford visionary started a car company to change the world….But if VW does indeed follow through and make millions of ID based affordable EVs, we all will benefit from a story that began with the world’s largest automaker cheating a million innocent customers and several governments with TDI.

The design looks real and the skateboard platform is the way to go. If VW builds these in large numbers, we will reach the tipping point where all other gas OEMs will have to follow.

Frank

Just an idiot would buy a car from VW Group. these cheaters with their trash deserve to go bankrupt

Rory

Fantastic article giving a true insight to future driver experience along with a general view on how we should be planning life in the Not so distant future. So excited.