Toyota Mirai Will Launch In Canada This Year

1 week ago by Mark Kane 78

Toyota presents its hydrogen fuel cell flagship at the 2018 Montréal International Auto Show, announcing at the same time Mirai sales will begin in Canada.

Toyota Mirai

The Mirai will soon be available for purchase, starting in Québec.

The Japanese manufacturer sees Canada as well suite for Mirai due mostly to the fact that hydrogen production can use clean hydroelectricity.

Hopefully there will be some announcement soon on the infrastructure rollout.

Test drives were conducted at the Montreal International Auto Show.

More from the press blast:

“Montreal, Québec, ―Toyota Canada today took an important step towards the future of sustainable mobility in Canada, announcing that the Toyota Mirai―powered by hydrogen fuel cell electric powertrain technology―is coming to Canada this year. As Toyota kicked off its participation in the Montréal International Auto Show, the company confirmed it would launch starting with select fleets in Québec, where the Mirai will take advantage of the province’s clean hydroelectric power generation to offer drivers a remarkably clean, more sustainable alternative to the conventional automobile.

“Toyota is passionate about helping Canada, and societies around the world, enjoy a greener future―as we have outlined in our Environmental Challenge 2050. And the Mirai―a zero-emissions, production model sedan―is an important milestone as we work to achieve this,” said Martin Gilbert, Director of Sales Planning and Innovation, Toyota Canada Inc. “Working closely with the Québec government and key stakeholders, we feel the time is right to put Mirai on the road in the province.”

“Québec is well positioned to become a world leader in terms of energy transition, a challenge for all modern economies”, said Pierre Moreau, Minister of Energy and Natural Resources. “This challenge cannot be solved alone; it’s by building strategic partnerships with companies like Toyota, which today launches the Mirai, a fuel cell electric vehicle, that we will succeed.”

“The arrival of the Mirai in Québec is perfectly in line with the adoption of the zero-emission vehicle (ZEV) standard last December, which aims to substantially increase the number of electric cars on Québec roads”, said Isabelle Melançon, Minister of Sustainable Development, the Environment and the Fight Against Climate Change. “This standard will give Québecers access to a wider range of electric vehicles or plug-in hybrids. Toyota’s announcement demonstrates that builders are hard at work to meet the greenhouse gas reduction targets we collectively set for the benefit of our planet and future generations.”

The Mirai’s introduction follows the successful market launch of the Toyota Prius Prime plug-in hybrid vehicle. The company launched a real-world market trial of Prius Prime in Québec in mid-2017, and the overwhelming success of that experience has set the stage for expanding Prius Prime to the rest of Canada this year. It also created a blueprint for advanced technology vehicle introductions―one that will help Toyota ensure that Canadians embrace fuel cell electric vehicles such as the Mirai with the same enthusiasm that they have shown for the Prius and other electrified Toyota vehicles.

Of course, Mirai needs a source of hydrogen, and since Hydro Québec is the world’s fourth-largest producer of clean hydro-electricity that means that the hydrogen used to drive Mirai will be produced from remarkably clean sources too. Toyota Canada has been working closely with partners in Québec over the past year―in particular, the Ministries of Energy, Environment, and Transportation―to ensure the introduction of an appropriate fueling infrastructure in the province.

With its advanced technology under the hood, the 2018 Toyota Mirai delivers three key benefits that Toyota feels are important to Canadians. First, there’s no need for range anxiety, as the Mirai can travel more than 500 km on a tank of hydrogen. Second, refuelling time is similar to a regular gasoline vehicle, taking approximately five minutes to refill the tank. And third, the Mirai has proven cold-weather reliability―especially important as many parts of Canada have experienced new, record-cold temperatures this winter.

Mirai stores hydrogen in its fuel tank. This is combined with oxygen in the fuel cell stack. The resulting chemical reaction produces two things: electricity, and water. The electricity powers the vehicle, delivering 151 peak horsepower and up to 247 lb-ft of torque. And the water leaves through the tailpipe as Mirai’s only emission.

Beyond its remarkable power supply, however, the Mirai delivers exactly what drivers have come to expect of Toyota: a stylish, feature-rich, fun-to-drive four-door sedan. The aerodynamic body is highlighted by LED headlamps and daytime running lights, touch sensor front door handles and trunk lid, and 17″ alloy wheels. Noise-reducing glass contributes to a quiet, comfortable cabin, featuring eight-way power adjustable front seats, heated seats for everyone, electronic push button start with Smart Key, a heated, power adjustable steering wheel with built-in multifunction controls, a premium audio system with navigation, and more. And as a Toyota, the Mirai also delivers the peace of mind of uncompromised safety, including radar cruise control, pre-collision system, lane departure alert, automatic high beams, eight airbags, a back-up camera, blind spot monitor with rear cross traffic alert, and more.

The Toyota Mirai will go on sale later this year. The vehicle will be on display at the 2018 Montréal International Auto Show, where visitors to the show will be the very first in Canada to have the opportunity to book test drives and engage with the interactive and informative TimePlay Mirai experience as part of the Toyota exhibit. The Montréal International Auto Show takes place January 19-28 at the Palais des Congrès de Montréal.”

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78 responses to "Toyota Mirai Will Launch In Canada This Year"

  1. Get Real says:

    That’s funny, I wonder if they suckered the Canadian Government into building them a few token fueling stations at over one million a pop too like the idiots at CARB did?

    I’ll believe that the H2 Unicorn is for real when the Big Oil companies pushing this fantasy get off their asses and start building AT THEIR EXPENSE the fueling stations and distribution network AND selling the H2 without subsidies.

    Until then it is nothing more then a distraction aimed at lamely trying to slow PEV adoption.

    1. G2 says:

      Yes; Canadian citizens will be paying for some token H filling stations…ugh….

      1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

        Canadians will pay for whatever they want, just like others in the world. They certainly don’t ask for advice from some Illuminati hunting moonbat crazies.

        1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

          So does that mean you’re gonna stop posting, or at least stop promoting the “hydrogen economy” hoax?

    2. floydboy says:

      Why would they do that? There’s a reason the oil companies have hot and cold running lobbyists on tap. As much smack as they talk about the “private sector”, through their lobbyists, they take in an inordinate amount of government largesse and have completely rigged the system as a result.

      Now they simply get the taxpayers to foot the bills, while they rake in the rewards if it succeeds or walk away and leave them holding the bag if it fails.

      1. G2 says:

        On. The. Nose.

    3. Prsnep says:

      $2 million spent on 2 hydrogen fueling stations is not the epitome of government waste. That works out to about 25 cents per Quebec resident. That’s an worthwhile investment to study the feasibility of a new relatively revolutionary technology.

      Now, if they were planning on building 50 stations all over the province, I’d buy your argument.

      1. floydboy says:

        There’s nothing NEW about hydrogen fuel cells. Their use in passenger vehicles have been the dream of many for a long time. What IS relatively new is the major oil companies taking an interest in the manufacture of hydrogen as a way to remain viable as the go-to entities for refueling those passenger vehicles.

        By touting hydrogen as “clean”(by simply making no distinction as to how it’s obtained), they get to extend their reach into the future by continuing the ‘you must fuel at the pump’ paradigm.

        1. Prsnep says:

          > By touting hydrogen as “clean”(by simply making no distinction as to how it’s obtained)

          1. In Quebec, it’d be obtained from hydroelectricity. 2. Nobody seems to care about the source of electricity for electric cars.

          Look, I’m pro electric cars. But I’m also not anti hydrogen. We’re at the start of a transition that will take 50 years to complete. In the long run, the better technology will always win on merit alone. Or maybe there is room for more than one technology. It’s just not worthwhile to complain about measly 2 fueling stations built during the pilot phase.

          1. floydboy says:

            You missed my point. The oil company doesn’t care about your hydroelectric dams. That’s merely the source of electricity. They care about where the HYDROGEN comes from. They want that to be from THEM. How do they currently obtain the bulk of their hydrogen? Steam reformation of fracked natural gas.

            Hence my remark about “clean”. They say ‘clean’ to mean the use of the hydrogen in the vehicle, WITHOUT acknowledging its fossil fuel origins. It’s disingenuous greenwashing. Far more honest(and economical) to just use the fossil fuel, than to use it and pretend you didn’t. By the way, I certainly don’t ‘hate’ hydrogen gas. I do dislike the shenanigans these corporations pull to get others to pay for their hydrogen ventures.

            1. floydboy says:

              misquote; meant to say I’m not “anti-hydrogen”.

            2. earl colby pottinger says:

              Add on even if the hydrogen comes from a clean source, they still want you to come to their fueling stations where you will pay ***THEM*** money.

              With electric you can buy power from the electric company, but you could like me put in your own solar cells or if you are not close to other people your own windmills. You no long have to pay money to the big companies like Shell, Petro-Canada, Esso, etc.

              That is what hydrogen cars mean – you don’t have any control over the source of your power!

          2. Recoil says:

            You do understand how much electricity is wasted in forming it through electrolysis when you could have just put it in an electric car and saved about half of when you spent trying to get the H separated from the O. Anyways it will probably not be done by hydroelectric as that is the most expensive way to do it and instead will be done through natural gas reformation.

        2. EVer says:

          In 2015, 95% of hydrogen was created by reforming(refining)Natural Gas. That leaves 5% to be created by reforming coal or oil, or by electrolysis. Many believe the idea of electrolysis is as yet too expensive a process for hydrogen as a fuel. Would lead one to believe Hydrogen is a scheme for the International Oil Companies to continue controlling the energy markets.

      2. GoBlue88 says:

        A better way to measure that is cost per vehicle.

        California has a population of 39 million compared to Quebec’s 8 million, yet according to CARB, only about 1,600 fuel cell vehicles total have been registered in the state over the last 2 years. Let’s be generous and assume that Quebec residents will also register 1,600 fuel cell vehicles in 2 years. That makes $2MM in stations work out to a cost of $1,250 per vehicle.

        If we assume the same registration rate as California per capita, Quebec will register only about 325 fuel cell vehicles in 2 years. Now you are at a cost of $6,153 per vehicle.

        1. Fact check:
          “Toyota Mirai sales surpass 3000 in California”.
          http://www.motortrend.com/news/toyota-mirai-sales-surpass-3000/
          Honda Clarity FECV sold another ~800, IIRC and has a 10 month waiting list.

          Let’t not forget that with 5 minute fill ups, those 30 statins can fill 10 times more fuel cell cars when they arrive.
          Electric cars in Canada though, different story. Bitter cold will result in ultra slow super charging while you sit and shiver in the cold. Check You You’s supercharging experience: 5 hours and still going!
          Then there is the 50% range loss as the icing on the cake.

          Apples vs. cherries.

          1. earl colby pottinger says:

            Garbage!

            (1) The cold means you need the ten minute pre-heat cycle before you start the charging. That can be done on the way to a super-charger.

            (2) Cold batteries lose 10-15% range not your false claim of 50%.

            (3) Most people in Canada can charge at home overnight where the slow charging of even having cold batteries has no affect on charge cycle.

            1. Really? You You was charging at 89 km/hour. It will be even slower when the battery is 80% full.
              Lots of anecdotes here too.
              https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/superchargers-super-slow.81432/

              If you are okay driving with blankies and three layers of sweat pants, teh weather is fine, road is clear and there is no wind, THEN may be what you say about range loss is ok. Once you start the cabin heater, you are down 20-30% more. Once there is rain or snow and you have to defrost the windshild and run the wipers, lose another 20% easy.
              Heat is free in ICE, hybrids and PHEVs. But very expensive in BEVs.

              1. RCM says:

                Heat is not free in a ICE car either, you have to pay for the gasoline you pump into your car every week don’t you?

                ICE vehicles see a drop in efficiency too in cold climates.

                Besides, reduced range in winter with a BEV isn’t a problem if you know what you’re doing. You just have to buy one that will cover worst case scenario for your daily driving needs.

                1. Bill Howland says:

                  “Heat is not free in an ICE”.

                  Not true, its essentially free. The only additional power consumer is the relatively small (1/8 hp) cabin blower that obviously must be powered to get the heat. But the heat itself would otherwise be discarded outside.

                  I’m amazed at the efficiency of the VOLT in Cold weather, as the cycling engine gives up essentially NO radiator heat to the outside when the heater is on high.

                  Yes the engine produces more waste heat than the heater can use, however, since it is cycling, the heater recoups even that heat before it restarts.

                  I’m amazed how truly LITTLE gasoline it uses compared to all the driving and heating you are getting.

          2. Joshua Burstyn says:

            All the H2 stations I’ve read about take time between cars to recharge their pressure and fill single digit numbers of cars a day as a result. Many are unreliable and they may also only hit 5000 PSI – a half charge.

      3. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        “That’s an worthwhile investment to study the feasibility of a new relatively revolutionary technology.”

        Wrong in every single detail. Fuel cell tech has been in development by auto makers just as long as the modern electric car. In fact, we have seen quotes from auto maker execs stating that part of the reason they’re trying to sell them is to recoup the long years and millions or billions of dollars they have wasted on this dead-end tech.

        We already know how feasible this tech is… or rather, isn’t. We’ve known that for decades. The problem is that some people refuse to accept that reality, just as some people still insist perpetual motion machines (or cold fusion, or LENR, or “zero-point energy”, or “free energy”) might someday work.

        If you doubt that’s true, here’s a 2006 article from a physics site, published even before Elon Musk coined the appropriate phrase “fool cell car”:

        https://phys.org/news/2006-12-hydrogen-economy-doesnt.html

    4. Quebec 100% EV says:

      YUP, you guessed it exactly right: Quebec government just announced that it agreed with Nissan to pay for 50% of the cost of 2 hydrogen filling stations as well as to purchase 50 Toyoto Mirai.

      This is a huge scandal right now in Quebec. Totally ridiculous. On so many levels.

      1. floydboy says:

        They talked them into getting 50 Toyota Mirai!? Man. those guys are good!

        1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

          Yeah, for salesmanship that puts the proverbial “selling refrigerators to Eskimos” to shame.

          But then, the Big Oil lobbyists selling the “hydrogen economy” hoax have done even better at bilking California taxypayers out of money to build token H2 fueling stations, so it’s not like we Americans are any more resistant to buying this snake oil.

  2. F150 Brian says:

    It kills me when they introduce a new technology in such a butt-ugly vehicle – its like they want it to fail.

    I wonder in how many board meetings they’re puzzled over why uptake is low.

    And in the press release they mention stylish and fun to drive – from Toyota? Get real.

    1. G2 says:

      Hell has frozen over; I’m agreeing with F150

    2. floydboy says:

      Now now, butt-ugly is a bit harsh! Let’s just call the Mirai ‘EDC’. (Extremely Design Challenged)

      1. Their must be some Phrench Fraze for that!

      2. IanL says:

        I think the Mirai looks like the car that a corrupt, state police force would use in a far-flung, dystopian, hell-hole future.
        In a dark graphite colour, probably.

        Something to fear.

        1. floydboy says:

          n a flat black? I can see what you mean.

        2. earl colby pottinger says:

          Language Police!

          Sorry, Canadian joke.

  3. menorman says:

    I guess they got tired of waiting for California to build more stations.

  4. floydboy says:

    I suspect that even the dual motor Model 3 with the big battery is going to be lighter than this car.

    1. May be. Model 3 is half size (in height), half car if Mirai is a full car.
      I also don’t like the frog face of the car. Mirai is still better than the frog face.

      1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        You need to schedule a visit to your optometrist. The Mirai is, hands down, the fugliest car being made today. They say “Beauty is only skin deep”, but considering this is a fool cell car, the ugliness here goes all the way down to the axles.

        1. Prsnep says:

          Seems pointless to argue about inherently subjective matters.

      2. Joshua Burstyn says:

        Obvious troll is obvious.

  5. Benz says:

    When two FCEV’s arrive at a Hydrogen tank station.

    The first FCEV fills its Hyrogen tank and then drives away.

    The second FCEV will not be able to fill its Hydrogen tank, but has to wait for about half an hour or so, before it can fill its Hydrogen tank.

    Why?

    1. Wait! Is this some kind of ‘New Math Quizz?’ 😳

      I have 3 Oranges, I sold 2 to the customer before you! You can’t buy 2 Oranges today! Come back Tomorrow! 😛

      1. Benz says:

        No Quiz Robert.

        If you can, then please answer my question.

        I just might learn something from you today.

        Thanks anyway.

        1. ffbj says:

          Actually his answer is pretty good. It has to do with rebuilding pressure, dependent on how much hydrogen is stored. It’s called throughput, and it’s very low for hydrogen.

          1. Benz says:

            Then this is a major problem for FCEV’s.

            1. Joshua Burstyn says:

              One of many.

        2. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

          “If you can, then please answer my question.”

          His answer was actually quite good. It simplified the situation to the point that someone who knows absolutely nothing about science or technology can understand it. In other words, an explanation for the sort of person who might be fooled into believing there’s some way to make fool cell cars practical.

          1. Benz says:

            So it’s called throughput, and it’s very low for Hydrogen. Therefore rebuilding pressure is required before the next FCEV can fill it’s tank.

            I can understand that.

            This negative point about Hydrogen is actually never highlighted.

            Because if you have to wait anyway, then it would be better to just charge your BEV.

            The advantage of quick filling up your Hydrogen tank is gone (when somebody else was just ahead of you).

            Right?

    2. floydboy says:

      The way to resolve that is with larger dryers and higher rated compressors. Of course, a commensurately higher price comes with that equipment.

      1. Benz says:

        The price of a kg of Hydrogen will be just too high.

        Hydrogen will not make any economic sense.

        Right?

    3. zzzzzzzzzz says:

      Benz:

      >>The second FCEV will not be able to fill its Hydrogen tank, but has to wait for about half an hour or so, before it can fill its Hydrogen tank.

      Why?<<

      Because if FCEVs will be able to fill in row, many of $100k Model # owners will start looking for mirror to see how big their donkey ears grown 😉 So they can't fill. Never ever. It is strictly forbidden. At least not in California where FCEVs lease for $350/month including fuel.

      All this talk about CAR-200 stations dispensing 100 kg in 3 peak hours are just propaganda from Big Oil and Koch brothers. Ignore it. Superchargers are da best. Just eat more steak if it takes 5 hours in cold.

      GOOO TESLA!!!!

      1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        “All this talk about CAR-200 stations dispensing 100 kg in 3 peak hours are just propaganda from Big Oil and Koch brothers. Ignore it.”

        Wow, you’re impressed by an H2 station that can fill 10 fuel cell cars in “only” 3 hours?

        Here’s a hint, Mr. Big Oil shill: The average California gas station serves 1100 gasmobiles per day! That averages to 137.5 in three hours, and of course at peak hours it’s a lot more.

        Or to put it another way: A gas station with 8 pumps, serving one customer per 5 minutes, could fill 288 cars in three hours. And you’re talking about filling just 10 cars in three hours as something to brag about? Sad, really sad.

        Those gas stations don’t cost 2-3 million dollars apiece to build, either!

        1. Bill Howland says:

          Pushi, you again are spreading mis-information.

          The initial stations will be more or less “Time Fill” with little storage capacity to handle many cars.

          After they get popular supposedly – the majority of stations will have plenty of ‘fast fill storage’ (at around 15,000 PSI) to quickly fill any arriving customers.

          The only thing we are accidentally in agreement is that I am concerned about the relatively high (currently over $3/kg H2) dispensing cost – which could be lowered with Methane powered compression and refrigeration – and if colocated with a car wash or some other user of a large amount of waste heat could be made even more cost-effective.

          But Quebec (what with their almost free electricity) seems to be the WORST place to put a ‘TEST’ H2 dispensory. H2 can NEVER compete in an area with free electricity.

      2. Benz says:

        People who have bought a Tesla have made the right choice. They don’t have donkey ears.

        This problem of having to wait for rebuilding pressure (every time after a fill up), before the next person will be able to tank Hydrogen, really is a major problem.

        The advantage of a quick fill up is gone.

        Hydrogen is pretty much a dead technology.

    4. earl colby pottinger says:

      Is this true? This is worse than supercharger that has no more then two stalls.

      So any supercharger with four or more stalls (which is most of them) can handle Tesla cars faster the hydrogen station that claim they are faster than battery chargers but turns out to be slower once you have more than one car to handle.

  6. Quebec 100% EV says:

    Shows how powerful the automotive, oil and gas lobbyists are, even up here north of the 49th parallel.

    They will do ANYTHING to try and slow down EV adoption. Hydrogen for passenger cars is the most desperate method yet.

  7. floydboy says:

    I’m STILL trying to wrap my mind around….taking your electricity to extract your fuel from something, using more electricity to pump your fuel into storage, using more electricity to dry and clean your fuel, using more electricity to to compress and store your fuel again, using more electricity to run a fuel pump to get it into your car, then finally use your fuel to turn it BACK INTO electricity to charge your battery to run your car.

    When you can just use your electricity to charge your battery to run your car. Much simpler, cheaper, efficient and accessible.

    1. Magnus H says:

      I think big oil is betting on steam reforming of natural gas.

      1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        Even if there was zero energy cost to generate/extract the H2, all the other energy costs he mentioned would still drive up the price, the energy consumed, and the CO2 emissions, far beyond anything that we could honestly call “green” or “low emissions”.

        Fool cell fanboys love to talk about some new tech to lower the cost or increase the efficiency of generating hydrogen. For some odd reason, they never mention the fact that this is only a small fraction of the total cost, in money and energy, of getting H2 into a fool cell car.

        Then they switch to arguing about how “green” it is to generate H2 on-site at the fuel station, ignoring the fact that on-site generation always uses electrolysis, because these “magic” ways of cheaply generating hydrogen are not practical on a small scale.

        You can see these intellectually dishonest arguments right here in this discussion thread.

    2. Ted says:

      With a BEV you miss the joy of driving many miles to your nearest hydrogen fueling station and paying $14.99/gallon for fuel

      Who wants to just plug into a socket in their garage and pay a fraction of the cost of hydrogen?

    3. Jason says:

      I love this image. Someone needs to do a graphic of this process in a comical way. I’ve seen the BS graphic showing an EV tied to a power station vs the ICE tied to a petrol station (conveniently leaving out heaps of detail for the ICE and making the EV look really polluting on coal).
      These government officials must be on the take, or some of the dumbest people on Earth, let’s see if they are driving these Mirai. How any sane person can look at H2 and actually think it is a viable alternative at this point in time, let alone allocate the funds to H2 which could have been instantly used to improve the EV experience, is mind boggling to me. Even the holy grail of environmentally forward thinking CA has struggled to gain any real traction on H2, but BEV is everywhere.
      2 x H2 stations and 50 vehicles vs at least 13 DCFC stations and many more EV’s. Maybe H2 will be a thing in the future, but that is exactly right, leave it in the future until it actually makes sense. At the moment it doesn’t make much sense.

      1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        I’m not sure how to represent the idea of disadvantageous thermodynamics (and economics) graphically, but this is a pretty good illustration of why fool cell cars will never be practical:

        Perhaps they could add a few extra steps:

        1) Use the hydrogen in a fool cell to generate electricity

        2) Use the electricity to electrolyze water to hydrogen and oxygen

        Steps one and two can be repeated as many times as necessary to get to the desired level of inefficiency.

        -– John Hollenberg, comment at InsideEVs.com, September 24, 2015

  8. TKO says:

    Is it really for Sale or just for Lease?

  9. Jason says:

    It states they will use their hydro to make the H2. So H2 uses electricity to make it. So every argument that’s EV’s are only as clean as their grid will equally apply to H2. But you put the energy directly into the BEV, whereas you put the energy into making H2, then put the energy into moving the H2, then put the energy into pumping the H2, and finally use the H2 to power the vehicle. On any measure, how come people can’t see this aspect of the typical service station model, and the hypocrisy that H2 has in this regard?

    1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

      Some people ignore 17.5 tons of GHG emissions per 100 kWh of Li Ion battery, and all other emissions and lost energy. Just because it doesn’t fit their favorite story.

      You don’t mine and process cobalt, nickel, lithium and other battery components in Québec. There are no PV panels covering Tesla’s Nevada factory roof, not even for greenwashing/netmetering purposes.

      1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        However much or how little GHG emissions come from manufacturing batteries — or fuel cell stacks — it’s done only once per car.

        All the GHG emissions which come from the long and horribly inefficient, extremely wasteful supply chain for getting compressed hydrogen into a fuel cell car, has to be done every time that car is filled up over its lifetime.

        Or to put it another way: We don’t burn li-ion batteries to power EVs, they way they burn gasoline in a gasmobile or “burn” H2* in a fool cell car.

        *Technically, it’s oxidation rather than burning. Some fool cell fanboys get all excited over the rather trivial difference between slow oxidation and rapid oxidation.

  10. mxs says:

    Sad day, another government caved in and was taken for an H2 ride, literally. Instead of putting more L3 chargers for the EV’s already out there on the road, they will be participating on the infrastructure, plus also incentives on the outputted H2, so the end user doesn’t pay the real shocker price per kg …. nuts!

  11. Djoni says:

    Out of nowhere minister Moreau pull a rabbit of it hat.
    Nobody at the minister know nothing about it, not a line, not a number, not a cost and already Mr. Moreau is ready to buy many of those FCEV for the government with people money.

    He didn’t ask no one, neither seek any advice to any one close to the subject, but he bought it!

    One thing is sure there is a new election coming this fall and he feel that would make him look smart.

    He might think it’s pretty easy to fool people, I guess.

    1. Roy_H says:

      How else are they going to sell 50 Mirai? Do it behind closed doors, sell it to feeble minded politicians, don’t allow anybody with actual knowledge about the subject interfere.

  12. CCIE says:

    As others have said, FCVs are getting hydrogen by using electricity to derive hydrogen from natural gas. On top of that, the amount of energy needed to derive the hydrogen is much higher than: 1. Directly using the electricity to charge a BEV, and/or 2. Using the natural gas to generate electricity to charge a BEV and/or 3. Using the natural gas to power an ICE.

  13. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

    My sympathies to the Canadians. At least Toyota isn’t an American company, so I feel little personal guilt.

    A Toyota mouthpiece said:

    “The arrival of the Mirai in Québec is perfectly in line with the adoption of the zero-emission vehicle (ZEV) standard last December…”

    Greeenwashing at its finest! Toyota deserves the Golden Scoopshovel award for all the bull pucky they’re shoveling out.

  14. cmg186 says:

    My question is, does Toyota have a choice? There is a ZEV mandate in Quebec, and no other ZEV’s currently in the Toyota stable.

    1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      That’s like the guy who kidnaps someone and then, as the police close in, says “I have to kill you now. I have no choice.”

      Toyota has had the choice, for many years, of developing a BEV or a long-range PHEV for sale. Instead, they have chosen to use their publicity department to denigrate plug-in EVs and promote the “hydrogen economy” hoax.

      1. cmg186 says:

        Clearly. But this doesn’t answer my question in regards to Quebec’s ZEV mandate.

    2. ItsNotAboutTheMoney says:

      Exactly.

      The ZEV system is now fully in force, so companies will now apply their regulatory compliance strategies. Toyota’s ZEV credit machine is the Mirai. GM’s was the Volt, now replaced by the Bolt.

      Note that companies were earning credits in previous years, so they don’t have to push too hard. GM has sold a bunch of Volts in Quebec so they don’t have to do a big push on the Bolt there.

    3. ItsNotAboutTheMoney says:

      Here’s some more information (in English)

      http://www.mddelcc.gouv.qc.ca/changementsclimatiques/vze/feuillet-vze-reglement-en.pdf

      YYYY: C.C% (Z%)
      YYYY: year
      C.C%: credits required as percentage of sales
      Z%: credits required from ZEV as percentage of sales

      Year: credits as percentage of sales
      2018: 3.5% (0.0%)
      2019: 6.5% (0.0%)
      2020: 9.5% (6%)
      2021: 12.0% (8%)
      2022: 14.5% (10%)
      2023: 17.0% (12%)
      2024: 19.5% (14%)
      2025+: 22.0% (16%)

      Note that from 2020 onwards, the percentages will match CARB’s.
      Manufacturers will be credited for sales in previous years.

      1. cmg186 says:

        Thank you!

  15. Courtney vegan says:

    Let’s hope other provinces don’t fall for that sales pitch.

  16. Bill Howland says:

    What surprises me is, why QUEBEC? With the cheapest electricity in Canada.

    H2 vehicles will be a hard sell there since the electricity doesn’t cost anything.

    (AT least the electric bill at the dispensing H2 stations will be relatively low)..

    But I would think it is Better Business to sell H2 cars in places with HIGH-COST electricity, as they are doing in California.

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