Why Tesla Model 3 Shouldn’t Be Compared To All Other $35,000 Cars

Tesla Model 3

AUG 10 2017 BY STEVEN LOVEDAY 86

Tesla Model 3

Tesla Model 3 at the handover event

The Tesla Model 3 may not live up to many other cars in its price range (or cheaper) in a number of superficial ways, but even trying to compare it to any other car is a travesty.

People have been forecasting the Tesla Model 3’s details since before it was first revealed. Over time, more information presented itself via comments by CEO Elon Musk, spy shots, inside information leaked to online forums, etc. But there were still very few concrete details regarding features, and especially those related to the car’s interior.

Fast forward to this past month, when the first 30 Model 3s were delivered to their rightful owners on July 28th, and the car was officially revealed (but still not completely). Some have been complaining all along about the Model 3’s basic interior, while others have seemed satisfied. These two stances have escalated exponentially since the handover event.

To add insult to injury, Tesla made it official that the $35,000 base versions won’t be manufactured right out of the gate (a move the company gave the heads-up on almost a year ago). This could mean that those hoping to buy a base Model 3 and enjoy the full federal rebate may have another thing coming.

Tesla Model 3

Tesla Model 3 interior roof

A car that some thought could go out the door for some $27,500 plus incidentals (once the full rebate is factored in), may never come to fruition for everyone. This piece of information has incited some to cancel their orders, many publications continue to compare the Model 3 to other “similar” cars, and it starts to make communication pretty nasty.

People should really take a step back and reassess the situation. Should they be comparing the Tesla Model 3 to any other car? No! Okay, it’s human nature to do so, car reviewers have no choice, and there has to be some rational basis on which to judge it. However, how many long range compact electric sports sedans with access to a proprietary fast charging network, over-the-air updates, the potential for Autopilot, automatic emergency braking, a 15-inch touchscreen with built-in navigation (among a multitude of other functions), an 8-year/100,00-mile battery warranty, Wi-Fi and LTE internet, remote climate control, Internet radio, etc. do we find on the road today? The answer is none.

Added to this, while the base Model 3’s interior quality may not mirror some European compact luxury sedans, it’s honestly pretty dang nice, comfortable, roomy, modern, and sexy. Plus you can opt for an all-glass roof. Eh, who needs power seats? It’s a great option for sure, but it can be assumed that many people might just take that other long list of stuff even if they have to move a few extra muscles to adjust the seat. Some convenience features (mostly those which require a lack of laziness) may not be present, but what you’re getting in return is a “future-proof” electric car with the latest and greatest tech.

Electric cars are just more expensive. It’s a fact. Batteries aren’t cheap. Remember, that battery means you’re done paying for gas. Not to mention no oil changes, or really any other typical maintenance, for that matter. Let’s also not forget about online ordering, no long trips to the dealership, no-haggle pricing, instant torque, no-profit service and repairs, Tesla mobile rangers, no up-sells for pricey protective coatings, and no engine (which makes for a much more worthy crumple zone).

Finally … wait for it … it’s designed and manufactured in the U.S. and so are its batteries.

Source: Teslarati

Categories: Tesla

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86 Comments on "Why Tesla Model 3 Shouldn’t Be Compared To All Other $35,000 Cars"

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One caveat to the “not paying for gas”.

If you don’t have home charging, some governments have set up free charging networks, others can quickly approach the cost of driving a rather inefficient ICE vehicle. Normal costs for public charging in CA can range from 0.10 – 0.15 per mile (0.30-0.45/kwh). With $3 / gallon gas that’s equivalent to getting 20-30 mpg.

Now granted CA has very high electricity costs to begin with but caveat emptor.

I am still of the view that if you can’t do home charging then you probably shouldn’t buy an EV. Being able to charge up while you sleep is critical. If you don’t own a home then get an apartment that will let you install a charger or will let you charge up from an ordinary 110V outlet. Yes, 110V sucks but charging up on 110V generally adds enough for a typical commute.

If you can’t charge at home then being able to charge at work MIGHT be enough of a substitute. But if you can’t charge at either work or home and then buy an EV, you are just asking for huge problems.

California has a law that allows renters to install a charger as long as they pay for it. Everyone should have such laws

Eventually, this problem will go away because apartments will be competing for renters by installing chargers themselves. But right now, this is something EV fans are going to have to fight for. Ask you landlord and/or employer for the ability to charge up. Plant the seed.

Yeah I have charging which is a short walk to work and about 0.20/kwh (it’s a bit more complex than that) so it works well for me. I also have “free” supercharging that knocks off a lot of the cost on longer trips. But I’m not sure a leaf would be much cheaper to operate than a Prius at these rates.

We’ve been lobbying our building hard since there are at least 2 green tech companies with offices here and 5 EVs at last count but they’re really stingy and can barely keep the AC or toilets working, so I don’t hold out much hope for chargers or solar panels.

Luckily we’re moving in a year.

I know BMW and possibly Kia are giving out free access to DC fast charging for 2 years with a lease. Problem is it’s a 3 year lease, but at least it’s something.

It’s Nissan and BMW giving 2 years of free charging. Bolt who drive for Lyft also get free charging, I think a year. You can tell which car gets free charging by looking at how often you have to wait.

Bolt with about total number of SparKEV sold, it’s now accounting for 100% of my waiting, and that car gets 3 times the range. How do you destroy EV adoption? Offer free charging!

Free charging SUCKS!!!

You have to be pretty hardcore to drive a spark EV with no home charging.

I learned from Plugshare not to mess with Spark Owners (see comment apr 29 2016
https://api.plugshare.com/view/location/51747

You have to be hardcore to drive any EV without home or work charging.

As for the guy, it just shows you free charging bring out the worst in people. Free charging may KILL!

If there was forrest of free chargers, and nobody actually stopped and used them, would they still “may kill”?

Telsa has a great charging infrastructure, and no one else does, in the USA.

But, also the Ride of an EV is Substantially better than ICE:
-Ultra Smooth Acceleration
-Excellent sound quality, quiet, you’ll appreciate your stereo in your car again.

And in the BMW i3 the suspension has excellent ride characteristics.
Can’t speak for the Tesla, yet.

They must be driven, you can’t do a paper comparison of an EV and an ICE, EVs are substantially better.

The advantages of having a home to charge up make it so much better that any other vehicle aside from a Tesla, is at a huge disadvantage when you take charging into account.
I think your conclusion is correct concerning whether to go electric or not, and basing that on your specific charging needs, which a home will cover, while other solutions, may not.

+1. Not affordable what so ever

Changing your whole life to accommodate a ev is not the way to go. EVs should be used if have the needs for one and accomadation for one

“If you don’t have home charging…”

…or at-work charging, then you shouldn’t be seriously considering buying a plug-in EV.

I really don’t understand why this situation keeps coming up. On a forum for 10 ton truck owners, do they have a lot of people saying “I don’t have any place to park a large truck, but I’d like to buy one anyway” ???

No, I don’t think so!

If you want to buy a plug-in EV, then talk your landlord into letting you install an EV charge point beside your designated parking spot, or talk your boss at work into doing that… or move!

Plug-in EVs aren’t for everyone this early in the EV revolution. Someday they will be, but not now. Get over it.

So in summary it’s not fair to compare it to another car because it’s overall at a disadvantage because of the additional cost, charging slowness,etc..

Wow, if only everything could get such a pass.

Comparing it to an existing car is really the only way you’ll get a lot of people in it. Going out there and saying “sorry, we know it’s (or any EV or PHEV for that matter) not as great an offering as your ICE car” but just disregard that and buy one anyways makes a pretty crappy marketing slogan.

Hey, buy a Leaf. It’s more expensive than an equivalent ICE, it can only go like 100 miles on charge, it’s kind of ugly, but as long as you don’t compare it to anything out there is seems like a great deal right!

FYI – I’m available for all your marketing needs…

A Leaf is widely available for $10,000 discount from retail price, with a $7,500 tax credit, making it about $14,000 net price for a base model. That is about as cheap a car as you can buy new.

But the cheaper car have better styling, longer range, and fuel efficient

I’d rather drive a Leaf than a base model Versa or other bare bones econo gas burner. But the Leaf would be a second car for our household … you are right the range issue is a deal-breaker for many people who might rely on it as their only car.

Can we get a TROLL BUTTON already to delete these wasted time posts? This example shows a Troll with ZERO Reading Comprehension. There’s no point in debating this person’s high troll behavior, it’s going to turn your site into: AutoBlogGreen.

FYI — They’ve hired more than one ex-ABG contributor to work here. Including the author of this story and the editor.

Just a point of information, I’m not implying anything.

“Can we get a TROLL BUTTON already to delete these wasted time posts?”

Indeed.

Jay Cole has mentioned several times that they had plans to introduce voting up/ voting down for comments.. I keep hoping that feature will appear!

That feature would certainly make these troll posts disappear in short order.

“Oh no, someone said something I don’t like! Please delete it!”

Wow, just imagine how much nicer it would be to read the InsideEVs comments if EV-hating trolls like DJ were banned.

*Sigh*

No actually. Different opinions make the site more interesting. I don’t want this place to be an echo chamber for precious snowflakes, that would totally suck. There are tendencies of that already where anyone who doesn’t drink Elon’s Kool-Aid wholeheartedly gets attacked. Why is it so hard for many people to accept a diversity of opinion, which is the most important form of diversity?

We have yet to see all the details and specifications, but I think the base Model 3 will stand on its own merits when compared to its base BMW 3 series or Audi A4 competition.

Sure it will not win on every aspect, but it’s quicker, better handling, roomier, more cargo space, higher ‘brag’ factor, and vastly more efficient.

I think for many many people considering a $35,000 new sport-luxury car purchase the Model 3 will win against all comers even if zero tax credits are in the picture, though of course if people reserve now they can at least expect some level of tax credit when they get their car.

With all due respect, you didn’t add the inherent advantages of an EV. Probably because you haven’t driven one yet:
-Ultra Smooth Performance and acceleration
-Instant Torque
-Ultra Quiet Ride
-and therefore better Music/Radio experience.

All EV’s are 100% better, minimum, to an ICE.

You can’t go by a paper comparison

Wrong, about my driving experience, not about those advantages.

I doubt I’ll buy an ICE for myself again. In Australia it will be a race between Nissan and Tesla, we’ll probably never see the Bolt. I doubt anyone considers the Nissan to compare to the BMW, not least from bragging rights point of view, but Tesla is a different story here. Just say “Tesla” and people immediately want to know if you have one, there is huge brand recognition.
So Model 3 will compete in that BMW market, and if the $35k one is released, or not, it will do incredibly well because it will also have the bragging rights that people crave.
From my perspective, my Leaf can’t drive comfortably to the next major towns, so pretty much all next gen EV’s will be of interest because that is a real limitation of owning an EV in Australia.

So it’s a “luxury car” that doesn’t even have power seats….? Why do we give Tesla a pass on everything? My base model 2017 Sienna has power driver seat with more movements than i care to fiddle with when I get in. EVERY luxury car has similar self driving capabilities as Tesla cars. That’s why Volvo told them to shut up and sit down because they have the same tech and knew it couldn’t do what Tesla was claiming. HECK even a VW Gulf has lane keeping assist and nearly every new car has emergency braking assist. Tesla, unfortunately is a hype machine. Hype works great for those who are loaded and follow the fads. Hype doesn’t put regular people into an inconvenient car that costs as much as a luxury sport sedan, yet lacks all the luxury. Fan boys will buy the Model 3. After that, Tesla might be in trouble unless they can improve the value of the Model 3 – or shove it up market enough to please those high-income fad followers. Tesla’s claimed goal is to change the industry. On that, congrats, they have. But I’m not going to give them a free pass on anything… Read more »

The above bought to you by: “Rants R Us” where nothing we say makes sense, but we say it loudly and with conviction, and often which makes us right.

LOL, +1

So what doesn’t make sense? My first car, an ’83 Buick Regal had power seats, my ’87 Porsche has power seats. My wife’s 2010 Enclave has memory that adjust the seats, mirrors, etc based on which key fob is used to unlock it. He makes a good point. These are features that are expected at that price point today. You don’t necessarily get a pass just because you are Tesla.

Power seats use electricity and weigh more than non-powered seats. It makes sense to leave them out as one of a long list of energy/weight savings when trying to maximize range.

Just like making Aero wheels to maximize range, despite them not being the most attractive wheels in the world.

Form follows function. First Principles.

Yet these features are offered on higher trim levels for more money. If the lack of features were part of some grand, overarching strategy, they wouldn’t be offered at all.

The grand plan is to make the Model 3 available in the most efficient configuration, and if buyers choose to, they certainly can do what they want.

But that doesn’t change the plan being to give customers that choice, not make it for them.

That’s one specific part of the entire load of bilge-water, this guy is spouting.

Often rants are characterized by parts that are reasonable, even complementary, but always with stipulations.

The overall tone is one of derision, not open and reasonable discussion, so I won’t bother with that, though I will bother with explaining my P.O.V. when someone makes a reasonable request.

There are trade-offs. Yes, the base Model 3 doesn’t offer some of the luxury items you’d typically find on a $35,000 car, but it offers more of other sport-luxury qualities to offset. I.e. 5.6 seconds 0-60 and razor sharp handling, utra-quiet electric drive and efficiency ~ 4 times better than any competitor.

John Ray continued his anti-Tesla FUD:

“He makes a good point.”

No, the fact that an anti-Tesla troll like you supports his rant underscores that he doesn’t.

Can you provide a source that Tesla is using Huayou Cobalt? Apple was, and they were exposed. But LG Chem and Samsung both say they no longer use it.

A $35k BMW 3 series does not have power seats either.

BAM!!!

I guess the 3 Series isn’t sport-luxury either. $3100 Premium package to get power seats includes:

Auto-dimming rearview mirror
Auto-dimming interior and driver exterior mirrors
Storage package
Comfort Access keyless entry
Power Front Seats
SiriusXM Satellite Radio with 1year All Access Subscription
Universal garage-door opener
Lumbar support
Moonroof

That’s not a bad package for $3,100. What does Tesla charge for that much goodness?

jelloslug said:

“A $35k BMW 3 series does not have power seats either.”

How DARE you use a reality check to interrupt all the posts from trolls jumping in to agree with a mostly pointless Tesla hating rant!

Don’t you know that the intended purpose of InsideEVs comments is to give Tesla bashers a sounding board?

Oh, wait…

(Seriously, Jelloslug, thanks for that dose of reality!)

The $5,000 premium upgrade package includes power seats. Most people will buy this package because it includes a host of important options.

If you want to complain about lack of options, go look at a base BMW 3 series. The fact is that the Model 3 compares to the 3 series in every way. I don’t know why this article saw the light of day.

Tesla has stated that all cobalt used in its batteries are sourced from North America. Look up the FACTS before you lie.
https://techcrunch.com/2017/01/01/no-cobalt-no-tesla/

List of options a 35K Model 3 has that a 38K base BMW 330 series do not…

1. Navigation.
2. A screen bigger than your cell phone.
3. LED headlights.
4. Backup Camera.
5. parking sensors
6. 18″ wheels.

Options BMW 330i base has that Tesla Model 3 does not: NONE.

The Model 3 is still $35,000 in order to get roughly the same options as a BMW 330i with $43,950 MSRP.

Your statement that the base model has everything a base BMW 330i has, is incorrect: The base model 3 comes with cloth seats. You have to buy the $5,000 premium upgrades package to get the fake leather seats that comes standard in the BMW.

That being said I still love the model 3 and am not cancelling my reservation. Will just cough up the 5K for the premium upgrades package.

I don’t know what your beef is, but the fact remains that Autopilot is superior to anyone other production semi-autonomous system. Also, the Tesla Model 3 actually comes stock more than a base BMW 3-Series. In fact, you would have to add $7,300 worth of options to bring a 3-Series to tech and feature parity with a base Model 3. The options are full LED headlights ($800 BMW), 15″ touchscreen that outclasses everything non-Tesla (base BMW has tiny screens), Wi-Fi and LTE connectivity ($500 BMW), onboard maps and navigation ($1900 BMW), rear view camera, parking distance sensors, and automatic emergency braking ($950 BMW), vehicle climate control and monitoring with phone app, dual-zone climate control, keyless entry, FM/internet streaming radio, 2 USB ports + 12V socket, voice controlled everything (included in BMW’s $2750 Tech Package), “laser-precise” handling without having to buy any performance packages or suspension upgrades ($2300 BMW), and large cup holders front and back plus bottle holders and pockets in the doors (not available in most European vehicles). So to tally up how much extra you have to spend at the BMW dealership to get what a Model 3 comes standard with, that would be a whopping $7300. Added… Read more »

Who said the $35K version is a luxury car? That’s you giving it a label.

I view it as a $35K EV that can go 220 miles. And it’s a good looking car. If you want the power seats then pay more.

Hahahaha! i have powered seats. I may use it once a year when I let someone borrow my car. Poor argument. Nice, but not critical if I can have a M3…

“HECK even a VW Gulf has lane keeping assist and nearly every new car has emergency braking assist.”
BS…you can check that for yourself before you start to post lies on here. The base GOLF was nothing other then the backup camera.

Even the BMW M3, the very epitome that defines what the small sport-luxury market is, was sold with manual seats.

By the time you get done trying to explain why the BMW M3 shouldn’t count as a luxury car either, and must be crap because of manual seats being one choice it was available with, we’ll just about be done laughing.

“Why do we give Tesla a pass on everything?”

Who is the “we”? I certainly criticize Tesla when I think they deserve it.

Look, if you don’t want to buy a Model 3, then nobody is putting a gun to your head and forcing you to buy one. There are hundreds of other street-legal, highway capable passenger vehicles to choose from.

Your rant seems rather pointless in the context of the discussion here. Perhaps you’d get a better reception posting to a coal-rolling forum.

Hopefully that will help end the pointless BMW 3 comparison the Tesla fans keep making. It makes no sense as BMW 3 is not a high mpg, low emissions car which is entire point of the Model 3.

You don’t understand Tesla. Tesla isn’t simply about building an EV with superior efficiency to ICE cars in the same class.

It is about building a superior car than ICE cars in the same class. Period. Not just superior in efficiency and in greenness, but simply a superior driving experience.

If Tesla were out to build cars where you sacrifice everything car enthusiasts love from their cars, they would have built some cheap compliance cars that punish you for choosing efficiency and greenness. That’s not at all their goal. Their goal is to prove that EV’s can be the superior choice to ICE cars for all consumers.

“Tesla isn’t simply about building an EV”

That’s exactly what Tesla is about, “sustainable transportation”. It’s the mission statement of Tesla. If my Subaru didn’t have emissions or we didn’t have to worry about emissions or oil imports, I’d keep that.

A small minority say they buy Tesla for the status (expensive and unique) or the acceleration and that may be true or because their social set frowns on “tree huggers” but it’s a small group.

Reason for going EV is emissions. Beginning and end of story. Which is why the BMW 3 comparison makes no sense.

You clearly didn’t read my post.

Go back and read it again. The whole thing. Let me know if anything isn’t clear.

Pointless comparing the Model 3 to the car that is the king of the niche the Model 3 targets? Whatever dude.

FISHEV continued his anti-Tesla campaign:

“…BMW 3 is not a high mpg, low emissions car which is entire point of the Model 3.”

No part of that is true.

First of all, the Tesla Model 3 isn’t a “high MPG” car… it doesn’t use gasoline at all.

Secondly, the TM3 isn’t a “low emissions” car, it’s a zero-emissions car.

And there are a great many “points” in favor of the TM3, not just one or two. Motor Trend calls the car “the most important vehicle of the century.”

http://www.motortrend.com/cars/tesla/model-3/2018/exclusive-tesla-model-3-first-drive-review/

Model 3 is generally considered a BMW 3-Series competitor so why not compare it to that class leading offering? If you do you won’t find quite the same fancy interior perhaps, but definitely equal or better handling, performance and street cred. Even better sales maybe as things are shaping up which in itself proves that people see 3 Series value here.

Electrec calculated entry $35K Model 3 equal in spec and performance to $44K 330i, so this is arguably one EV that beats its nearest ICV equivalent in value.

“Model 3 is generally considered a BMW 3-Series competitor so why not compare it to that class leading offering?”

Maybe because electrek already wrote that story a week ago? *shrug*

Resale Value.

High demand means used Model 3’s won’t go for much less than new for a while. That will be a huge advantage over many cars.

Wrong question, you are asking … the right question is … “How many cars over-the-air updates, the potential for Autopilot, automatic emergency braking, a 15-inch touchscreen with built-in navigation (among a multitude of other functions), Wi-Fi and LTE internet, remote climate control, Internet radio, etc. do people actually want to buy.

Many people I know of consider the above useless crap many are not willing to pay for …. just saying.

(⌐■_■) Trollnonymous

I don’t want power nuthin other than to the wheels.

I don’t care if you compare the M3 to luxury or budget.
All I want is the AWD upgrade and leave all luxury crap out.

*laugh* I love it.

*Chuckle*

While I would happily forgo such unneeded luxuries as power windows, power side mirrors, and power seats, my first car — the 1975 Honda Civic CVCC — had no power steering. Even in a subcompact, the steering was very stiff.

Power steering is nice.

(Full disclosure: I’ve driven many farm vehicles, including a postwar Ford pickup, which had no power steering, and the steering wasn’t nearly as stiff as in my Honda Civic. But all those had oversized steering wheels, which accomplished the same purpose.)

“Not to mention no oil changes, or really any other typical maintenance, for that matter.”

Why do EV lovers keep over simplifying to make EVs seem better sooooo much better? Take a look at this list of maintenance items from Honda and honestly tell me how many do not apply to EVs:

Replace cabin air filter
Inspect for leaks (includes windshield washer fluid, coolant)
Check headlight alignment
Inspect A/C and heater operation
Check park brake adjustment
Service battery and clean cables (OK not a starter battery but there is a battery with connectors in an EV, not to mention a thermal management system to check)
Inspect ball joints and dust covers
Inspect brake line and hoses
Inspect brake linings/drums and brake pads/discs
Inspect drive shaft boots
Inspect steering gear box
Inspect steering wheel, linkage and boots
Inspect transmission fluid or oil (note there is a gearbox on an EV with lubricant)
Check all exterior and interior lamps, windshield washer systems
Lubricate wheel bearings
Lubricate all hinges and latches, door locks and door weather-strips
Rotate and balance wheels and tires
Inspect tire pressure and condition
Inspect undercarriage
Inspect shocks and struts

Seems like cutting out the ICE still leaves alot of maintenance items

Sure, there is a long list of ‘Inspect’ items on your list — and they typically take a single employee about ten minutes to thoroughly go over every one of them. When you go in to get an oil-change, this kind of stuff is generally thrown in for free. EVs have those too.

Funny enough, what I don’t see a lot of on that list are things that actually matter to the ICE or transmission. Ever had an alternator go out? A distributor? Ever sucked a valve, thrown a rod, burnt a clutch, blew a head? Needed new spark plugs? Oil, fuel, or air filters? I’ve been stranded by the side of the road because my timing belt broke — and none of these things can possibly fail on an EV. EVer.

A modern ICE has dozens of precision machined parts which must stand constant wear, high temperature, vibration, and even explosions(!); the transmission adds dozens more — any one of which can leave you stranded by the side of the road. An EV is much simpler, and therefor has much less to go wrong.

These are mostly very silly items that never need actual maintenance. “Inspect for leaks?” Well if I get wet when it rains then I know there’s a leak.

I could easily make a similar list for ICE items: engine oil, spark plugs, belts, throttle body, injectors, trans fluid, radiator fluid, coolant hoses, PCV valve, fuel pump, fuel filter, air filter, muffler, exhaust pipes, catalytic converters, oxygen sensors. Plus everything on your list.

So yeah, EVs have a lot less to maintain and the ones they do have (your list) are very unlikely to actually need service, unlike the ICE list.

I get your point that EV’s still need to be maintained, but you certainly have to admit that you don’t have to change oil or change timing belts and other common and expensive regular maintenance. So there is a savings.

_________________________

“Lubricate wheel bearings”

Not to nit pick (Ok, it is a nit-pick). But modern sealed wheel bearings don’t need lubricated (can’t be lubricated). Are their still cars with open/cage wheel bearings being sold today?

(⌐■_■) Trollnonymous

But in your ICE car you’re swallowing OPEC Jizz, spewing OPEC farts and sending all your $$$ to those in the sand lands that want us Americans killed.

“F150 Brian” wrote another EV bashing post: “Why do EV lovers keep over simplifying to make EVs seem better sooooo much better?” Why do EV bashers keep desperately lying about the very real reduction in maintenance costs for BEVs; both scheduled maintenance and unscheduled? Because they know that gasmobiles already can’t compete in that area, that’s why! The most common scheduled maintenance, other than tire rotation, is oil changes, which a BEV like the TM3 will never need. And what about unscheduled maintenance and repairs? Take a look at the top 10 car repairs of 2015: Replacing an oxygen sensor – $249 Replacing a catalytic converter – $1,153 Replacing ignition coil(s) and spark plug(s) – $390 Tightening or replacing a fuel cap – $15 Thermostat replacement – $210 Replacing ignition coil(s) – $236 Mass air flow sensor replacement – $382 Replacing spark plug wire(s) and spark plug(s) – $331 Replacing evaporative emissions (EVAP) purge control valve – $168 Replacing evaporate emissions (EVAP) purging solenoid – $184 Do any of those apply to BEVs? Any at all? I’m not sure… maybe a thermostat, but BEVs don’t use a radiator to cool the motor. Muffler replacement is another common expense for gasmobiles,… Read more »

I am going to do my level best to get this thought across. Most people who buy cars have a limit to what they can spend. I don’t give a damn if your neighbor’s cousin stretched to buy their Model S. That anecdote will not hold in the aggregate. The Model 3 is very expensive. Don’t tell me “but it has Autopilot, it can go 300 miles on a charge, it has an enormous touch screen”. None of that matters in the face of a mortgage sized car payment. Car buyers are price sensitive and that becomes more true the further down the price curve you go. That is my concern.

And yes, people will compare the Model 3 with a host of other options. That’s just the way this works.

Yes, it is an expensive car, and it will get more expensive after the Fed incentive finishes ramping down by 2019. But the median brand new motor vehicle sold in the United States is expensive too. $34K to be exact. After fed rebate even an M3 220 with luxury package is below the national median new car price. (if you are lucky enough to get one before the incentives end). Once the Fed. rebate is gone, the base M3 220 will be less than the $34K median new car price in the largest states that sell the most EV’s (California and NY). ______________________________________ Yes, even the median new ICE car is beyond what is affordable to the median household in the majority of the US. The Tesla Model 3 is no different in that regard: http://fortune.com/2017/06/28/car-buy-price/ But that is why on the 8th day G-d created used cars. OK, so maybe it was in conjunction with Satan, who created used car salesman. But the point is that people making the median household income don’t buy median priced new cars. They buy used cars. Model 3 CPO’s will probably be a great deal for people making the median household income. The… Read more »

John Ray continued his troll posting campaign:

“Car buyers are price sensitive and that becomes more true the further down the price curve you go. That is my concern.”

Yes, that makes you an anti-Tesla “concern troll”. You aren’t actually “concerned”, you just want an excuse to bash Tesla.

But of course, the best lies are the ones which have a bit of truth mixed in. And I do agree that it’s hype for Tesla to label the TM3 an “affordable” car. It would be more accurate to call it “semi-affordable”. Truly “affordable” cars, including the top best-selling cars (not light trucks) in the USA, are all priced under $25,000.

I like how we are just making up terms on the fly now.

“Semi-affordable”? Is that akin to being “semi-dead”?

I’m sure bosses would love it when you tell them you are “semi-done” with a project that is overdue. Lol

“The Tesla Model 3 may not live up to many other cars in its price range (or cheaper) in a number of superficial ways, but even trying to compare it to any other car is a travesty.”

And how doesn’t it live up to other cars exactly? Besides having fewer button I can’t think of any real shortcomings compared to a BMW 3-series or an Audi A4

Are you kidding me? The author supports his argument for not comparing the Model 3 to other cars by doing what? Comparing it to other cars.

I suspect this is a joke, because I’m laughing my a** off right now.

Model 3 is not only a luxury car, but also a bigger car and in many features, it has interior and exterior looks better than many luxury cars.

Because it has 220 mile range, the media compares it with the 238 mile range Bolt and this is the worst part. Still Model 3 has not reached mass production and hence many details are not available.

Soon the details will emerge. It makes perfect sense to product the high end models which impresses those who pay more and also the company gets more cash.

Eventually the $35,000 units will come to the market and those who cancelled will come back.

“Eventually the $35,000 units will come to the market and those who cancelled will come back.”

Likely we will not see the low range, non-option Model 3 for quite some time. The Mini-S version is what will be selling and is certainly what Tesla is producing and delivering if not selling right now.

Customer demand will push the $36,200 model to legend status. This will get even worse when AWD is offered.

Only reason we’d ever see a $36,200 Model 3 is if Tesla was forced to sell a few to avoid some kind of regulatory issue.

In March 2017, Elon Musk tweeted “Model 3 is like a BMW 3 series or Audi A4.” (source 1)

In 2013, Tesla design chief Franz von Holzhausen said the Model 3 will “be an Audi A4, BMW 3-Series, Volkswagen Jetta type of vehicle…” (source 2)

So while InsideEVs writer Steven Loveday thinks the Tesla Model 3 shouldn’t be compared to other cars in the same price segment, it seems pretty clear that Tesla executives don’t agree!

source 1:
https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/845282298291339267?lang=en

source 2:
http://www.automobilemag.com/news/tesla-in-detroit-our-family-will-grow-197263/

Actually, someone over at Teslarati wrote this. Perhaps Steven brought it over here for its entertainment value? It’s quite amusing.

Musk also tweeted Model 3 would have towing option and Tesla would fix the trunk but that was wrong also.

I think the Tesla fans take the comments out of context as it looks like Musk and Holzhausen were speaking to the fit and finish. Likely not the best comparison even there.

But no one looking at EV’s is considering Audi or BMW gas cars. It makes no sense.

Still trolling, I see.

Tesla most definitely did improve the size of the opening for the TM3’s trunk, as promised. According to one report, it was increased substantially.

As for the towing attachment points, just because Tesla hasn’t released those specs yet doesn’t mean they don’t exist. Tesla hasn’t yet specified the number of kWh in the TM3 battery packs… will you also claim that this means they don’t have any kWh capacity? 😉

Making claims by sourcing unnamed reports ….classic sign of a troll.

Please, instead of accusing people of making stuff up, THEN making up your own stuff, try actually posting ANY facts that back up your supposed claims (or claims of someone else being wrong). Till then, you are no better than any other “troll”.

Don’t forget (for US nationalists), the energy is produced in the US, too, instead of shipping our dollars overseas.