Nissan Introduces $2,850 Refabricated Batteries For Older LEAF

MAR 26 2018 BY MARK KANE 120

Announces exchange costs for new 24, 30 and 40 kWh LEAF batteries too.

Nissan is finally launching the exchange program for Nissan LEAF batteries in Japan that enables LEAF owners to trade in old batteries for refabricated ones.

The 24 kWh refabricated batteries for the oldest LEAFs will be offered for 300,000 yen apiece (around $2,850).

RELATED – NISSAN PRICES LEAF BATTERY REPLACEMENT AT $5,499, NEW PACKS MORE HEAT DURABLE

That’s less than half the price of a brand new 24 kWh pack (650,000 yen or ≈$6,200). Nissan will try to make use of the old modules for energy storage systems.

Sales of the refabricated packs will start in May.

Nissan will offer refabricated batteries for the Nissan LEAF under a new, fee-based exchange program

“Starting in May, owners of the 100% electric Nissan LEAF can turn in their used batteries and, for a fee, receive refabricated ones. Nissan is using the battery-refabrication capabilities of 4R Energy Corp., a company established through a joint venture with Sumitomo Corp., to offer the program.

As demand for electric vehicles grows, the number of used batteries will increase significantly. Nissan hopes that by reclaiming these batteries, it can help lower battery replacement costs and heighten the used-car value of electric vehicles. This will enhance the electric-car ownership experience, which in turn will help promote their use, ultimately contributing to lower CO2 emissions.”

Interesting is that a brand new 40 kWh battery costs just a little more than the 30 kWh unit. 40 kWh stands at 820,000 yen (around $7,800) – for the modules we believe.

“Nissan will initially offer 24-kilowatt-hour refabricated batteries for 300,000 yen apiece, with plans to expand the lineup. Exchange costs for brand-new Nissan LEAF batteries are 650,000 yen for 24 kWh; 800,000 yen for 30 kWh; and 820,000 yen for 40 kWh.

The new offer is made possible through the launch of a new factory in the town of Namie in eastern Japan, built by 4R Energy Corporation, a joint venture between Nissan and Sumitomo Corporation.

Read Also – New Nissan LEAF Sales Closing In On 10,000 Per Month, 100,000 Yearly

According to Nissan, this is Japan’s first factory specializing in the reuse and recycling of used lithium-ion batteries from electric vehicles.

The 4R plant in Namie, Japan, will specialize in the reuse and recycling of batteries from electric vehicles.

“Japan’s first plant specializing in the reuse and recycling of lithium-ion batteries from electric vehicles is set to open amid growing demand for electric cars.

The new factory, in the town of Namie in eastern Japan, will be operated by 4R Energy Corporation, a joint venture between Nissan and Sumitomo Corporation.

The number of electric cars on the road is rising rapidly as environmental issues, including climate change, weigh on the minds of motorists around the world. The availability of used lithium-ion batteries is expected to increase significantly in the near future as buyers of the first generation of electric cars look to replace their vehicles. The recycling and refabrication of such batteries is expected to have a substantial impact on the battery industry, affecting demand for new battery materials, and on the environment and society as a whole.

Established in 2010 by Nissan and Sumitomo Corporation to focus on the effective reuse of electric-car batteries, 4R has gained valuable expertise. The company has developed a system that quickly measures the performance of used batteries, and it plans to apply this innovative technology to batteries collected from all over Japan at the Namie plant.

Nissan will offer refabricated batteries for the Nissan LEAF under a new, fee-based exchange program

The plant will serve as the global center for 4R’s development and manufacturing. The batteries recycled and refabricated at the factory will be used to offer the world’s first exchangeable refabricated battery for electric vehicles, and will also be used in large-scale storage systems and electric forklifts. The plant is the first new factory in Namie since the town was devastated by Japan’s March 2011 earthquake and tsunami, and is expected to help revitalize the local economy.

As a leader in zero-emission technologies, Nissan seeks to realize a sustainable-mobility society by developing and marketing electric vehicles and promoting their use globally.

Sumitomo Corporation is a firm believer in the positive impact of electric vehicles on the global environment and is contributing to the expansion of their use in collaboration with 4R. The company’s continuing efforts include promoting the reuse and recycling of used electric-car batteries for purposes including the development of stationary power storage systems.”

2018 Nissan LEAF
42 photos
2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF charging 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF (wallpaper 2,560x – click to enlarge) 2018 Nissan LEAF (wallpaper 2,560x – click to enlarge) 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF Inside the 2018 Nissan LEAF Inside the 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF
LEAF sales will improve for March, but how much?
29 photos
2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF 2018 Nissan LEAF charging inlets 2018 Nissan LEAF charging

Categories: Battery Tech, Nissan

Tags: , , , , , ,

Leave a Reply

120 Comments on "Nissan Introduces $2,850 Refabricated Batteries For Older LEAF"

newest oldest most voted
ylgmac

YESSSSSS!!!!
Very happy, the next step is coming with upgrade battery.

scott

Do you live in Japan? Otherwise, good luck with getting a refurbished battery from Nissan on the cheap.

Assaf

Heheheheh…

…as goes the saying, “Don’t show a fool a job half-done” 🙂

Doggydogworld

A battery recycling and refabrication plant, wow. 10,000 Leafs per month. Nissan actually doing the things Tesla has promised for years…..

All it took was duping customers into buying cars with no active thermal management of any kind to make it happen!
If only I had the ‘privilege’ of buying one of these refurb batteries. But my 2012 Volt’s battery stubbornly refuses to degrade.

Mint

Over 80% of new Leafs are leases, so Nissan is only duping themselves if the problem is as extensive as you and others claim.

As for the rest, it would be a pretty rare occurence of stupidity to purchase an EV without inquiring about the battery warranty. If people know they’re getting 8yr/100k miles with at least 70% battery, then they have not been duped.

FYI, battery guru Jeff Dahn has shown that batteries can survive 1200 cycles at 45 deg C (113F) with 80% life remaining. The book is still open on the need of a TMS as battery chemistry and quality gets refined, especially for a value EV.

Until a competitor profitably sells 100k EVs per year at a $30k price point, Nissan’s approach will remain the optimal choice.

We know many Leaf lose 2 bars (about 20%) even in moderate climate who do not see 113F on regular basis (or any day). But 113F is pretty much a summer day; hot sun baked asphalt plus plugged-in and charging could easily push the battery to 113F+.

Now combine this with free DCFC Nissan gives out, and you have a recipe for highly degraded batteries. Sure, many in-lease Leafs may still be under 4 bars lost, but off-lease used cars are going to lose them pretty quickly since degraded range is going to require more charge cycles for given number of miles.

Kosh

Ours (2013) certainly lost more than that.

Miss the leaf, excited for our Model 3 (july?).

SJC

The pack was originally designed to replace bad modules. They never did that but now they can.

scott

No, the Leaf’s lack of TMS is a major, major flaw. The jury is not out, and the SCOTUS has ruled. I still love my used leaf but let’s call a spade a spade.

SJC

A fall back position for 2011/2012 Leaf cars is good. There are used ones on lots at low prices, who would spend a lot on a new pack only to have it decline rapidly?

Pushmi-Pullyu

These are refurbished packs, almost certainly using used battery cells. It is highly unlikely that Nissan would waste new li-ion cells, which are — at least over the near term — in short supply for EVs.

But aside from that, which is possibly mere nit-picking, you have a good point. Buying a refurb pack for an older Leaf is, arguably, throwing good money after bad. On the other hand, at less than $3000 for a pack that will likely give the car several more years of useful life, perhaps the cost/benefit will work for some or many.

2013VOLT

I could use it for my 2013 Volt battery. The car has clever software to hide the degradation by digging deeper into the buffers. The unfortunate side affect is now I am constantly getting Propulsion Power Reduced warnings when driving on the range extender because the reserve capacity isn’t there anymore. Anyone who believes the Gen 1 Volt is immune to degradation is being naive.

ClarksonCote

“I could use it for my 2013 Volt battery. The car has clever software to hide the degradation by digging deeper into the buffers.”

People have said that, but there’s no definitive proof.

If you are getting warnings, you should take it to a dealer. That could be caused by some bad cells as well, which would cause the Voltage to dip more quickly than designed.

2013VOLT

This TSB from GM basically admits software is hiding the degradation and people on the forum have said that after the software update associated with the TSB was performed their range has gone down. I will be taking my own car to a dealer shortly for the Propulsion Power Reduced message as well.

comment image

Pushmi-Pullyu

“People have said that, but there’s no definitive proof.”

Of course there is definitive proof. All li-ion batteries degrade when cycled regularly, yet the Volt shows no range reduction due to this degradation. Unless you’re claiming that GM (and LG Chem) have some magic way of keeping li-ion batteries from losing capacity due to cycling, then the logical conclusion is inescapable that GM is hiding the degradation of Volt battery packs.

There is no other possibility, period. 1 + 1 = 2.

Malcolm Scott

Moreover, if I recall correctly ‘Wop on Tour’ in GM-Volt.com specifically said the Volt does not open up the SOC to cover battery degradation.

My 2013 Volt has always displayed 10.3 or 10.4 kWh of maximum battery capacity used. If not opening up the SOC window, I’m curious to know how.

That member also said that the Volt has a learning feature to identify the battery capacity on install. I would love to hear from anyone who has exploited that feature.

AndY1

I does open up the SOC window and I can prove it.

When new, my Ampera (Volt1) charged from 22% SOC (’empty battery’) to 85.9% SOC (fully charged). After 5.5 years and 143.000+ km, the battery SOC, when fully charged, is at 90.2% SOC (now when it’s winter – in spring the value goes back down to about 89% SOC).
The SOC window does not go above that and that is when usable capacity starts to go down. I lost about 0.4kWh of usable capacity this winter (it was really cold) and it was the first winter, that that has happened, but it’s already going back up to the original usable battery capacity.

Of course all batteries degrade. But because GM overengineered the Volt, the wheels will literally fall off before the battery needs replacement due to general degradation.

If you could provide proof of your claim the Volt opens up the SOC window to “hide” degradation, please do so.

RobSez

I have an electrical engineer friend who has a Gen-1 Volt. As he is one of those meticulous technical types I’m inclined to believe him. He tells me the Volt battery has a much larger capacity than advertised. As someone else said, ALL batteries degrade. However, the Volt buffers degradation with software.

I’ve encountered a lot of different EV drivers over the years. I think it’s interesting that EVERY electrically powered vehicle owner sees SOME degradation over time. Even Tesla owners. The only exception is the Volt owners. I’ve never heard of or talked to a Volt owner who has seen any degradation at all. I find that suspiciously odd.

zzzzzzzzzz

Large buffer reduces degradation by itself. 10.9 kWh usable out of 16.5 kWh as in 2013 Volt is quite big buffer. I don’t think it would be possible in pure BEV, as range is the king and even cell type may be different.

Sure it will fall of the cliff at some time in the future (GM target is 10 years, or more in good conditions), but we don’t know how many years later exactly and so GM has better reputation and sales for now 😉

The fact some 2011 Volts now have a bigger EV range than 2011 Leafs speaks volumes.

Will

Has anyone crack the software to open the buffer in the gen 1 volt. And can the infotainment be upgrades

Ziv

There is an app that gives you access to an additional 0.5 kWh or so, but nothing else that I have heard of. And the app has to be turned on each time you use the car in order to get the extra juice. I think you can find info on GM – Volt dot com

Asak

An extra 0.5 hardly seems worth the bother. Even at 5 mi/kWh that’s only 2.5 miles.

Asak

If the Volt’s battery makes it more than 10 years then you’re probably 2/3rds of the way through the vehicle’s usable life. Also, we’re talking into the 2020s at that point even for the earliest Volts. So, battery replacement, especially for the small capacity battery in the Volt–reserve buffer or not–should be fairly affordable.

I don’t see the problem. The fact is nothing lasts forever. Even a non-EV eventually heads to the junk yard.

Will

If we can hack facebook and the federal government i think its possible to open the buffer and change tge software

Will

Accords and Civics last forever.

Tom
In a fit of weakness 3 years ago I bought my high school daughter a 1997 Honda Civic coupe with 5 speed trans. It was in very good condition and only had 92,000 actual miles on it. I thought ‘score!’. Everyone I meet that’s a mechanic says ‘that’s the most dependable car ever made’. The Subaru dealer service dept manager actually said ‘that’s car has the best engine block ever manufactured…it is never going to die’. Now she’s graduating high school and going off to a city to college and won’t need a car. I’m looking at it and doing a ‘crap….I’m going to have to drive this thing forever’. It has some mild high schooler body bumps but other than that shows exactly zero sign of dying. Only 114,000 miles now. I believe quite literally the frame will die of metal fatigue before the engine/transmission give out. The mechanic at the shop I take it to for oil changes/tires just laughs. It’s a great little car but I’m now of an age that sitting that close to the ground makes it hard on me to ingress/egress. There is no…none..zilch…nada evidence of it giving up. I suppose no harm in… Read more »
chris

not anymore…
Got mu brand new Civic with factory overfilled engine by 1.5 liter…Blew open all gaskets. Now, I am very happy with my Bolt replacement

CLAY

l also am in a similar situation. I am a retired aircraft mechanic, I tend to maintain things, just a habit I developed in the USCG (C-130’s) and I have a 1998 Honda Accord with 485K miles on it, standard maintenance along the way, rebuilt the tranny at 360K. The car is showroom clean. When I put a 2019 Leaf in the garage I am going to just give the Accord away to a deserving high school student’s parents, not the student. Let the family do as they see fit. I work at a H.S. I see the respectful and deserving hard workers that would appreciate the gift.

Jack Morgan

Yes, that does sound off indeed. However, it makes me want to take a look at a Volt now, as perhaps an alternative to my (getting less and less range) LEAF.

EVBlogger

My car 2013 Chevy Volt Premium throwed message every 2 days in winter , in SOUTH CAROLINA, min temp is -10 F.

I am taking it to dealer soon, thats the proof

Pushmi-Pullyu

2013VOLT said:

“I could use it for my 2013 Volt battery… I am constantly getting Propulsion Power Reduced warnings when driving on the range extender because the reserve capacity isn’t there anymore.”

This is the first I’ve read of any evidence that any Volt has exhausted its reserve capacity, which apparently is pretty large when it’s new. I think I’ve seen estimates as high as 35% reserve?

Is the same reduced power showing up in 2011-2012 Volts?

Will

Propulsion refuce is more to do with the battery and electric motor needing to warm up instead of degradation. It has happen to me twice but it was in below temps

ModernMarvelFan
” The unfortunate side affect is now I am constantly getting Propulsion Power Reduced warnings when driving on the range extender because the reserve capacity isn’t there anymore” I call that BS. 1. If that is true, then it is the “hybrid” battery buffer that is exhausted. So it means the battery got drained too far. That would mean that SW didn’t hide the degradation at all since the degradation buffer is on top and bottom. If they are opening up, then it wouldn’t have bottom up farther than it needs to. 2. you have a 2013. You have a HOld mode. If you hold the car for more than 1.2 kWh (you can do so by reading the usage buffer), do the Propulsion reduction still comes on? If it doesn’t, then it isn’t a battery degradation problem but rather a problem with your SW calibration for the low end.. 3. If the battery pack gets too hot, the propulsion will be reduced as well. That can happen as the battery ages which can be caused by the “fast charging by engine”. When that happens, it means your battery is getting degraded so it generates more heat than usual. It… Read more »
Devin Serpa

If you can live with 30% battery degradation, sure.

ffbj

Not really. Tesla never promised to produce junk batteries that would turn car into a paperweight within a few years, causing it lose 3/4 or more of it’s value.
Oh thank you Nissan for being so innovate and considerate.
Typical of the depth, thoughtful consideration, and general hokum, that your comments tend to illustrate..

AndyG

Tesla does not need a battery recycling plant because they use an active liquid cooling system on their packs so they last 10-20 times as long as Nissan and won’t be repurposed for 15-20 years. I should know I had a 2012 Leaf that lost 40 percent of capacity in 2 years and a 2017 Leaf that I handed back after it lost 27% after one Phoenix summer. My 5 year old Model S lost 5% of it’s range over 5 years and based on that reliability and proof that their product works, I purchased a new Model 3. The final straw for me for Nissan is they could care less about my car despite my repeated attempts to get them to acknowledge there was a battery problem. I’m done with Nissan, too little too late.

Pet

Customers would be happy if they charge a little more in exchange for a larger pack. But then that would not benefit the sales of Nissan’s newer models.

Somebody should develope a replacement larger
pack for those thousands of used leaf. That could be a good business

Djoni

Absolutly!
And I expect that it will come, but not from Nissan.
Althought it would be a good incentive to keep their dealer happy with new source of revenu, replacing used batterry and rising resale value of all Leaf on the road.
Let’s hope Nissan seize this opportunity.

Dwayne

I agree! I have a wonderful 2013 leaf with no battery degradation – but I really need an upgrade from 85 miles to about 150 or so. I love my car; I just need more range!

No battery degradation, eh? You should take your Leaf for service, because your battery gauge is broken. It’s a law of Physics that Li batteries degrade.

William

No “noticeable” battery degradation. That will definitely change when the first bar (#12) drops, within the next 6 months. Then you’ll be down almost 15% in battery capacity, all of a sudden.

I wish LeafSpy Pro was used by all Leaf drivers, before posting their miraculous battery claims.

TimE

“You should take your Leaf for service, because your battery gauge is broken.” – HA! That’s funny!

Just had my 2 year battery check done by a Nissan dealer – I get back a report that shows everything I already know:
1. Shows my current number of battery capacity bars that is shown on the dash.
2. Shows a brief synopsis of “Frequent use of Quick Charging”, “Frequent Charging when battery state of charge is already high”, and “Too much electric consumption while driving” – all designated as a score of 1 to 5 stars.

I get far better detail from LeafSpy than I ever will from the battery report from Nissan… In my case, battery status is 12 of 12 bars, and 5 stars for each of the 3 synopsis areas – so in other words – a perfect score. Yet, LeafSpy shows my battery around 88 to 90% State of Health lately. So what good is a battery check like this?!?

James P Heartney

We have a 2013 Leaf with all bars, though LeafSpy says it’s down to around 85% state of health, so I expect we’ll be losing a bar soon. For the record, this is a Leaf S with no DCFC, so it’s never been fast charged. We live in Missouri, which gets fairly hot summers, but we keep the car garaged nearly all the time.

Derek

+1+1+1+1+1

David Murray

I’d be interested in how these batteries are refabricated.

vdiv

They find flaky cells and they put them in your battery 😉

Will

How your i3 rex tunning. Thinking about getting a i3 rex but worth software changes? Any battery degradation? Rex maintaince?

kubel

It’s not clear if this is a Japan only initiative or if it will be available for the NA market as well.

John Frey

You are correct, it’s not clear at all. This sounds like Leaf to Home so far, US vaporware. I hope this is a start in the right direction.

Peter

I don’t know, but Sumitomo and Nissan had this to say about 4R Energy Corp.:

http://www.sumitomocorp.co.jp/english/news/detail/id=25990
Company Name : 4R Energy Corporation
Business Description : Demonstration tests and commercialization study for second-life use of lithium-ion batteries for automotive use
Targeted Region : Japan and North America

https://www.nissan-global.com/EN/ZEROEMISSION/APPROACH/COMPREHENSIVE/4RBUSINESS/
“In addition, Nissan is extensively involved with 4R activities in the United States.”

G2

Thanks Peter!

Peter

FYI the reason the company is named 4R Energy Corp. is because 4R stands for the “4R” business model—which reuses, resells, refabricates and recycles lithium-ion batteries.

Source: https://www.nissan-global.com/EN/ZEROEMISSION/APPROACH/COMPREHENSIVE/4RBUSINESS/

4R =
Reuse
Resell
Refabricate
Recycle

Jon

Any indication if the refurb packs get new cells?

Ziv

I haven’t seen anything that states whether any new cells are used in a re-furb pack, but if I had to guess, I would say no. Take 3 old packs, if you are lucky and only 30% of the cells are defective you can put together 2 re-furb packs. More likely that you will need 4 old packs to make 2 re-furbs but who knows?
Regardless, $2850US for a 24 kWh re-furb pack is a nice option. If I lived in California, I would be tempted to get a 2013 or 2014 Nevada Leaf that has lost several bars but otherwise looks great and is priced right. They are selling for $6k to $8k right now. Bring it to CA and get the new re-furb pack and you have a nearly new city car for $8850 to $10,850. Or get the 30 kWh re-furb for a bit more.

Chris Brenny

It would be a terrible idea to not replace all the cells. What would be the point. When people trade in their packs, all of their cells will be degraded, not just a few “defective” ones.

Ziv

It doesn’t look like cells degrade uniformly. If the original pack had a supposed rating of 75% capacity remain after 8 years, half the cells will be in pretty good shape. Will the re-furb pack last 8 years? Probably not, but it may last 6 or 7 before it too drops back to 75%. The problem isn’t just that different chemistries age differently, but individual cells do as well.
Or so I would guess, judging by articles I have read. So that and $4 will get you a cup of coffee…

Asak

I think this suggests that what we’re really seeing with the pack degradation is a few really bad cells that don’t hold as much voltage, which forces the whole pack to be run at a lower voltage. If you remove the worst cells you can then refabricate a usable pack since the bum cells are no longer hindering the good ones.

With a lot of this complex manufacturing it just turns out that some cells/chips/etc. are better than others. So while some cells will crap out relatively quickly, there are others that will last a very long time.

vdiv

This is why recyclers get old cell laptop batteries in bulk. One or two of the cells will be shot, but the rest would be in good shape so they are re-purposed into new packs for electric skateboards, bicycles, home storage, etc. Folks who do EV conversions also buy used battery packs and re-purpose modules in their projects. There are tools to measure the health of a cell that measure internal resistance, charge loss over time, etc. The easiest way is to put the cell through a charge-discharge cycle using the appropriate C rates.

Tom
I think now that we are down to viable cost structure on batteries and distance is coming into line, I think this is the next stage. My expectation is that within 5 years battery packs will have a much simpler modularity to them which will allow. 1. Quick removal/install on a module level. For instance in the Chrysler Pacifica PHEV the pack is in the empty space where normally the seats would fold down into in the stow and go. 2. Module level onboard diagnostics. In the pacifica example perhaps you can remove/add modules of cells by flipping open the hatch in the floor and pulling them out/inserting them in a similar fashion to how a blade server (or in the old days SCSI drives) mounts in a data center rack. Common electrical backplane with pin based insert. 3. Plug and play battery modules allows your battery to have a flexible size. In the Pacifica example perhaps it has X kwh of battery but some open slots where expansion pack of Y size could fit. Your house has an energy storage unit of Z kwh with Z>Y. You normally only drive a few miles but today you are taking a… Read more »
Peter

Link to the 4R Energy website: http://www.4r-energy.com

At the moment only available in Japanese. If you click at “English” at the top right corner it just says “This Web page is currently unavailable due to maintenance. Please come back later.”

J.

About time for after market battery packs. Too many good ev’s are not getting the maximum use due to battery degradation. An ev should be good for well over 100,000 miles or beyond. The battery is the weak link for the non-Tesla products. I like both of my ev’s. In time, I hope that upgraded, aftermarket battery packs will be available.

TM

Math error
Line 3
offered for 300,000 yen apiece (around $2,850).

Line 6
(300,000 yen or ≈$6,200)

Line 6 is wrong.

should be: (as stated further down line 20 ish)
650,000 yen for 24 kWh;

Ziv

TM, an important caveat about your last line. It is 650,000 Yen for an exchange for a brand new 24 kWh pack vs. 300,000 Yen for an exchange for a re-furb 24 kWh pack. You weren’t wrong, but it helps to make it really clear why there is the difference in prices. Both are exchanges but the buyer gets a different product.
“Nissan will initially offer 24-kilowatt-hour refabricated batteries for 300,000 yen apiece, with plans to expand the lineup. Exchange costs for brand-new Nissan LEAF batteries are 650,000 yen for 24 kWh; 800,000 yen for 30 kWh; and 820,000 yen for 40 kWh.“

Mark

I agree, it is not clear if this will be offered in North America. There should be an update with the current information on this. I would also like to know what the refabrication process is, and is there any sort of warranty for the refabricated battery?

Stimpacker

If they’re sold in America for that price, they’d make great energy storage for home solar…

Ziv

Stim, that price is contingent upon you exchanging your old pack to get the re-furb pack. It is similar to getting a CORE price when you trade in an old engine block or alternator for a new one, the parts department gives you a lower price since you are giving them the material to use on a rebuild of the older engine block or alternator that you are trading in.
If you don’t exchange a pack they will either not allow you to buy the re-furb pack until all other demand is satisfied, or they will charge a higher price.

Dan

Great Idea.

Eddy Kilowatt

I didn’t read any of the fine print, but do they actually state a capacity for the “24 kWh refurb battery”? I presume it’s not actually 24 kWh since that would be same as brand-new, but they must say something about actual kWh, or percent, or bars, or some sort of unit…

James P Heartney

It probably has full capacity, but if it’s made out of used cells then all of them have been through many duty cycles already. If so, you could expect fairly serious degradation to begin almost immediately. I’d wait and see what sort of user experience these refabricated battery packs provide before buying one.

I think Leaf battery replacements will offer better value once there are third parties making and selling them. No idea when that will be.

Asak

It depends whether the degradation is linear or not. It could be that degradation actually slows down after the first X cycles. Of course, it could also be the opposite, in which case a refabricated battery would be a really bad buy.

david cary

Right. And degradation is generally not linear. It is fast at first and then slows down. That is well documented with Teslas. I can’t remember if that is true for the Leaf but I am nearly sure that it is.

So it maybe in fact, that used is better. Hard to say for sure. Depending on the variability, if you get good used ones they could be better than bad new ones.

The variability on Tesla’s seem to be significant. Hard to say if that is software and calibration but there are some significant outliers.

Chris Brenny

They must be using new cells. That’s why they are repurposing the old cells for stationary storage, otherwise where would they come from? I assume new cells, but re-using the enclosures, cables, electronics, and other bits from the old packs.

Tom in NY

I think that by refurbishment they mean: reuse all the pack stuff and install new cells. Most things that are ‘refurbished’ are brought up to the same specifications as a new item, and they have the same warrantee.
If this is the case, then I’ll probably replace the pack in my 2012 LEAF that has lost 3 capacity bars and has 75,000 miles on the odometer. It would be like getting a new 2012 LEAF for $2800. How is that not a good deal?

EVShopper

That’s not too bad. A friend is looking at a $1600 automatic transmission rebuild for an 8 year old ICE vehicle with 150,000miles on it.

And I once had to put down $5000 for new engine in a 90’s era Toyota Camry.

scott

I had a 92′ Dodge Dynasty that went through three transmissions at approx $2000 a pop.

I bought my 2014 Leaf years ago with the hope that since they were the only mass produced (affordable) EV at the time that eventually a replacement battery of higher capacity would become available. No indication of that here yet, but I surely hope so!

I’m just shy of 94,000 miles (150,000 km) with 1 bar down. I’ll need to replace my battery in about a year anyways to be able to continue my commute… I’m really crossing my fingers I could get the 40 kWh pack. I’d happily pay the $6800 + replacement fee to upgrade my range substantially as opposed to buying a new car. The car otherwise runs perfectly. As a poster further up noted, the ability to replace/upgrade your battery in these older cars is really the only hope a dealer ever has of making a few $ on an EV as well-built as the Leaf after it leaves their lot.

And for the acronym of the Leading Environmentally friendly Affordable Family car (LEAF) to be true, we really do need a viable battery upgrade path for the 2011-2017 LEAFs!!

Mike

If be curious to know if you can increase the capacity of the battery. I.e. can you swap out old 24kwh with a30kwh or even 40kwh battery?

Bill Kirk

So I’m ready to buy….When do they come to the US (and if there here, where)?

scott

Refurbished batteries will arrive in the US just as soon as the ENV-200 arrives. So, never.

William

“Never”, is a probable timeline for Nissan North America.

Dan

A new Civic or Corolla will go 250k miles or 20 years and has 300-500 mi. range with 5 minute recharge. EVs are not mass market vehicles yet.

David Gould

> with 5 minute recharge

If you happen to live at a gas station. Otherwise you have to drive there and back. Hard to beat the convenience of home charging.

Mark.ca

+1

MathIsCool

Let’s do the math on that.
Civic gets 32mpg city 42highway. Let’s be generous and say 35mpg.
Civic gas tank size is 12.4 gallons.
12.4X35=434. Ok.
Over 250,000 miles you will fill your tank about 575 times. It takes at least 10minutes to drive to a gas stop, deal with payment, wait to fill up, maybe have to wait for another driver to finish.
575X10minutes=5750 minutes, or ~96hours, or basically 4 days wasted of your life sucking in gas fumes and supporting the oil industry and military industrial complex that keeps it going, and fueling more “war on terror”, but I digress,…

While you are standing around filling your tank, I’ve already spent a few seconds plugging in and am now doing something more worthwhile. Like posting comments on the internet, or playing with my kids, or having dinner, or sleeping.

Pushmi-Pullyu

Well, knock me over with a feather! I never thought we would see auto makers offer replacement battery packs for truly mass produced cars.

However, this is repackaging used batteries, so it’s not like Nissan is cutting into their supply of new batteries for their new cars.

This should help the resale value of Leafs, which I’m guessing is the primary purpose Nissan is doing this.

ffbj

How about as a remedy for people bringing law suits.

EVer

Knowing that Nissan cells degrade because of aging and also from use, the question one should ask is will the cells be new or used? I’m OK with using the existing parts in the battery; but, I want all brand new cells in the battery.

And,BTW, If I’m looking for a commuter car, I would certainly look at a used Leaf with a rebuilt battery pack from Nissan…but only if the cells are new.

We should know what they are up too in time. Right now there are more questions than information and a whole lot of speculation going on!

Rob

Hot damn! I want a battery for my house at those sorts of prices!

Terawatt

Positive development. And actually sooner than most of us expected.

Some day there will be replacements and upgrades on offer, including from third parties. Maybe not for the early LEAFs, but probably for the first EV to be manufactured in a volume over a million. Could be the Model 3, but more likely IMO the VW I.D.

The economics aren’t working for this yet, but it gets more doable each month and should be a profitable thing to offer within a decade, at least in places with decent EV share and decent-size populations.

Eric L

Would be very interested in knowing was in involved in the recycling/refurb process. Ie: energy inputs, replacement parts, etc..

In the coming years, lots of batteries will be coming offline out of cars/trucks/buses and their second (and 3rd) lives shows promise – both for alternate applications (home power storage, refurb for cars) – how the various batteries from various sources will work together will be important.

Exciting times.

Mark.ca

At that price forget about used leafs…the home storage diy’s will grab them if available in US. For $3k i would definitely buy the 24kw. That’s a deal!

Nick

I suspect you need to submit your old pack as a core to be eligible for this price.

William

Some Leaf (Nissan) salvage yards do have 24kWh batteries for around $3k in So. Cal.

Most moderate or worse front end collisions put 2011-2012 Leafs past the point of no return, for insurance companies.

Mark.ca

I have to check what the Leaf battery situation is. Last time i looked into batteries about a year ago, they were selling a Tesla module for $2K…kinda expensive!

mt

Many Leaf owners will be more interested in Upgrade to say 150+ miles.

Derek

ya got that right, but I’m sure a 24kwh battery is a fair bit smaller then the new 40kwh.

Mr. Trump

Dear Nissan, Murica would also like this.

Carl

Not too many bright EV readers or posters here!! FYI the reason why the Volt batteries don’t degrade is as obvious as the circle is round & the square is a four corner!! The Volt is a HYBRID & it’s NOT a pure EV like the Leaf. The Volt is programmed to drive in EV mode for 53miles ONLY when the battery is FULLY charged then it’s ICE generator takes over & ‘drives’ the Volt thru the battery so the electric motor still drives the wheels. This is a very well engineered approach by GM that’s why there are NEVER any Volt battery issues.

EVer

Not Really! The long lived Volt (a serial hybrid) battery has been in large part attributed to the larger charge headroom in the Volt battery, i.e., meaning the Volt battery is only charged to about 65%; starting with a capacity of 16kWh, it is only charged to about 10.3kWh, whereas the 24kWh Leaf (aBEV) battery is charged to about 21kWh, a smaller head room of about 88%. Experts believe the less percentage charge capacity used in lithium batteries the longer the life of the battery.

I think you get idea here…the lower the depth of charge, the better for cell longevity… and this is believed to work for all cell chemistries.

Asak

This is why I only charge my e-Golf to 70% most of the time and only do a full charge when absolutely required. I figure that with the built in buffer that I’m guessing is probably only about 10%, I’m only charging to about 60%. I also only rarely run the battery down that low, so it probably cycles between 30-60% most of the time.

We’ll see what it does for battery longevity!

Mark.ca

Mine after almost 2 years of charging to 100% at least 2 times a week and discharging to red almost weekly shows almost 0 degradation. I get the same numbers as when it was new. L1 charging only.

Jacked Beanstalk

What kills Li-ion is deep discharge and thermal stress.

GM and Tesla batteries have reserve capacity but mainly they last because they possess sophisticated liquid thermal management systems to maintain an optimal battery temperature; the battery is warmed in the winter and cooled in the summer (or under hard driving).

Nissan uses a fan to cool their batteries and have no provisions to heat the batteries. It’s the equivalent of a shade tree mechanic’s DIY EV.

Djoni

Nissan Leaf don’t have a cooling fan and do have a standby heater to maintain the battery over -15c°.
It’s on the owner manual and you can check with basic observation of the fading energy when you park unplug in colder than -15c°.
The E-NV200, Nissan van, have a fan to cool the battery, the car has not.

Puja

Lithium Ion Battery Market worth 68.97 Billion USD by 2022
The major players involved in the lithium ion battery market are LG Chem Ltd. (South Korea), Panasonic Corporation (Japan), Samsung SDI Co., Ltd. (South Korea), BYD Co. Ltd. (China), BAK Group (China), A123 Systems, LLC. (U.S.), GS Yuasa Corporation (Japan), Hitachi, Ltd. (Japan), Johnson Controls Inc. (U.S.), Saft Groupe S.A. (France), Toshiba Corporation (Japan), and Valence Technology Inc. (U.S.).
Read more@ https://www.marketsandmarkets.com/Market-Reports/lithium-ion-battery-market-49714593.html

Is it possible to upgrade 30kWh to 40kWh ? or is it just replacement of existing battery ???

EVDave

I think the good thing here is that it shows demand. Leaf drivers are using their cars for lots of real world driving and racking up demand for new batteries. That’s another bit of evidence that EVs are viable transportation products. Even better that Leaf owners know there might be a more realistic option for keeping their cars for the long run. I would do this and give the car to one of my kids in a few years. Super.

My friends have an older Leaf. They only drive it half of it’s charge range everyday so, they never fast charge it. They just use a regular wall receptacle overnight. The net result is that their Leaf battery is not showing any signs of decline over the years. Their original embedded Lithium Ion Battery is still going strong.

Stephen Hodges

I too have an older (2011) Leaf, but despite only having done 35k miles and never fast charged, I’m down to 6 bars and 49%. I have come to the conclusion that the latest advice on “allowing the battery to cool down before charging” is the key. I have always (slow) charged on reaching home, in case I need to go back out. That seems to have been the problem. I am tempted to get the van version purely for the battery cooling

Nick O'Brien

I have a 2012, original battery, 11/12 capacity bars. The trick (which I learned from the original owner) is to use the built in timer to charge to 80% always, except for the few times you may actually need the extra 20% range and are going to use it right away. I just plug it in when I get home, unplug it when I take it out. I never think about cool down, but then I also park in a covered garage both at work and home so mine isn’t often subjected to the hot sun. Charging is done with the factory Nissan EVSE which has been converted to a use a 240v outlet. I’ve had the car for close to a year now and haven’t seen any further battery degradation.

Gary

The poor slobs thinking things are going great losing no bars YET. This is where the fun begins. LOL. So, just $2,800 for a used battery. After tax & install $4K.
So w/ a rebuilt battery the car is still worth just $3, 500 on a good day. Thanks for nothing.
BTW – VIN 000659 here – & after only $80k miles, range is only 40 miles, reliably, and no hills, warm weather. Nissan? NEVER again. BTW, tests are in, showing bigger packs die even faster.

Jacked Beanstalk

What Nissan have done with their air cooled batteries is absolutely shameful. They’ve poisoned the public’s perception of EVs by making them believe that EVs are just like smartphones in that the battery will wear out long before the rest of the car.

It’s like those guys hypermiling on the expressway thinking they’re saving energy. They are, for themselves, but all the gassers who pass them by look at them and think the slow speed is because EVs aren’t capable of higher speed. I’ve had guys ask me this about my Volt, “but isn’t is SLOW? I see Volts doing 60 on the expressway every day!”

Carl

STUPID post Gary…You drove your Leaf 80k miles (not $80k) then you complain that it costs $2800 for another battery!! If you had to pay for gas for those 80k miles at 25mpg it would cost you $11200!! So for a quarter of the cost you come out ahead by $9000!!!! Still no good?!?!?! Get a bike…it costs 0 to run. But then you have to buy one for a couple bills. Too much?!?!

Jacked Beanstalk

Excellent news. I get a discount on a new 12V car battery when I turn in the old one. It should be the same for any car battery, regardles of chemistry.

These batteries could also be repurposed for home solar installations. People in the US are using salvaged Volt batteries for this purpose on a DIY basis so there is definitely demand for them.

As for Nissan specifically, they could simply engineer a liquid cooled/heated battery so that Leaf owners don’t need to replace their batteries.

Retired Engineer

Not interested in a newer 24kwh battery, but I’d be very interested in trading in my 2014 Leaf’s aging 24kwh pack, for one of the 30 or 40 kwh ones!

I’d pay real money for that….

NALAKA KUMARAPELI

What is the SOH of this battery ?

NALAKA KUMARAPELI

what is the SOH this new battery ?

Matthew J.

Today I called a local company to see how much they charge for a reconditioned battery for an electric car. They said they only sell reconditioned batteries for Hybrid but not for all electric cars. I said why but they did not answer they just said it is where the money is