Elon Musk, Morgue, Ford F-150 And Rouge – Oh Boy!

Elon Musk

JUN 29 2018 BY STEVEN LOVEDAY 95

Tesla CEO Elon Musk ruffles the feathers of a Ford exec and receives a telling reply from Detroit.

In a recent interview with the Wall Street Journal that also consisted of a Fremont factory tour, Musk told the publication that he’s feeling good about Tesla’s recent efforts. He did share that the automaker has not made some of the best choices in the past, especially related to Tesla Model 3 production. However, he continues to seem optimistic about the company’s new production “tent.” When speaking about a related topic, Musk told the WSJ:

I’m feeling good about things. I think there’s a good vibe—I think the energy is good; go to Ford, it looks like a morgue.

Twitter user Scott Austin shared the quote, along with the story, which then received attention from Mark Truby, Ford’s Vice President of Communications. Truby attached Austin’s original Tweet and copied it to Musk with a statement directed at Tesla’s “makeshift tent” and a comparison to Ford’s Rouge plant, which cranks out a high-quality F-150 every 53 seconds. To Truby’s credit, he communicated it rather well, albeit calling the tent “funky,” but simply shedding some light on the reality after Musk’s harsh statement.

Tesla will attempt to prove itself to shareholders, naysayers, potential customers and investors, and people across the globe next week as it shares production and sales figures for Q2. There have been mixed reports about whether or not the automaker will be able to pull off the 5,000/wk Model 3 production numbers that Musk has been continually referencing. In terms of deliveries, that situation is sticky as well, due to Tesla nearing the 200k mark, which will begin the sunset of the U.S. federal EV tax credit.

Ford and Tesla are the only two American automakers that have not filed for bankruptcy. Aside from that connection, the two companies couldn’t be more different. As Tesla pushes EV adoption, Ford has been slow with its electrification efforts and just recently announced that it’s doing away with production of most passenger cars.

Source: Teslarati

Categories: Ford, Tesla

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95 Comments on "Elon Musk, Morgue, Ford F-150 And Rouge – Oh Boy!"

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What I think gets lost in all the hoopla is how quickly Tesla, and SpaceX, have been able to a) become competitive with established companies and the b) surpass them.

Last year Tesla was making something like 500-600 X and S cars a week. Now within 12 months they are producing Model 3s at a rate similar to what the established brands can achieve, with a 100 year head start.

Compare this with SpaceX launching their first rocket 10 years ago and where they are today with 20-30 launches a year, landing most of their 1st stage boosters, nearing manned space flight with the Dragon crew capsule and sending a Roadster into space.

Pretty cool in my opinion and it makes you wonder where Tesla could be in 10 years.

We actually see where Tesla is in ten years, lol just sayin.

Yep. Trillion dollar company.

hahaha! you should do comedy…

Look at where they were ten years ago and expect wonderful things….unless you’re a short buyer.

“…with a 100 year head start.” (???) LOL

Tesla haven’t surpassed Ford or Gm

Investors beg to disagree. And of course, valuation doesn’t lie. Tesla’s market value is $56.7 billion, surpassing Ford’s market value of $43.2 billion and General Motors’ value of $55.5 billion. So I can definitely state that you are wrong: Tesla has surpassed GM and Ford.

Market cap does not tell the whole story…

Oh but they have, in many ways.

In value they have.

Not in Total Vehicles Produced, Total Vehicle Production Rate, or maybe even per 53 Ford F150 Seconds, but in Battery Electric Vehicles (Not PHEV’s), no doubt, Tesla is buzzing and way ahead of GM and Ford already! Not too shabby for a new kid in the Auto World of OEM’s! Any other EV players making more? Even BYD is now starting to feel the heat, in who produces more Freeway Capable BEV’s!

Tesla actually produces way more BEVs than BYD. A large part of BYDs sales is PHEVs. (Which is rare for a Chinese maker…)

BAIC is actually Tesla’s only real rival at this point in terms of BEV sales. (If you can even call them rivals, considered the isolated Chinese market…)

Tesla has not surpassed any maker, and every day is chaos at Tesla, Like Truby said Ford rolls off an F150 every 53 seconds, in one plant and on one line, they also have other plants building F150 at the same rate. Its like a clock, not a war zone to reach production like at Tesla.

Not in its first 10 years, but I would not bet against it in the next 10 years. Ford F-150 are super popular now (in USA only, obviously), but then so were Nokia’s phones 10 years ago. The world moves on, Ford have the might and tecnologybto crack on now if they wanted to, I don’t understand why they don’t start. The world needs EVs and Ford/GM can do really well if they are part of it.

We can do it, so lets do it.

“Competitive?” Are they “competitive” if the government wasn’t underwriting $7500 of every vehicle they sell? Are they “competitive” if they can’t accomplish 1/100th of the volume of other manufacturers?

What Bizarro Tesla basher world do you live in where the government “underwrites” $7500 of every vehicle Tesla makes?

You’d like everyone to ignore some “inconvenient facts”: Half of Tesla’s sales are overseas, where not a penny of that potential $7500 is available; and $7500 is the maximum available to American buyers, many of whom don’t qualify for all of it.

The up-to-$7500 incentive for U.S. sales will drop to half around October 1 of this year. We’ll see just how much Tesla’s sales drop at that time. Hint: any drop in sales is gonna be much, much less than half!

We can do it, so lets do it.

Right, so what you’re saying is, Tesla sales are underwritten by the feds, you’re just disputing the amount. And link that “50%” of Tesla sales are over seas, or that “many” US buyers don’t qualify for it.

And then there’s the emissions credits market that Tesla benefits from and is wholly underwritten by the government.

And then I noticed you ignored the volume question.

Emissions Credits are underwritten by ICE Automakers, who don’t make Enough for themselves, and have to either buy them from other Auto OEM’s, like Tesla or GM, who have excess Credits! The Government simply Fines them, if they are short, hence the varying value of them, if you are Honest, and have followed this since it began, or done your research!

Tell me any other American, or Foreign Automaker that is NOT getting their BEV’s/ PHEV’s “Underwritten” by a $7,500 Buyer Incentive, for selling their PEV’s in the USA! Try! Find even ONE!

If this was something, you might have a point! But, there is no Truth to your statement, just Stilted And Distorted Crap.

To be “competitive”, all Tesla needs to do, is take sales AWAY from their “Competitors”, by definition!

A sale of a Model 3, the hot topic of many, is simply NOT a Sale of a BMW, MB, Audi, GM, or Ford! Also, it may also be NOT a Sale of a Toyota, Honda, Kia, Volvo, SAAB, or any other make that it didn’t even “Target” as its “Competition!”

F 150 accounts for 90% of Ford’s global profits so I’m sure the vibe is pretty good at F150 production facilities. Not sure if being so dependent on a low gas mileage ICE dinosaur makes for all around good vibes at the Ford executive level though. I would be worried…

Yes, Ford has so much room for improvement in gas milage,Imagine how many they’d sell if they were autonomous and got twice the gas milage, contrast that with Tesla making only BEV’s for over 12 years and still not able to produce in any volume.So far. Love SX!!

Teslas only made BEVs for 6 years. Lotus made all the roadsters.

The Roadster was made based on Lotus design. That’s it. They did not produce the car as far as I have manged to locate any sources.

at Lotus factory tour that said that the frame was produced in Lotus norfolk then shipped to US where Tesla installed battery and motor and then shipped back to norfolk where Lotus put body on and then shipped back to US

Perhaps you should locate a better source than a Lotus factory tour. Tesla signed a Roadster production contract on July 11, 2005, with Group Lotus to produce “gliders” (complete cars but without powertrain). Unfortunately, it turned out that the frame provided by Lotus needed to be completely reworked in order to fit the batteries and drivetrain. No vehicles were ever shipped back to Lotus for completion.

“Completely reworked”? I think that’s more than a slight exaggeration.

But yeah, Lotus delivered complete gliders to Tesla, which completed the cars by installing the EV powertrain including battery pack. As you say, Tesla did not ship the Roadster back to Lotus for completion.

“The Roadster was made based on Lotus design. That’s it. They did not produce the car as far as I have manged to locate any sources.”

Then you’re using rather poor sources. Lotus made the “gliders” for the 2008 Roadster; Tesla made the EV powertrain, including battery pack, and installed it in the gliders.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tesla_Roadster_(2008)#Production

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/tesla-apos-wild-ride-174539166.html

Ford Is Defenitely a High Risk Company with all their eggs in One Basket, Relying Basically On Only One Viable Product , the F150 to stay Alive…I’d hate to see what happens if Gas prices Sky Rocket …..They will all Royally Screwed ! I wouldn’t touch a Ford Share with a 10 foot Pole at this Point…

Mustang and F150 plus derivatives. If they focus on electrifying those, they have a good chance.

Ford has no chance making a profit by trying to shoehorn an EV powertrain into the F150. Compelling — and profitable — plug-in EVs are designed and built to be EVs from the ground up. Ford also has no high capacity source for EV batteries at this time.

I’m not saying Ford can’t survive the EV revolution, but in order to do so, it’s going to have to start doing things radically different than they are now, and it can’t wait much longer to start.

We can do it, so lets do it.

If Ford has no chance of selling EVs for a profit, then they’d be just like Tesla, which has yet to sell an EV for profit and is burning cash at an accelerated rate.

That’s a misconception, they actually make a profit on every vehicle they sell, the only reason their balance sheet is in the red, is because they re-invest that money (and then some) back into Tesla. Meaning on expanding their supercharger network, and making new vehicles like the Model Y, Roaster, Semi.

Trump will bailout Ford with tax payer money LOL CONNECT THE DOTS ON CLEAN AIR WAKE UP FOLKS thanks co2.earth

They have the explorer and it’s suv lineup

Ford’s large SUV’s have does very well recently, the factory has been adding shifts to keep up…

Remember what happened to full size SUV sales the last time there was a gas crunch? Massive downturn in sales.

What makes you believe we will never have another gas crunch, when gas prices are known to be cyclical, just like housing prices, and WILL go through crunches.

F150 is a the most profitable product in history

Hmmm, no, that’s probably fountain drinks sold at your local cinema. (But some notoriously overpriced prescription drugs probably exceed even that profit margin.)

Maybe the F150 is the most profitable passenger vehicle in history, but the industry for mass producing automobiles is marked by high capital investments and thin profit margins.

https://finance.yahoo.com/news/20-products-giant-markups-115730856.html

In absolute numbers, I’d say the iPhone might be the most profitable product in history? Just a wild guess, though…

Those “dinosaurs” are able to tow 10,000+ lbs across the country in just a few days. Refuels in minutes. Has a vast and fast service network . Is an affordable vehicle used by many companies for utilities. Tell me again how any ICE truck maker should be worrying? Won’t have an EV truck do that until decades from now.

ICE truck makers should (and are) worried because only a tiny percent of Private owners actually tow 10,000+ lbs across the country.

And Corporate/Fleet owners of ICE trucks that actually do regularly tow like that are profit sensitive to costs. They will convert their Fleets to EV’s as their competitors can offer the same services for less by using EV’s. EV prices are dropping as Diesel engine prices are simply going up and up. Compare the price delta between a mid-1990’s HD diesel and a standard 1500/150 gasser, and the price delta now. Meeting emissions standards has launched HD Diesel new prices through the roof to the point where as EV prices continue to drop HD Diesels simply won’t be able to compete on fleet costs.

When my wife’s Fusion energy got totaled, we did not even consider buying another one. 20 miles electric range and no trunk space does not cut it anymore.

But that mileage and trunk space were good enough to buy the car in the first place? [shakes head]

Why would you shake your head? You must be particularly judgmental.

The Fusion Energi May very well have been a great purchase at the time, but things are moving rapidly now,

Correct. 2014 model. It was the only mid sized phev sedan we could afford. We liked the car. There are just better choices now.

I got a 2013 Fusion Energi, great car otherwise, but I became very dissatisfied with Ford’s battery management and warranty. I sold it still liking the car, but disliking the company. It was down to a 14-15 mile battery after 66k and 4.5 years. When the 2017 & 18 came out I was even less satisfied with their model year improvements, so I got a Tesla. Been very happy so far.

Let’s see, the F-150 is on offshoot of the F-100. And the F-100 was introduced in 1948. I would certainly hope that Ford cold get the production line right in 80 years!!!
And if I am not mistaken, they have to but efficiency credit for each one sold?

We can do it, so lets do it.

The current Porsche 911 is an “offshoot” of the 356, a model first introduced in 1948. Would you say the 911 is an inferior product? I mean, on what planet does decades of engineering evolution equate to poor product? Oh, that’s right – Planet ElonNutHugger.

Who called the F-150 a “poor product” or “inferior product”? You’re seriously delusional.

The only point Ed made is that comparing anything from Tesla to a F-150 is ridiculous.

We can do it, so lets do it.

If the point of his argument was anything but to criticize the quality or value of the F-150, then why point out its lineage? If that wasn’t the point, then what was it? That Ford has been making trucks for a long time? Yeah, we know that already.

“Seriously delusional” – why can’t you Elon-lovers ever make a point without calling someone a name?

Seems you are the name caller by referencing.. ElonNutHugger.

Ford should be forced to use the Model E name since they fought Tesla for it.

Uh, they already have used it, but it wasn’t on a vehicle.

They used it for what?

Originally they called the Edsel the Model E
(Note the Big “E” in the background).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hbbJmsRYrnc

Yes, I’m sure Ford wants everyone to remember that car… They likely could have let the TM for the name pass to another company if they didn’t defend it.

We can do it, so lets do it.

Maybe they do, maybe they don’t, but they did use it first. Why try to move the posts? Just say, “you were right, I was wrong,” and leave it at that?

“Ford has been slow with its electrification efforts and just recently announced that it’s doing away with production of most passenger cars.”

That Ford announcement about reducing ICE car production is a direct result of them redirecting investment to EVs. Isn’t that what we want them to do?

Come on Telsarati, drop the bias and update the wording of that statement to show how positive that new is…

The arrogance among Teslarati knows no bounds!

The ignorance — willful and otherwise — among Tesla bashers knows no bounds.

You believe that? Of course designers are furiously using ink and clay, but so what? When you drop, you drop.

We’ve left the promise stage. That’s why Tesla is going to another level. It’s cash for cars time, and Ford/others aren’t showing up. Instead, they play media’s crutch, like WSJ with “cheap” $3 gas, and “nobody wants cars”, or the light truck loop-hole in the CAFE regs.

They quit. What else can we say?

“That Ford announcement about reducing ICE car production is a direct result of them redirecting investment to EVs.”

No, it’s a direct result of declining sales (and thus narrower profit margins) of sedans and other “cars” vs. light trucks such as pickups and SUVs.

If Ford is redirecting a significant amount of its revenue into making EVs, then it must be hiding nearly all the evidence for that!

Well, they did explicitly say the want to focus on “trucks and EVs”… Though I have a suspicion the “trucks” part of that statement is a bit more prominent 😉

My guess is he might have been talking about Ford EV and car sales. Both are hurting

Exactly since Ford no longer makes an EV, just the Fusion PHEV, and Fusion/MKZ hybrid. As of 2019, Ford will have ZERO EV offerings. And not planning anything until 2021. Their only ‘electrification’ efforts will be hybrids. Yea, hybrids that were popular 10 years ago, and now 10 years late. Then killing off cars because they didn’t invest in EV tech early enough, actually waited 3 years too late, and now don’t have the cash to offer next-gen sedans and EVs at the same time. Just a whole lot of poor management decisions. Now they are just focused on huge oversized/overpriced SUVs at the same time gas prices are rising and SUV sales are dropping, and compact/less expensive car sales are spiking. When Musk talks about the truck factory being like a morgue, he is talking about the enthusiasm of the workers. Looking at volume, 543 F-150 trucks come off the assembly line every 8-hour shift. 1,629 per 3 shifts. 11,400 weekly with 24/7 shifts. Tesla is initially reaching for 6,000 Model 3 units for 24/7 shifts. The goal is 10,000 weekly per 24/7 shifts by end of 2019. The big difference here is that Ford is putting similar components… Read more »

Cars sales are not spiking stop lying

Amazingly enough, there is an automobile market outside the USA, where sales of small cars are indeed climbing rapidly. China is perhaps the most obvious example.

Stop being so parochial.

Did the drop the Focus EV already? Shame, it was a nice looking car…

I’ve not even seen a Focus EV (for real), yet in the UK and I have asked multiple times. Somehow one of car mags even placed it in the top 10 EVs 2 years ago!!

Ford, well they make the F-150, and what else? Seems they are dropping most of their sedan lines, moving production to Canada & Mexico, while stock just limps along like a zombie.
They are pretty worthless.

I think refurbishing the old Detroit train station is cool. It will be the mausoleum where they will develop new electric technology for their vehicles. So not really a morgue, but more a place where bodies go to their final rest after they have been on the slab.

To be fair they are only pulling sedans out of North America. They will continue with their sedans in other countries. They are just not as profitable as there were years ago when gas was more expensive.

*”Ford, well they make the F-150, and what else?”*

Gee, I don’t know, lets see-

Ecosport
Escape
Edge
Explorer
Flex
Expedition
Transit Van
Transit Connect
Focus Active
Mustang
GT
Super Duty
and soon
Ranger
Bronco

I know that’s greatly eclipsed by Tesla-

Model S
Model X
Model 3

Of course soon, very soon, pretty much every other vehicle anyone can think of except a motorcycle.

hehe EcoSport, it’s neither.
Never heard to the Focus Active… have to go look that one up.
Hard to serious count the GT. It’s was instantly sold out of it’s limited run.
I bet Ford rethinks dropping 300,000+ car sales a year. I’m sure there is a happy medium between 0 and what they do now.

We can do it, so lets do it.

Again, you’re wrong, the OP is right – why is it so hard for your sort to just admit when you’re wrong? It’s weird how you seem to refuse to acknowledge reality. “Never heard of it, so it doesn’t exit.” So weird.

They just don’t sell and have no margin. I think they are clearing they decks so to speak to prepare for the inevitable ev future, they are just way behind. They need to start making vehicles people want, besides the F-150.
They need to show shareholders they’re not the decrepit dinosaur they appear to be. Which is tough since they are.

Right. I should have added the Mustang and excluded commercial vehicles, and stipulated vehicles that anyone cares about. No Tesla does not eclipse them in numbers, just in value.
I might add that Tesla sedans have something that Ford’s don’t: Demand.

Anyone else think this sounds like NOKIAs product line up 10 years ago?

I find it kind of hilarious that the Ford guy actually used the term “high tech” to describe his giant ICE powered beast. How is 19th century technology high tech?

If you get into one of the top of the line ($70+K F150s), they are pretty high tech compared to the rest of the car industry, However, Ford is nowhere near the technology advancement you see in Tesla cars. Currently, no other car manufacture can bet Tesla on the software end when integrating hardware with software. It’s just too bad legacy manufacture sat on their butt and gave Tesla a 10+ years head start……else we’ll have true competition in the EV market place right now.

You can get Raptors well over $100,000 (Roush, Shelby not withstanding).

There’s actually more high tech involved in getting a modern ICE vehicle to meet the latest emissions and fuel economy goals than a simple EV drive system. That’s been a talking point of BEV’s; the simplicity of the drive train.

We can do it, so lets do it.

Way, way more mechanical engineering goes into a modern ICE than an EV. And EV is simply a batter, a motor (coiled copper), and some sort of controller. I guess more chemical engineering goes into a battery, but it’s certainly debatable.

We can do it, so lets do it.

By that logic, the electric car isn’t “high tech” either – the firsts ones were sold in the late 1800’s.

Mind linking the source of the WSJ article in the article?

Good for Ford’s Vice President of Communications, Mark Truby, in taking the high road when responding to Elon’s trash talking.

Elon Musk is one of my heroes, but he certainly needs to stop making rude, “unfiltered” public remarks about his competitors. It’s very unprofessional.

+1

It might not be “professional” in the traditional sense; but in today’s attention economy, this sort of behaviour is unfortunately a pragmatic thing… I’m pretty sure all in all it benefits Tesla’s success.

With Ford getting out of small cars (and EVs)… WHERE WILL THEY GET ZEV CREDITS FOR THEIR F150s ?!?
Sorry for being a bit loud, but have they made a deal with another EV company?

This is what I still cannot understand. Help me, that neither makes any sense to me, nor to Elon Musk… hence his “morgue” comment.

They can buy them from other sources like…… Tesla.

The F-150 is a great truck. Have you seen the Tesla pickup rendering> Ford had better wKe up!

F 150 is a great truck if it were 1950 LOL but I guess Trump supporters will use it to drive to their factory jobs making clothes, shoes, kitchen utensils, plastic toys etc…getting paid $10 per hour without benefits and no sick days lol since unions are being killed off MAGA LOL CONNECT THE DOTS ON CLEAN AIR WAKE UP FOLKS thanks co2.earth

“F150” and “high tech” in the same sentence- ROFL!