Bjørn Nyland’s Tesla Model X Battery Lost 3% Capacity At 21,750 Miles

JUN 9 2018 BY MARK KANE 42

Bjørn Nyland tested available battery capacity in his Tesla Model X and found around a 3% loss after 35,000 km (21,750 miles).

Tesla Model X

Bjørn has owned his Tesla Model X for quite some time now, but the battery is fairly new, because it was replaced after 116,000 km (72,000 miles) under warranty.

The new battery pack seems to have lost over 3% of its capacity after 35,000 km. The result was calculated as a ratio of the amount of energy consumed on full charge (from 100% SOC to near 0% SOC) when the battery was new (82 kWh) and now (79.3 kWh).

It’s not a big capacity fade, but a lot more than others have reported.

Read Also – Let’s Look At Tesla Model S & X Battery Degradation

The other important thing is that the calculations based on the full range estimated by the software are tricky because it shows just 1% drop (375 km or range versus 379 km when new).

Bjørn suspects that it has something to do with the algorithm that hides early capacity fade.

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42 Comments on "Bjørn Nyland’s Tesla Model X Battery Lost 3% Capacity At 21,750 Miles"

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William

Not bad for Mr. Nyland and his dedicated Tesla driving with a Trailer, and also bravely adventuring around in Super Cold winter conditions.

If you really want to demonstrate early “capacity fade”, try LeafSpy Pro in a Nissan Leaf. I am currently at 94. % + SOH after 25k miles, and 20 months of in service use, on a 10/15 build date 30 kWh SV. That includes 300+ Level 3 fast charges. So roughly the 30 kHw Leaf has at least Double the Degradation to the Tesla with an advanced TMS.

eject

Actually that isn’t all that bad. Your battery has done a lot more full cycles than Bjørns Tesla.

Roy_H

You must have close to zero slow charges. Are you not able to charge at home overnight? Fast charging it harder on a battery than slow, so I think this demonstrates the battery is doing very well.

William

Number of level 2/1 charges is 400+, and charging at home is only L1, which is too slow for my particular individual use case.

And, this is a Leaf Lease, and the first 24 months, are “No Charge to Charge”, AKA FREE ( cue a critically harsh response from Spark Ev ).

SparkEV

You have 300+ fast charges and 400+ L2/L1 charges, yet only have 21K miles? I’m sure that’s due to your leaf tapered to hell and charging only at 3 kW using 50 kW charger. How much time did you waste for other people?

But nowadays, Leaf is no longer ass-king of free charging. That title goes to Bolt. I had to wait almost an hour for Bolt (tapered to crap of course), and during that time about six Leafs/i3 came and went without charge. So one Bolt equals six Leafs/i3 in doucheness.

Free charging SUCKS!!!!!

Bill Howland

Now here I was told by the Big Experts that there is nothing wrong at all with the 30 kwh leaf battery.

eject

There is nothing wrong with it. Wait for the Tesla battery to accumulate 300 cycles and see how it does. Bjørns battery already has its charge speed limited.

Pushmi-Pullyu

Absurd. We have plenty of evidence that Tesla’s battery packs lose capacity much slower than the Leaf does. That’s a fact confirmed by an overwhelming amount of evidence, so I guess you’re just engaging in Tesla bashing.

Sadly for Nissan, early reports indicate the newer 30 kWh Leaf battery packs are degrading even faster than the older 24 kWh packs!

https://insideevs.com/nissan-leaf-30-kwh-battery-degrading-more-rapidly-than-24-kwh-pack/

eject

The “evidence” shows that they are doing rather equally when normalised by battery size. Of course you would expect 3x the lifetime range of a battery that is 3x the size.

Pushmi-Pullyu

You can reasonably claim that Tesla’s battery packs are retaining capacity at the expected rate when normalized by battery pack size.

The same certainly is not true of Leaf batteries. I don’t know why anyone would claim otherwise; the evidence is quite well established and beyond reasonable dispute. For instance, the BMW i3 has similar pack sizes, but nobody is talking about massive numbers of i3 packs losing capacity prematurely!

TuningIn

Lucky. I’m at 94% after 5,000 miles based off my LeafSpy.

Terawatt
And what exactly does LEAF Spy do to figure out SOH? I have both the LEAF and the app myself, but I am unable to find any convincing proof that the figures provided by LEAF Spy are necessarily reliable. My understanding is that SoH is not something the car reports on the CAN bus and LEAF Spy simply presents, but the remaining battery pack capacity expressed as a percentage of the *nominal* capacity. There are at least two complications then: Nominal capacity is not necessarily the same as “the capacity you had when the car was new”. Cells off the production line are not identical – their capacity varies. Combining the worst with the best to create packs of almost identical capacity is not a great idea, because a stack of cells in series is limited by the weakest cell – it will reach 0% SoC (its minimum safe voltage) when other cells still have some juice left, but you cannot use the juice that’s left because you risk physically destroying the weakest cell. Anyway, the point is, packs probably vary a fair bit in capacity initially as well. Hence you might start with more or less than 100%, the… Read more »
Bill Howland

While my Bolt ev has essentially no degradation in the first 26,000 miles (unless GM ALSO is hiding it, but I doubt it – but for the end user, namely ME, the full 60 kwh is still there), 3% loss doesn’t seem too bad since it is commonly known that batteries will quickly lose 5% of their capacity, then stabilize for a long time. Although it does look like in the Bolt Ev’s case that it will be a LONG TIME before the initial 5% ‘quick loss’ becomes evident – prior to a much longer time when the capacity stabilizes at the 95% point long term prior to further degradation.

Warren

Our 12/16 build Bolt has 12K+ on it now. It never had 60 kWh usable. Best I saw calculating from partial discharges was 58 kWh. I recently did a capacity run…100% to 2%…240 miles, 4.4 mi/kWh, 54.5 kWh with six miles remaining for a total capacity of 55.9 kWh per dash, and the website data. The car has only had six DC fast charges to 80%, and two of several minutes to test out chargers. We need a new acronym, YCMV, Your Capacity May Vary.

Bill Howland

Yeah mine has 59.9 kwh usable, but I’m a bit heavy on the accelerator. A lighter foot would have easily gleaned over 60 kwh, as many others have found; specifically because a slower discharge results in less I – Squared – R heating. I also have no fast charging capability, nor any fast chargers in my area even if I should have wanted to use one. So my battery has only ever been trickle charged.

Pushmi-Pullyu

Not sure why this rates a news article. A 3.3% loss in 35,000 km is if anything a bit less than average for a Model S/X pack. The average loss would be almost precisely 4%, at least according to the graph linked below.

Let’s not forget that for li-ion batteries, capacity loss over distance is initially relatively high, but soon drops to a lower amount. So that 3.3% loss represents the initial faster fade, and doesn’t indicate another 3.3% loss over the next 35,000 km.

Keep up the good work, Bjørn!

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Dave

Bjorn sure has a lot of trouble with that X… stranded him on the side of the road 3 times last year, and then the suspension failed on him last week… Car has less the 100K miles, and its been on a flatbed half a dozen times. Gotta love that Tesla Dependability..

earl colby pottinger

Drive your car (if it is not a truck) where he does and see how it does.

Dave
My 2011 GMC 2500HD Denali pickup has over 150K very hard miles, towing up to 18000lb equipment trailers, driving through 2′ of snow, and it has never broken down, or left me stranded along the side the road. It has also never had a brake job or any engine/transmission service other then fluid/filter changes. Even after all those miles it still drives tight, has lots of power, and even the doors still close tight without any rattles. I am going to get a new one in 2020, when the HD pickups come with Supercruise. Our 2005 Lexus LX (always been a 3rd car for us) has 97K miles, and also never been on a tow truck, or broken down on the side of the road. Same story, although I do not tow with it, it has been so many times in deep snow and Ice, off roading, etc.. It has had 1 brake job, and just fluid/filter changes My wife has a 2015 Range Rover Evoque, it’s too new to judge, and just 40K miles so far. It did have a power folding mirror fail… Hardly considered a breakdown. Her car will go away when our I-Pace comes. Past we… Read more »
Pushmi-Pullyu

But since everything you post is full of untruths and half-truths, we have no reason to believe any part of that, do we?

Pushmi-Pullyu

We can certainly “depend” on Tesla Hater cultists like you to cite anecdotal reports and pretend that’s the average for Tesla’s cars. And if there really was a suspension failure in the car — if that’s not just another case of you stretching the truth past the breaking point — then that’s hardly surprising given that Bjørn chose to do off-road driving in rough country!

Anything you say, “Dave”, is worthy of being ignored.

Dougie

My 2013 P85 has 3.1% degradation after 145,000 miles. (shows 257 miles instead of the original 265 miles @ 100%)

springer

sol old battery tech in 2013 Tesla is better than battery tech in new Tesla!

Jesus in a Dump Truck

It’s cheaper to produce now though.
Just because it’s older, does’nt meant it’s worse.

Pushmi-Pullyu

“sol old battery tech in 2013 Tesla is better than battery tech in new Tesla!”

🙄 Both he and Bjørn are showing below average battery capacity loss. That doesn’t mean either is an indication of an average. It’s called a “bell curve”, dude.

Dave

That is really good battery life..

DeProfessor

I wonder what his regular charging and drain limits are?

John

Wow that’s a huge loss!

Dave

Thats after an entirely new battery pack, and he is still under 100K miles. 4 major breakdowns in the last year, last week it was the air suspension…

Jesus in a Dump Truck

ICE cars break down more.

Salem

Don’t know what type of Lemons you owned, but not even my old French Diesel friend is that unreliable

John

Tesla brought unreliability to a whole new level! All French cars are like Toyota compared to Model S/X.

Dave

I disagree… I have bought more then 100 new vehicles in my life, both for business and personal, and can could the breakdown on the fingers of one hand. Millions of miles just in my personal cars…

Pushmi-Pullyu

And you drove one of ’em across the bottom of an ocean and up to the moon, right?
🙄

BenG

Yeah, I wouldn’t own a Model X. Reliability has been rated by Consumer Reports survey results to be much worse than average for both 2016 and 2017 Xs. It was a bad mistake to pile so much unnecessary complexity in the car, such as the falcon wing doors.

Model S, on the other hand, has been rated average or better than average reliability since 2015, and has a projected reliability of better than average. So I will consider a used Model S at some point down the road … cost of repairs outside of warranty will probably scare me off that though.

Seriously hoping that Tesla makes the Model 3 a reliable car. That’s the one I really want, but I won’t buy unless it proves to be reliable.

Dave

Exactly right.. Model X is terribly unreliable, but most problems are with the gizmos, and not with the core vehicle.. Bjorn’s 4 times on a tow truck in less then a year is outlier data, and really the worst case Tesla data I have heard. I have had friends have multiple drive units replaced in their early Model S, but those usually just rattle/grind, but you can drive them to the service center for repairs.

For me a car gets one mulligan… Leave me stranded once, Shame on you! Leave me stranded twice, Shame on me! Immediately sell…

Pushmi-Pullyu

I understand you Tesla short-sellers have lost billions of dollars recently, but angrily and repeatedly bashing Tesla every time an InsideEVs article mentions Tesla isn’t going to help any. Just take your losses and get out before you lose any more!

Pushmi-Pullyu

“Reliability has been rated by Consumer Reports survey results to be much worse than average for both 2016 and 2017 Xs.”

Must be some “Tesla Model X” other than the one for which Consumer Reports‘ annual survey of customer satisfaction consistently rates the Model X in the Top 10, then.
🙄

https://insideevs.com/consumer-reports-tesla-model-s-x-10-satisfying-cars/

BenG

Or could it be that someone doesn’t understand the difference between two different surveys of car owners? One intended to measure satisfaction with their purchase while the other intended to measure reliability of the car?

Model X isn’t the only vehicle on the ‘most satisfying’ list that struggles with reliability issues: i.e. Chevy Corvette and Dodge Challenger also ‘much worse than average’ reliability according to survey results.

Pushmi-Pullyu

What I understand is that there is a shocking amount of very biased, unfair and unbalanced Tesla bashing FUD posted to this thread: 12 outright Tesla bashing posts out of 35 total comments!

I also understand that luxury or “premium” cars, regardless of whether the brand is Mercedes or Audi or Tesla, tend to have more things go wrong on them than lower priced cars, merely because luxury cars have a lot more parts and gadgets which can malfunction. So I understand that comparing Tesla cars to, say, Toyota cars is a dishonest, biased comparison… a fact that always escapes the notice of Consumer Reports.

Posting Tesla bashing FUD is motivated by something dishonest, an agenda rather contrary to the purpose of this website, which is to advocate for plug-in EVs and to educate the public on them.

Pushmi-Pullyu

“4 major breakdowns in the last year…”

Hey, if you repeat a lie often enough, it becomes true, right Dave? 🙄

What a troll.

Phaedrus

My now 4.5 years old i3 did not have any repairs, only recently the locking mechanism for the charging cable failed and had to be replaced. I have 2% capacity loss over 58.000km / 36.000 miles. I am happy.