2017 Toyota Mirai Price Unchanged, But Now Leases From $349/Month, New Color Added

1 year ago by Mark Kane 76

Toyota Mirai sales in the U.S. – August 2016

Toyota Mirai sales in the U.S. – August 2016

Toyota Mirai

Toyota Mirai – new color…of blue

The starting MSRP of Toyota Mirai for 2017 model year remains uncanged at $57,500 plus an $865 destination fee ($58,365).

But with that said, there are generous incentives to bring the price down to entice buyers to get behind the wheel of Toyota’s fuel cell vehicle:  a $8,000 federal tax credit, a $5,000 California state rebate and something called “Trailblazer purchase support” from Toyota worth $7,500.

Taking all those factors into account, leasing starts from just $349 per month for 36 months with $2,499 due at signing.

So far in the US, Toyota has delivered over 700 Mirai in the U.S., but of those, more than half the sales were registered in August as the Japanese company ended the staggered roll-out of the Mirai due to earlier infrastructure concerns in the state, 371 were sold in August.

While there almost no changed for the 2017 Mirai, it will abe offered in one more additional color – Atmospheric Blue (on top of previous Celestial Black, Elemental Silver and Nautical Blue Mirai).

Toyota Mirai out for a spin

Toyota Mirai out for a spin

Toyota’s Press Blast on the 2017 Mirai below:

“Toyota Mirai drivers – COME ON DOWN!! While drivers may not see the trailblazing Toyota Mirai fuel cell vehicle in a game show showcase anytime soon, they can see every day value in new model year pricing. Toyota Mirai 2017 model year offers competitive, flexible pricing options and the opportunity to be a part of automotive history.

Toyota Mirai filling up

Toyota Mirai filling up

The Mirai hydrogen fuel cell electric vehicle combines hydrogen and oxygen to make electricity onboard, while emitting nothing but water vapor. It is a zero emission vehicle with an EPA estimated driving range of 312 miles, and refuels in around five minutes.

MY17 MSRP remains $57,500 plus an $865 destination fee. Mirai customers also may qualify for an $8,000 federal tax credit and $5,000 potential California rebate along with access to the coveted California HOV carpool lane.

To recognize our Mirai drivers leading the way, qualified customers will be eligible for the Mirai trailblazer support program. The trailblazer program enhances the purchase and ownership experience with the following choices:

  • Trailblazer Lease: $349 per month for 36 months, $2,499 due at signing* with 12,000/year  mileage allowance
  • Trailblazer APR Support: 0% for 60 months or 1.9% for 72 months and
  • Trailblazer Purchase Support of $7,500

*Excludes official fees, taxes and dealer charges. See participating Authorized Mirai Toyota Dealer for details.

Toyota's Mirai Booth At The NY Auto Show

Toyota’s Mirai Booth At The NY Auto Show

The new model year brings with it a new color option – Atmospheric Blue – to complement the existing Celestial Black, Elemental Silver and Nautical Blue Mirai color choices.

The Mirai comprehensive, ownership experience remains unchanged for MY17, boasting a range of world class services, including:

  • Three years’ worth of complimentary fuel [1]
  • Three years complimentary Safety Connect and Entune, including hydrogen station finder app.
  • Three years of 24/7 customer call support.
  • Mirai Complimentary Rental Experience for seven days per year for three years.[2]
  • ToyotaCare[3], our standard no cost service plan and roadside assistance, is enhanced for Mirai and includes:
    • No cost scheduled maintenance for three years, or 35,000 miles, whichever comes first[4]
    • No cost enhanced roadside assistance[5] for three years, regardless of mileage, including expedited towing service and trip interruption reimbursement at a maximum of $500 per day for up to 5 days per incident.[6]
  • 8-year/100,000-mile warranty on key fuel cell vehicle components including the FC stack and power control unit; FC hydrogen tanks; hybrid battery pack and ECU; FC air compressor, boost converter and ECU; hybrid control module (power management control module); and hydrogen fueling ECU.[4]
Toyota Mirai On Display At Dedicated Showroom

Toyota Mirai On Display At Dedicated Showroom

California customers can request a Mirai by visiting www.toyota.com/mirai. Production of the Mirai is limited and vehicles will be placed with select, eligible customers. After placing a request, potential Mirai drivers are contacted directly by a Toyota representative to discuss ownership and next steps.

Mirai customers take delivery from one of the eight authorized California dealers of their choosing. In Southern California, Longo Toyota, Toyota of Orange, Toyota of Santa Monica or Tustin Toyota will take care of Mirai trailblazers. Customers in Northern California will visit Roseville Toyota, San Francisco Toyota, Stevens Creek Toyota or Toyota Sunnyvale.

[1] Complimentary fuel for 3 years or $15,000 maximum, whichever comes first. Fuel program starts after receipt and activation of fuel card; fuel card is nontransferable. Fueling must be done at approved stations that meet SAE fueling interface protocols.
[2] The seven complimentary days per year will expire after each year and any unused days will not carry over.
[3] ToyotaCare covers normal factory scheduled maintenance for two years or 25,000 miles, whichever comes first. 24-hour roadside assistance is also included for two years, regardless of mileage. Valid only at authorized Mirai Fuel Cell dealers in the continental United States. See dealer for details and exclusions.
[4] Covers normal factory scheduled maintenance and is valid only at authorized Mirai Fuel Cell dealers in the continental United States. See dealer for details and exclusions.
[5] Does not include parts and fluids.
[6] Trip reimbursement covers interruptions that require the Toyota dealership to keep such vehicle overnight and such Covered Vehicle is at the time of such disablement more than fifty (50) miles from the residence of the owner of the Covered Vehicle. See an Authorized Mirai Fuel Cell dealer for details and exclusions”

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76 responses to "2017 Toyota Mirai Price Unchanged, But Now Leases From $349/Month, New Color Added"

  1. sven says:

    The $7,500 Trailblazer Purchase Support is a cash discount that reduces the purchase price when buying the Muria outright, and when applied inside a lease lowers both the monthly lease cost and the money due at signing. Previously, the lease cost was $499 per month for 36 months with $3649 due at lease signing, and is now $349 per month for 36 months with $2,499 due at signing.

    That would bring the effective purchase price of the Mirai down to $37,865 after discounts, rebates, and tax credits.

    $57,500 Mirai MSRP
    -$7,500 Trailblazer discount
    -$8,000 Federal tax credit
    -$5,000 California rebate
    + $865 Destination Fee
    ——-
    $37,865 Total cost after discounts, rebates, and tax credits
    =======

    From Wards Auto:
    “While Toyota is not adjusting the $58,365 purchase price of the car ($57,500 plus an $865 destination and handling charge), it still is offering a $7,500 “Trailblazer” discount and low APR financing of 0% for 60 months or, new for ’17, 1.9% for 72 months.”

    http://wardsauto.com/engines/toyota-cuts-mirai-lease-price-help-build-awareness

    1. sven says:

      Previously, for California government fleets the “California state contract cost” for the Mirai was $41,000. But for select pollution-burdened areas, government fleets were entitled to a $15,000 Public Fleet Pilot Project rebate per vehicle from the California Air Resources Board (CARB), bringing the effective cost of the Mirai down to $26,000 for those select government fleet buyers. Those government fleet buyers also get the benefit of 3 years free fueling up to $15,000, which makes the Mirai very attractive to lease for 3 years.

      There is no word yet on whether the $7,500 Trailblazer Purchase Support will lower the $41,000 California state contract cost.

      http://www.government-fleet.com/article/story/2016/05/calif-fleets-add-toyota-mirai-fuel-cell-vehicles.aspx

      1. RexxSee says:

        When I see sven, zzzzzzzzzz and four electric praising each and every fool cell car article, I get another proof (if I needed one) that they work for fossil hydrocarbon companies. Big Oil distribution of hydrogen + Big mother earth frackers for producing it.

        1. SparkEV says:

          What sven wrote about is true. I don’t see how that’s working for fossil fuel companies when those facts are well known.

          But if he and others are working for fossil fuel companies, I hope they make billions and billions of dollars off of those fossil fuel companies. Hey sven, can I hit you up for some cash to buy Tesla 3 with ludicrous, auto pilot, and tow package? 🙂

        2. SJC says:

          The term “fool cell” says more about the person who posted it than anything else.

          1. mhpr262 says:

            I think it was Elon Musk who used the term first,or at least made it widely known.

            So what does that say about Musk? He must be clueless about technology, too stuck in his old ways, non sense of progress or business? Yeah, that’s the Musk we all know.

            1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

              He is a guy who is in business to sell shares. Electric cars or whatever fashionable vaporware is just a help to get share buyers excited and loose critical thinking skills.

              So he doesn’t mind to use Kindergarten level name calling to denigrate competing technology, and all the fanboy minions rejoice together. Trash everything that doesn’t have Tesla badge on it! Hip hip hooray!

            2. mx9001 says:

              No. He realizes that this car is a joke, and will just increase methane emissions.

              The Volt, runs of 50 miles of electric, and then has a carbon backup infrastructure everywhere. Hydrogen is obsolete.

              Hydrogen Summary of Failure

              Hydrogen stations make excellent explosive terrorist targets.
              Hydrogen stations are very expensive, cost per station: $1.5 Million, who is going to be forced to pay for this?
              Hydrogen stations not pumping at the 10,000 psi required, you’re only getting Half Charges!

              Difficult to make hydrogen and store it.  
              Hydrogen isn’t a source of energy, you can’t mine it, you can convert something else to hydrogen, like methane, but then you lose energy in the process.  
              Hydrogen from water( in a global drought? ), is extremely inefficient.  
              Hydrogen from methane gives you No Help with global warming, it actually makes things worse.  As methane wells typically leak like sieves
              Hydrogen must be supercooled and compressed to 10,000 psi to store sufficient energy, which requires lots of energy.
              Burning it as a fuel is less than 50% efficient.
              The energy to do all this could be used to directly run an EV from a battery, and get you Twice as far.
              Hydrogen likes to leak.
              Hydrogen has a general problem of metal embrittlement, so you need special tanks.
              – Hydrogen tanks only certified for 15 years???

              Hydrogen leaks as an invisible gas.
              Hydrogen is extremely flammable with an invisible flame.
              Right now hydrogen is a loser vs. current batteries, not to speak of the battery chemistry in the coming solid state batteries.
              Chevy Volt gets better MPG, at a Lower Price, and allows you to use cheap solar energy for your fuel, and hydrogen does not. We will not run out of gas during the EV conversion process.
              Platinum in the fuel cell = expensive.

              Hydrogen time refueling vs. solar.
              Solar: You plug in at your home, Time 60 seconds.
              Hydrogen: You drive 20 minutes, or to California, to the station 10 minute refuel, 20 minutes back home: 50 minutes lost.

              Hydrogen Cars were built on the premise that we’d need a “Bridge Fuel” to EV’s, however battery tech has advanced so rapidly that there is no need for a bridge, especially one as wasteful and expensive as this.

              http://gas2.org/2015/03/10/vancouver-ends-hydrogen-bus-program-amid-high-costs/

              EV’s running on Solar helps pay off your Solar investment 20%-40% faster = More PROFITS to YOU.

              A single H2 fueling station can service 36 cars per day. (The highest volume ones service between 24-36 FCEVs.) Compare to ordinary gas stations, which service an average of ~1100 cars per day (some say 2500/day).

          2. Martin Winlow says:

            Don’t be silly – the expression has been around for years – probably as long as big companies with more money than sense have been researching the idea. A quick Google reveals the following article from 2003… http://www.spiegel.de/spiegel/print/d-26950138.html

            But I can remember the term coming up when I was studying engineering in the 1980’s. Unfortunately, little has changed since then to make me consider changing my opinion of the viability of fuel cells, certainly as far as it applies to powering mass-market vehicles. Mars-based ones may be an entirely different matter.

      2. Djoni says:

        So basically, all I see is that you ask us to be happy that more than half of the cost is paid by US taxpayers.
        Hello my communist comrade!
        +$7,500 Trailblazer discount
        +$8,000 Federal tax credit
        +$5,000 California rebate
        +$15 000$15,000 (Public Fleet Pilot Project)
        ——-
        Total of $35 500 US out of $58 365 is 60% of the car price.
        I wonder why your government is so supportive, it’s more than China communist economy.
        I guess anything that get so much support is a winner.

  2. jelloslug says:

    If you can’t sell them, give them away.

    1. Yogurt says:

      This is prety much Toyotas way of saying we dont care about green transportation but we do need more CA carbon credits…

    2. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      jelloslug said:

      “If you can’t sell them, give them away.”

      Indeed, Big Oil should buy them and give them to anyone foolish enough to actually want one. After all, the only reason the Mirai and other “fool cell” cars have gone into production is because of the large number of carbon credits each earns for the auto maker. And the reason such ridiculously high levels of credits are available is because of intense lobbying by Big Oil.

      Since the entire “hydrogen highway” agenda is a confidence game promoted by Big Oil, with the intent of diverting resources and attention away from development of practical plug-in EVs, then why don’t they provide more support for the program by buying up all the “fool cell” cars and giving them away? Heaven knows with their obscene levels of profit, they could easily afford it!

      Why don’t they? I suppose it’s because then, their anti-EV agenda would become too obvious.

      1. Four Electrics says:

        Hydrogen cars are in production because people want five minute refueling and, ultimately, 400+ miles of range, without carrying a thousand pound battery.

        They don’t want to have to install their own fuel source in their garage, apartment, or workplace. They don’t want to think about their charge level, when to charge, where to charge, or whether they can turn on the heater without ruining their road trip. They don’t want to spend two hours a day supercharging on their trip to Yellowstone. They just want to refuel on the way home, at their convenience, when they have a free moment. If they forget, they still want a 50 mile buffer so they can pay only a five minute delay penalty, not a six hour penalty.

        They want an emission free car fueled from renewably sourced hydrogen from solar and wind. They want it to be cheaper than today’s EVs.

        At the same time, utilities want a cheap, grid-based storage solution for renewables that is also transportable, and thus distributable. They don’t want to take megawatt spikes in load every time someone (or ten thousand someones) wants to supercharge their car on Sunday night.

        It won’t happen overnight, but it will happen, especially once renewables become so inexpensive and pervasive that storage is the dominant cost.

        While I appreciate the time you took to empty your bladder all over this vision, and to associate it with conspiracy theories and lies in a classic Donald Trump style, I don’t believe your efforts will stop Japan and Korea, which have no native oil or gas, from continuing to work towards a renewable hydrogen future, nor will it stop California, the vanguard of the environmental movement for over forty years, from making their state a cleaner place.

        1. Eduardo Pelegri-LLopart says:

          I live mid-peninsula in the SF Bay Area, and my neighborhood is full of EVs, from Honda EVs to Model Xs. I have only seen 1 Mirai (possibly doing the Ginness record run), and I can’t imagine why anybody would want to own one.

        2. jelloslug says:

          I believe you believe that.

        3. Stimpy says:

          How anyone would find going to a station vs charging in their private garage *appealing* is frankly unbelievable to me.

          Garage charging FTW!

        4. SJC says:

          Four Electrics, well articulated.

          1. floydboy says:

            Utter garbage! Did you really read that?!
            I don’t want to have my fuel source at my house?! You know, ELECTRICITY! Yeah that might be a little too convenient. Lets go to the filling station instead, YAY! I would love to drive that 400 mile Tesla 120D, but the battery weighs 1000 pounds! I’d better get a Mirai instead! Well… allrighty then! Plus I don’t want to constantly worry about my charge level. That would require me to glance at that little battery icon. I’d rather have a fuel cell vehicle, so I can glance at the fill level instead? I wouldn’t have to worry about when or where to fill up because…..oh wait.

            As for the rest of it, completely based on rosy conjecture for the fuel cell vehicle and poor management of the battery vehicle, with no basis to back it up!

        5. Terawatt says:

          > They don’t want to have to install their own fuel source in their garage, apartment, or workplace.

          Perhaps this is news to you, but electricity was installed in people’s garages, apartments and workplaces a long time ago. It can also be used for many things besides charging a car, so should be in all these places anyway.

          > They don’t want to think about their charge level, when to charge, where to charge

          Then they shouldn’t get a hydrogen car, which is obviously the one requiring the greatest care in these matters due to the nearly non-existent infrastructure – world wide!

          > They want an emission free car fueled from renewably sourced hydrogen from solar and wind. They want it to be cheaper than today’s EVs.

          If they really care about emissions – and they should – they shouldn’t want a car that requires three times as much green electricity as an existing and simpler alternative, the BEV.

          Since it takes three times as much electricity the energy cost alone of making it ensures the fuel price is at least three times that of A BEV.

          > At the same time, utilities want a cheap, grid-based storage solution for renewables that is also transportable, and thus distributable.

          It seems the only way to make sense of this argument is to assume that distributing hydrogen is easier than distributing electricity. Of course the reverse is true. Hydrogen as you may know is the smallest atom and H2 the smallest molecule in the universe. Under high pressure, required for volumetric energy density, it is notoriously difficult to store and to transport. And it’s also extremely flammable, making a hydrogen distribution network even more demanding to build – as well as an extremely attractive terrorist target.

          > They don’t want to take megawatt spikes in load every time someone (or ten thousand someones) wants to supercharge their car on Sunday night.

          That is actually an advantage. But no greater than what can be done with battery based grid storage. As battery prices keep falling and used BEVs go out of circulation the current huge cost disadvantage of hydrogen may well increase even further.

          > It won’t happen overnight, but it will happen, especially once renewables become so inexpensive and pervasive that storage is the dominant cost.

          Do you want to bet? Because I do.

          > a classic Donald Trump style

          Trump has no style, has never had no style, and will never have no style.

          > I don’t believe your efforts will stop Japan and Korea, which have no native oil or gas, from continuing to work towards a renewable hydrogen future, nor will it stop California, the vanguard of the environmental movement for over forty years, from making their state a cleaner place.

          Correct. It’s the laws of physics and economics that will stop it. Just because you don’t have oil it doesn’t follow that you can afford a transport sector that perpetually uses 300% more energy than necessary. Maybe if you have cold fusion and energy is virtually free and virtually limitless. Even then there’s the awful complexity of the infrastructure. Unless you propose to discontinue or use of electricity, hydrogen obviously requires infrastructure of its own that is in addition to the electric grid. Existing pipelines for natural gas give you a hint that this isn’t cheap, even after many decades of product development, and natural gas is relatively easy to move compared to hydrogen.

          I do hope California greens up. But it would be good if the people making the rules had enough of a clue as to not be so easily duped by lobbying car makers.

          Maybe I’m wrong. I am not an expert. But nothing you said here, and nothing I’ve seen anywhere, adequately addresses the problems I’ve pointed out:

          1) HFCV using green hydrogen is only a third as energy efficient as using BEVs.

          2) We will want to continue to use electricity anyway, so adding a completely separate energy supply infrastructure only for transportation is extremely wasteful. It’s a bit like building one physical internet but only for audio and a separate, more complicated and expensive one, for video.

        6. JimGord says:

          It is not emissions free. Most EV charging us done off peak overnight. If one is not willing to make some adjustments to save the biosphere then we are all screwed. That puts you in the fools column.

        7. Anti-Lord Kelvin says:

          Well, on the front of efficiency, there is no photo between both:

          And this is a scenario for at least twenty years from now (when all hydrogen would be produced by renewable sources), because right now, more than 90% is produced from fossil fuel at a high energy cost (lots of electricity needed) and at 10 tons of CO2 produced for each ton of hydrogen…
          And it require to be slave of oil industry when electricity is everywhere and you can produce it in house. Maybe to be slave it’s not a problem to you, but it is one for many people.

          1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

            Efficiency is strawman argument. You may imagine all the marginal efficiency advancements you want, but you can’t avoid electric grid when charging battery, slowly or very slowly, it doesn’t matter. Electric grid requires maintenance and capital costs, and these costs skyrocket when it needs to handle megawatt power spikes out of nowhere.
            Average PPA for wind electricity is some 2 cnt/kWh in the US. And you can use it for electrolysis directly, no need for 100% availability. $0.02 * 50 kWh/kg = $1/kg of H2 with typical today’s electrolizer. For charging something, you will use retail electricity that costs by order of magnitude more to deliver to your home and keep it 100% available even in the middle of the winter night. Or invent some “battery charges battery” paradigm as some “genius” may say regardless of costs and feasibility, don’t forget to send him a billion or two for the bright future.

            1. Anti-Lord Kelvin says:

              Do you imagine what will cost to built and maintain the infrastructure to distribute all this hydrogen everywhere, not to speak about the danger of leaks. The electric grid already exist and it have to be adapted to the distributed energy source world we are going for, so don’t worry, and as time passed more and more people will be able to charge their car with their own electricity at home, but more and more at work, and then almost everywhere from solar roofs and small commercial or community providers.

        8. Martin Winlow says:

          Oh for God’s sake!!! ‘Emission free’?! If the argument about electric vehicles not being ’emission free’ because the ’emissions’ are just transferred to a power station holds any water, it is true of FCVs a hundred-fold!

          And so you are basically saying ‘people’ want ‘convenience’ over responsibility. If so, they are at best very short-sighted, at worst, complete morons.

          1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

            So now Musk culties must resort to “Big Oil” arguments to denigrate electric cars without Tesla badge? Are you guys out of arguments? You must be, this car is $350/mo including fuel and maintenance, while Musk is only able produce $1000+/mo cars.

            And by the way, it filters out surrounding air from PM when it passes it through fuel cell. So yes, technically it is cleaner and helps clean air you breath from all the PM emissions generated by ludicrous tire wearing by overweight cars.

            1. Anti-Lord Kelvin says:

              Exactly!…And these filters are very sensitive (would work miserably in Chinese cities) to particles in the air. They will have to be replaced very often in polluted ambient or dust in the air (very good for South-West States!) and they will not be cheap. Then, when they will be, even slightly, with particles the efficiency of the fuel cell will drop rapidly. Not to speak that to do the electrolyse , you are taken liquid water to gas (hydrogen and O2), but then, after passing by the fuel cell, the water produced is vapour..which is a very bad greenhouse gas!

        9. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

          “Four Electrics” said:

          “Hydrogen cars are in production because people want five minute refueling and, ultimately, 400+ miles of range, without carrying a thousand pound battery.”

          I really don’t see the utility of shilling for “fool cell” vehicles by saying such obviously untrue things. It takes 10 minutes to fully fill the Mirai’s tank, and the EPA rates its range at 312 miles.

          If people want a car with a five-minute refill and 400+ miles of range, then they should look at the 2017 Volt.

          1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

            Now who is Big Oil shill?
            Stop trolling and pumping TSLA, Pu-Pu! It is time to dump your TSLA to greater fool around, because when any of big four investors will decide to dump, you will be the last in line and left with nothing.

        10. Djoni says:

          This is what you wish people want.
          Pretty far from what they want day in day out.
          Now I corrected for you free.
          Your reference to Yellowstone is hilarious because everyone know that when you get there you only have 5 minutes before getting back home as fast as possible.
          Stop eating jellybeans, your sugar level is confusing your brain.

    3. One says:

      When they were expensive they were expensive, now they are cheap, you criticize them because they’re cheap. what a joke. Oh yes, I must work for the fracking industry, obviously.

  3. Mirai’s often touted $15,000 fuel incentive over 3 years is actually worth about $1,300 when compared to the electric fuel cost of a comparable size vehicle using $0.12 kWh. Compare to $2,160 at $0.20 in much of California.

    Lease premium for the Mirai is about $100/mo $3,600 over the same 3 year period. So about $1,500-$2,300 more expensive than a Chevy Volt that can drive most miles on electric and charges at home overnight.

    Tough sledding for the Mirai.

    1. William says:

      Sledding is uphill and strewn with boulders. The upside, if there is any long term, is the eventual REX HFC range extender on the next BMW 33 KWh I 3. The eventual swap out of the 650 cc ICE motorcycle engine for the next generation small HFC, will change the automotive 60kWh or larger battery pack weight and cost barrier. The battery life of smaller battery packs will double with a supplemental HFC taking care of all the larger power demands. Not to mention making brand based (proprietary standard) highway fast charging an exclusive and expensive alternative. Hydrogen Highway is coming, as soon as the oil majors get over their internal battles over who is going to get stuck with the bill.

      1. Yogurt says:

        The oil majors would only be stuck with the bill if you are filling up with dirt cracked coal/oil/gas…
        Excuse me I mean clean green fuel…

  4. Seuthès says:

    Now that a kWh can be negociated at ~175$, Hydrogene can’t compete with electric vehicule.
    The Bolt is under 30.000$ after incentives.
    It’s to late. The futur is electric.

  5. Victor says:

    Did Toyota mentioned that the hydrogen fuel cell stacks on the Toyota Mirai are pressurized to 10,000 PSI? I think they are guaranteed never to leak, but if it does leak, make sure you have some chewing gum handy to plug that leak. 🙂

    1. pjwood1 says:

      VW has had some CNG car explosions, that I’m sure we’ve all heard about. That’s only a couple thousand pounds.
      http://www.forbes.com/sites/bertelschmitt/2016/09/16/europe-volkswagen-cars-explode-in-gas-stations/#69af044c6c6b

      The Wall Street Journal stuck with “burst into flames”, when the unfortunate Norway driver’s car slowly smoked, after a 96mph tree strike, before a small fire started and was extinguished after the accident. The CNG VWs simply blew up. No accident. No Wall Street Journal coverage.

      1. pjwood1 says:

        ..meant to say “the Tesla driver from Norway”.

        1. Terawatt says:

          The high speed tree hugging incident was not in Norway. If memory serves, it was in Belgium.

          Regarding your point, I think the reasons are trivial. VWs CNG cars aren’t stirring up a lot of interest and engagement. But any mention of Tesla in any headline draws a ton of traffic because millions of bored at work for are googling for Tesla news every day.

          Now that we’ve transformed journalism into the business of bringing an audience to the advertisers (by refusing to pay and accepting to be the product) this is exactly what we should expect. Cheap to make articles that generate page views.

          It’s almost as depressing as the prospect of Hillary in charge. Though not as scary as the prospect of president Donald.

          1. Anti-Lord Kelvin says:

            You in US, have a tricky choice to do this November, wouldn’t like to be in your place.
            But next year, in France, it wouldn’t be better, with the second turn having a big chance to be between Sarkhozy and Marine LePen.
            Here in Portugal, we have an expression to illustrate that is in something like this: “In one place is raining, in the other is the thunder”.

    2. Yogurt says:

      I want to know how many cars could it take out in a CA trafic jam if it was hit with a stray bullet…

      1. William says:

        Most road rage in traffic doesn’t see much straying in CA.

    3. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      Victor said:

      “Did Toyota mentioned that the hydrogen fuel cell stacks on the Toyota Mirai are pressurized to 10,000 PSI? I think they are guaranteed never to leak…”

      Perhaps they can be guaranteed not to leak faster than X amount per hour, but it would be silly to try to claim they won’t leak, period. One of the problems with using compressed hydrogen is that it’s physically impossible to completely stop it from leaking. The H2 molecules are small that they will even leak, slowly, through the solid metal (or carbon fiber) walls of a tank! Similarly, even specially made seals can’t stop leaks completely when storing pressurized H2.

      1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

        More FUD from Big Oil and Big Fracking shill Pu-Pu

      2. MikeM says:

        Re H2 leak rates:
        I’ve read but two discussion points on H2 leakage.

        1) It leaks like crazy, being the smallest molecule . . yada yada. . .
        2) The problem has been solved with improved materials and technology.

        In truth there WILL BE an in-car leakage rate (XX milligrams or grams per hour) for the tank system as well as the fuel cell itself. Not to mention the infrastructure storage and delivery systems.

        Has anyone seen ANY numbers for ANY of this ANYWHERE ?
        I suspect it’s quite crucial.
        Enquiring minds need to know. Really!

  6. ModernMarvelFan says:

    I would still take the Volt over the Mirai.

    Volt is quicker, faster and have less range anxiety.

    Even the Bolt is quicker and has less range anxiety due to better infrastructure.

    1. SparkEV says:

      Don’t forget cheaper. ev-vin’s still going strong, and his site shows $89/mo or $149/mo with $2500 drive off.

      Reminder to those who are looking to lease EV, check out ev-vin’s blog for pointers to great lease deals.

      http://ev-vin.blogspot.com/

      1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

        Of course gas cars are cheaper. It is established technology, and you can’t expect that something new would beat the price from the beginning. Price will go down with time.
        Still, $350/mo (or $420 including downpayment) including fuel is cheap when you have 300+ miles range without any ICE helper and few minutes refuel time. Don’t forget to add electricity and fuel cost for Volt. At 1,000 miles per month it would be 1000/106*33=311 kWh. At 3 tier rate 32cnt/kWh in PG&E it would be extra $100/mo and Volt would come at comparable price, while Mirai has somewhat more comfort features inside.
        The rest in that lease list are short range battery car that are fine for some people for going in city, but most of the market expects to be able to travel longer distances without spending too much time on chargers.

        1. Dork 101 says:

          32 cents/kwh? Why would you pick such a high rate to compare?

          I pay 11 cents/kwh.

          Mirai is a joke right now, only reasonable for ultra early adopters. $350/month lease is not so bad, but thats after gobs of subsidies on a price that is losing money for Toyota.

          The supposed refueling advantage is a mirage outside of certain limited areas of Cali., and even there how many people actually have a fuel cell station that is convenient to them when they need it? Or do they have to drive 15-50 minutes out of the way to fill up?

          The fuel cell may have a future but it will be a LONG time (decades) before it becomes a practical alternative to the ICE as the power source in a hybrid. Meanwhile we have Tesla Model S outselling comparable Mercedes, BMWs and Audis.

          I’d take the new Prius Prime over a Mirai every day and twice on Sunday. You can actually travel country in one, with efficiency only a little lower than the Mirai’s, and when driven locally on electricity it is far cleaner than the Mirai.

        2. SparkEV says:

          Why would anyone who pays, a $0.32/kWh use electric car? Just use gas. At $3/gal, 45 MPG, 1000 miles would cost $67/mo. Secondly, many people who charge their car do so with excess solar, which is “free”. Some net metering plans get better than free.

          Mirai fueling isn’t free. You have to drive to filling station, which could be 50 miles away in my case (100 miles round trip). Unless you happen to live next to filling station, your time has to be worth practically nothing to fuel FCEV for “free” with cost going up as stations are further away.

  7. Yogurt says:

    Toyota does not support green transportation and this FCV is nothing more than a tatic to delay EVs while they sell more dirty poluting ICEs…

    “Cox said Toyota is “probably taking a hit of 50,000 to 100,000 euros per unit” on each 2016 Mirai it sells. That would be $62,000 to $124,000 each, after its U.S. purchase price of $57,500″

    When you are estimated to lose this type of money on each car you sell you probably have a hidden agenda…

    http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1095773_how-much-money-does-the-2016-toyota-mirai-lose-a-lot-perhaps

    1. Yogurt says:

      And that does not count the 15k worth of fuel they give you…

      1. Terawatt says:

        Equivalent to $1200 in fuel cost if you drive a BEV instead and managed to use all of it.

        In the next nine years you’ll presumably drive no less, and fork out $45k.

        Looks like A VERY attractive deal, if you’re the fuel supplier.

        1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

          How about trying to understand what the word “lease” means? You lease it for 3 years just like the free fuel is for 3 years, and return it. And get whatever you want next.

          1. Then what happens to the vehicle?

            Who will want to pay $14.50/kg – $2,900 per year, $34,800 over the remaining life of the car, to fuel it?

            You can speculate all you’d like about cheap hydrogen in the distant future, but common sense argues that a limited infrastructure and only a few suppliers will keep the fuel cost high.

    2. Anti-Lord Kelvin says:

      Last year I saw an article in a French scientific magazine about each Mirai cost being around 150.000 dollars, with Japan gov. paying 50.000, then Toyota paying the rest to attain the 57.000 dollars public price.

    3. Dork 101 says:

      Toyota’s Prius has saved more gas than any EV built yet. The new Prius Prime will be a serious contender for best-selling plug-in the next couple years, if Toyota builds enough. The Prime’s combination of excellent gasoline mileage with fair plug-in capability and Toyota’s legendary reliability will make it a great green choice for hundreds of thousands of people.

      I agree the Mirai is a currently a joke, but there is nothing wrong with Toyota pushing forward with fuel cell technology. People just need to realize it will be 20 years before it might become practical as a replacement for the ICE in a hybrid.

  8. Dave says:

    This article reads like an ad.

  9. Rick Danger says:

    In a few years, when the hype has ended, and all the hydrogen stations have closed for lack of funding, they will make great planters in the yard.

    1. Stimpy says:

      Nah, they are far too ugly for that!

      1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        Maybe not too terrible if you cut off that aggressively fugly front end and throw it away.

        1. Rick Danger says:

          Or bury them nose first ala Cadillac Ranch:

    2. Anti-Lord Kelvin says:

      In China, they had seen the rise, and then the fall of Hydrogen buses as sales of batteries buses are in “ludicrous mode”:

      2010 2011 2012 2013 2014 2015
      BEV 523 1136 1904 1672 12760 94260
      PHEV 1478 313 2637 16500 23051
      HEV 3804 2825 5825 6111 797

      1. Anti-Lord Kelvin says:

        This chart is not clear, the same better here:

      2. Anti-Lord Kelvin says:

        My very bad! I was wrong on these charts as HEV buses were not Hydrogen Electric Vehicles, but Hybrid (not Plug-in ones) Electric Vehicles.

  10. Terawatt says:

    Toyota is an enemy of the people. The day will come when books about the hydrogen scam are found on best seller lists.

    That public funds are used to support this constitutes a moral emergency.

    1. zzzzzzzzzz says:

      Brainwashed cultie

      1. MikeM says:

        At last – a little self reflection from zzzzzzzzzz!

  11. mhpr262 says:

    Apparently they can’t give those horrible turds away.

  12. floydboy says:

    Isn’t there still that “tiny” issue of having to take more energy to GET your fuel, than you GET FROM your fuel? I guess(as many fuel cell advocates espouse) we could use the GAJILLIONS of kilowatts of excess, cheap electricity lying around to create it?

    1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      I fear that the EROI (Energy Return On Investment) argument requires far too much intelligence to be understood by fool cell fanboys. I mean, they can’t even grasp something as basic as the Laws of Physics.

      But yes. My “napkin math” suggests that the process of refining, distributing, and dispensing gasoline is about ten times as energy-efficient as generating, compressing, transporting, re-compressing, and dispensing “renewable” hydrogen. That bears repeating: Hydrogen fuel is about ten times worse than gasoline in terms of energy efficiency!

      And that, gentle readers, is why compressed hydrogen fuel will never, ever, be able to compete with gasoline as a transportation fuel…. let alone compete with electricity stored in batteries!

      1. Victor says:

        +1 Pushmi-Pullyu

  13. Rick says:

    H2 is far too expensive. it costs $12.85 at least per kg according to that edmunds article. Crazy! No wonder Toyota doesn’t want owners to pay for it.

    1. mhpr262 says:

      Yep, the “H2 fuel cell car” fad would be over in the blink of an eye if the owners had to shoulder the full cost of the infrastructure needed for the fuel.

      1. Dork 101 says:

        Yep, the future of fuel cells in transportation is far more likely to look like the Nissan plug-in hybrid delivery van with fuel cell range extender that uses ethanol as a fuel.

        Hydrogen as a fuel has so many disadvantages it’s totally impractical for a large country like the US to build out a distribution and sales network. It’s marginally more practical in Japan if they set their minds to it, with such a smaller, denser country, but they’d be better off concentrating on BEVs and plug-in hybrids, with the hybrids eventually fueled by biofuel.