The Triple 5 Next-Generation Chevy Volt: 50 MPG, 5 Seats, 50 Miles Electric Range

4 years ago by Eric Loveday 86

Triple 5...That Should be the Next-Gen Volt Target

Triple 5…That Should be the Next-Gen Volt Target

In response to General Motors’ CEO Dan Akerson saying that the next-generation Chevrolet Volt needs a 20% boost in electric range, the Chevy Volt Owners Group on Facebook voiced several opinions on what that next-gen Volt actually needs in order to be competitive when it launches in 3 to 4 years.

2013 Chevrolet Volt EPA Sticker - A Few of Those Numbers Need to Shift Upwards for Triple 5 to Become Reality

2013 Chevrolet Volt EPA Sticker – A Few of Those Numbers Need to Shift Upwards for Triple 5 to Become Reality

One comment stuck with us, as it’s precisely what we think GM needs to do with the Volt.

I would rather see 20% more range and 20+% better mpg on the range extender (smaller, lighter range extender, maybe 1 liter and 3 cylinder).”

“I would like stats of “triple 5″. Seating for 5, 50 mile battery range, 50 mpg on the range extender.”

It’s the triple 5 that we entirely agree with.  First, the next-gen Volt must have 5 seats.  This should be the ultimate focus at GM.

Second, the next-gen Volt need 50 miles of electric-only range…Easily doable by the time it launches, we think.

Finally, 50 mpg from the range extender.  This might be difficult to achieve, but a figure in the mid-40s should be the target.

So, what do you think?  Is triple 5 possible?  Probable?  Unlikely?  Should GM shoot for even more out of the next-gen Volt?

Hat tip Andrew Diamond via Chevy Volt Owners Group on Facebook!!!

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86 responses to "The Triple 5 Next-Generation Chevy Volt: 50 MPG, 5 Seats, 50 Miles Electric Range"

  1. Taser54 says:

    I disagree about the 5 seats. If GM is going to have something with 5 seats, it needs to be larger (a voltec crossover or a larger sedan). This back seat is simply not realistic seating for 5. http://static.ed.edmunds-media.com/unversioned/img/long-term/misc/cruze_backseat-thumb-717×449.jpg

    1. Bloggin says:

      Also Akerson expect the next gen to drop up to $10k from the 2013 model. So we should see seating for 5, 50 EV miles, and 50mpg at $30k.

      We should see the new Volt by the MY2016 at the latest, launching in 2015.

      1. kdawg says:

        It should be priced $25,555.55 🙂 (and make the “2” a backwards “5”)

        1. Rick says:

          how about 5 tires?

    2. vdiv says:

      Agree with Taser54. The current configuration of the Volt is reasonable for the size of the car and the rear bucket seats are comfortable as they are. However if GM is going to package the battery flat underneath the car a rear bench seat that at least gives the appearance of seating for 3 is realistic and will go some way to silence the critics. It will also help differentiate the 2+2 ELR coupe from the Volt.

      The need for a larger Voltec crossover goes without saying even if the AER suffers a bit.

      1. B00nk says:

        I’ve never met or seen anyone squeezing 5 people in a car.. Usually someone else also has a car. I guess some people have 3 kids, but I’ll take the buckets thanks.

        1. Priusmaniac says:

          15 % of families have 3 kids and if you count the people that want to have a full back seat for friend or any other reason you get to 20 %.
          That is a big market share to ignore these days.

          1. Dan Webster says:

            From the moment the Volt was introduced, seeing the price and the four-seat configuration, I couldn’t figure out what their target market was. Too pricey for the masses that drive to work every day. And, I think four seats is a turn-off for many potential buyers.

        2. John says:

          I have 3 kids and wish the Volt had 3 seat setup in the back… the only reason iam buying the Ford Fusion Energi instead

          1. Don says:

            I would highly recommend a mini-van if you have three kids over any passenger car. Go to any dealership with your kids, you will see a mini-van is the ultimate tool for family even with one kid.

            We carry a load of stuff when we travel just for the one kid. Used to have a Subaru Outback. But even that was small with all the kids stuff. The Honda Odessy was our savior.

            1. Wallace says:

              I have a baby. You don’t need a minivan. Do not be fooled into this. I have Volt, a spare car, and a minivan. The minivan and the gas car just sitr there collecting dust. We always drive the Volt. Plenty of room in the back. Just properly adjust the front seats. Dealers keep the front seats all the way back for a 8′ person making the back look tight.

          2. Natalie says:

            John,

            I agree with you. We also have three kids and it is one of the biggest drawbacks of the Volt. I currently drive a Toyota Sienna, but would much rather drive a Volt (and slap on the Thule when making those road trips).

            Let’s see what the next generation Volt comes up with.

    3. ClarksonCote says:

      Two configurations would almost be nice. For those that don’t need to seat 5, 4 seats is more convenient and comfortable.

      Also I don’t entirely agree with 50MPG generator either, as the Volt eliminates the majority of its gas usage in the electric only miles it has, not in its extended mode MPG. Nevertheless, improvements are always welcome, if they don’t break the bank.

    4. Tom A. says:

      The problem with 5 seats is that it would most likely require a complete overhaul of the platform. The current body and battery pack configuration prevents a 5th seat.

      1. Dan says:

        They are already getting rid of the current platform. No matter what it is going to be a “complete” redesign. They have been working on a new global platform. That the next gen. Volt and other cars will be based on.

    5. Bob Foss says:

      Agree. If you need to carry 4 passengers, you need a van or SUV. The Leaf’s 4 makes it quite roomy. Yesterday at the auto show, I sat in the Volt…it is cramped, especially in the back. The 50 mile EV range and maybe 45-50 mpg on the extender engine would be welcome. Some sites say the Volt will eventually be obsolete when we have only battery-powered EVs, but unless there are numerous charging stations everywhere, even a 300 mile range EV will only get you so far. I’m anxiously awaiting the next Volt

  2. Schmeltz says:

    I think that “Triple 5” is right on. Catchy slogan too. We all have our wish lists but that triple 5 idea kind of sums them up nicely and puts a bow on it. Besides that, I think It’s completely doable.

    1. John says:

      I have 3 kids and ended up buying a used volt… But it is used only for going to work. Wish it was big enough in back to sit my 3 kids between 3-7 years old but whenever we have to go out as a family we have to use a Toyota sienna instead of the volt… If the volt was big enough for my five person family we would use the van just for camping and going on long-distance trips with trailer in tow… I just hope when they do come out with a five person volt they allow us to the trade the old Volt in for the other one for a decent deal

  3. kdawg says:

    As the AER increases the MPG in CS mode becomes less relevant. If they get to 50mpg that’s great for bragging rights, but really does nothing for me. Hopefully trying to hit that particular goal will not increase the price of the car.

    1. ItsNotAboutTheMoney says:

      If you think about how they’d get to 50mpg, most of it wouldn’t be the engine efficiency itself, so a 50mpg target it a worthy one.

      1. kdawg says:

        It’s a worthy goal, but not as important to me as more AER. And not as important as keeping the cost down. So if they can pull off 50mpg, great, but don’t sacrifice these other 2 goals to do it. Hopefully they will go hand-in-hand.

        1. vdiv says:

          Agree. Longer electric range and preserving the performance parity between the charge-depletion and the charge-sustaining modes seem more important. I’d even be happy with a real-world 45 mpg. Considering the current Volt can get 41 mpg at steady state highway driving 45 mpg seems reachable.

  4. Nelson says:

    I have to agree with Taser54. Leave the Volt seating as is. Release the Voltec Buick Electra with room for 5 adults.

    NPNS!
    Volt#671

    1. ClarksonCote says:

      I like the idea of having other Voltec 5 seat options while maintaining 4 seats in the Volt, given its comfort and convenience. Or, somehow have a 4 seat and 5 seat option.

    2. Open-Mind says:

      I think they should (and could have already) made a sporty looking Volt wagon that offered seating for 6 from a rear-facing third row. Seems like that would just be a styling change.

  5. Bill Howland says:

    Unfortunately, technology usually progresses at a slower rate than people want.

    But If they get a $5000, 50 mile, 50mpg , 5 seat volt, I’ll buy another. So thats $12,500 without the tax credit?

  6. David Murray says:

    I am happy with the rear seats the way they are. I think they are very comfortable and I hate bench seats. I mean geez.. Why don’t we put bench seats in the front of cars these days? then we can say it seats 6!

  7. Spin says:

    What is really needed is more choices. Electric range will increase, and price will decrease over time. While that is happening, put the Voltec technology in an SUV, a pickup, and even an Impala.

    1. Tom A. says:

      The industry is long-overdue for a hybrid pickup. If you have an electric motor to drive the rear axle, an electric motor to drive the front axle (4X4), place a 20kWh battery pack under the cabin Tesla-style, and a twin-turbo or supercharged V6 under the hood (a-la Ford’s Ecoboost), you’d have one serious, bad-assed truck that could tow mountains.

      No transmission. No clutch. The V6 would drive an electric generator.

      The generator would provide power to the motor(s) and to the battery (in limited situations).

      The battery would be charged primarily by a plug and by regen, and to a lesser extent, the V6 (like plug-in hybrids operate now).

      With everything electronically controlled, various modes of operation could be readily implemented (hauling, towing, mountain, sustain, eco, etc.). The modes would not only affect the propulsion blend (battery, V6, both) of the truck but also the level of regen (more braking force needed for going down a mountain or hauling a ton in the bed).

      Also, with the system being electronically controlled, towing stability could be readily included in the towing mode. Kind of like what Ford has now in the towing package for the Flex, only it would be easier to implement with separate electric motors for the front and rear axles.

      I’d prefer an electric truck, but the energy density (never mind cost) just isn’t there yet, unless you’re an urban cowboy that buys a quad-cab with chrome trim and the top-tier towing package just to commute to the office. 🙂

      1. Dave - Phoenix says:

        Before we can have a hybrid truck we have to have a “smaller” truck.

        Today, no automakers sell a small truck in the US (They sell plenty outside the US). That has to change….

        GM already tried selling large hybrid trucks, but they were so big they only got 21mpg and they only sold about a half a dozen of them…

        If you want a hybrid truck that gets significantly improved gas mileage, you will also have to make it smaller…

      2. GSP says:

        GM has sold hybrid pickups, with the same strong hybrid system as the Tahoe and Escalade. I haven’t checked recently, but they might still be available. They have Miller cycle (late intake valve closing) V8 engines and get about 25% better gas milage than the V8 with conventional automatic transmission.

        GSP

      3. Daniel Cardenas says:

        Tesla has murmured they are working on a pickup truck. It will be based on the Model X. Just a new shell for them on top of existing platform, so relatively easy to implement.
        You might find this concept pics interesting:
        https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/115862438445218251875/albums/5893992183720899825

  8. Chris O says:

    Interior space of current gen Volt is a bit of a joke thanks to the double drivetrain configuration eating away at it. It’s basically a 2+2+ room for one large suitcase, the sort of space one would expect in a coupe. Next gen should be a crossover so it can accommodate the cumbersome drivetrain ánd offer the sort of utility families need. Think Mitsubishi Outlander PHEV.

    1. kdawg says:

      I don’t think that would be a “next gen”. That would be a completely new vehicle. The Volt has the sort of space one would expect in a compact… because that’s what it is. That said, I have fit 3 people with luggage in mine.

      1. Chris O says:

        HMM, a compact with sub-compact interior space I’m afraid….Maybe we can agree that between the Volt, the ELR and the Spark GM isn’t exactly family oriented with its plug-in line up. That’s something I would like to see different.

        1. kdawg says:

          Yes, the ELR & Volt have the same space. The Spark EV is even smaller. Many are hoping for a Impala/Malibu/Buick Electra with Voltec in it. I think this would be a good move for GM. Wouldn’t do much for me as the Volt is perfectly sized for my driving. I would like to see something Volt sized but a pure BEV w/a 200 mile AER min. Basically GM’s version of a Tesla Blue Star. If it looked like the Chevy Tru 140S concept, that would be amazeballs.

          1. GSP says:

            I think that the ELR has less passenger and cargo space than the Volt. Less range as well. On top of all that, I think it has to run the engine (oh, the humanity…) to get full performance, like the Fisker Karma, Ford Energi’s, and PiP. Not having full performance in EV mode, as the Volt does, is a real drag in my opinion. This makes the ELR an “ordinary PHEV” instead of an EREV.

            GSP

    2. John says:

      Our new Volt we got earlier this year is working great for our family. With 2 kids in car seats, the decrease in seating space from the Volt from our previous 06 Accord makes no difference for our household. No one ever climbed in between the 2 car seats to sit in the middle spot anyway, before.

      The hatch is surprisingly versatile – wife did a Costco run the other day with no problem, and that’s with the stroller and the diaper bag left back there like they always are.

      Now, 5-10 years down the road things will change for us, and I can appreciate that the Volt may not work as well if you have tall teenagers.

      1. CodyOzz says:

        I don’t know, I have two BIG brothers and we drove across the island with them in the back and they didn’t complain at all. One is 5’8″ and 250#, and the other brother is 5’11” and 240#. I was amazed that they were comfortable back there. I think if I were 6′ tall, and the passenger behind me was 6′ tall, there might be a height issue with the rear window. But with me being 5’8″ and a 5’8″ person behind me, it’s absolutely no problem!

  9. Daniel Cardenas says:

    To be a mass market car they need to get the price down. Only a fully electric car will be competitive in 3 years. Would be great if they addressed the SUV market.

    1. danwat1234 says:

      You can buy a 2011 Volt for around $25,000 now. It’ll get even cheaper in a few years.

      1. Daniel Cardenas says:

        $25K is about $6K too high to be mass market, in my newb opinion.

  10. GeorgeS says:

    As a Volt owner I would say I don’t really give a shit about the RE. If it never comes on that’s fine with me. The Volt needs a little more AER and a little more perf in electric mode.

    My guess is that all those people that want 50 MPG don’t own a Volt. As kdawg said more AER means less range extender to the point where you have a 200 mile AER and NO Range extender.

    Everyone keeps yammering about a 5th seat. If GM would just put the batteries in the floor like all other serious EV manufacturers do then it would be easy. We see Tesla, Nissan and BMW ALL have the batteries in the floor.

    GM could also get rid of the expensive 4ET50 transmission. Just make it a serial machine with a 3 banger RE.

    You can’t have the “triple 5” AND a 29000$ price tag.

    1. Chris O says:

      Seems that the BMW REx concept (decent AER+limp home RE) is a better match for what Volt buyers are looking for than GM’s concept of less AER but a fully capable RE functionality. Maybe GM should thin in that direction too.

      1. kdawg says:

        I don’t want too much of a “limp”. The 25kW the BMW i3 puts out, might be just enough. I will hold judgement until real-world drivers report back.

      2. Priusmaniac says:

        Actually 25 KW is still way too much for a range extender. A 15 KW system is more than enough accounting that it would go on generating at all the stops and thus permit a charge buildup and higher power use by the car.
        The size of it however should be reduced to become almost insignificant in the overall car volume. Like have a spare tire or not.

    2. CodyOzz says:

      The only reason I care about the 50MPG “goal” is that we know that GM didn’t pick the best motor for the job. How bout an atkinson cycle variable head 1.4 liter 4cyl? I’m guessing a better motor would easily achieve 50mpg as it does in the Prius! Look at the damn Prius, that’s a 1.8 liter engine getting better than 50. Granted, it’s a lighter car and it’s funner to punch yourself in the face, then drive that car… but hey, we’re chevy people, we can do it!

    3. GSP says:

      As another Volt owner, I completely agree. I would pay for more EV miles, but range extender mpg is not important. It only uses 0.07 gallons once every six weeks on my 2011. However, I thought mpg was important before I bought my Volt, so 50+ mpg will be a big marketing boost for the Volt.

      I also love the rear bucket seats. Very comfortable, just like a Bentley with standard rear buckets. Bentley does have an option for a three person bench rear seat however.

      I disagree about the 4ET50 transaxle however. It offers lots of benefits like two motor EV mode, and parallel split power paths, for more performance, more EV range, and more mpg than a primitive series architecture.

      GSP

  11. Lou Grinzo says:

    Is triple 5 possible? Of course. Zero doubt.

    By the way — how much do want to pay for it?

    Sorry, but this is a real hot button of mine, people looking at just one part of the cost/benefit ratio. This is largely how we got into so much trouble with climate change — not taking into account all the costs of burning fossil fuels, beyond just the extraction, transportation, etc. expenses.

    Never forget the old line: You can have something fast, good, or cheap — pick any two.

  12. Brian says:

    I agree with other commenters that the 5th seat is way overrated. What the car needs to be more friendly for road trips is luggage space. When is the last time your family of 3-4 went on a road trip with just one suitcase? Probably never. The Volt cannot be the only car for your typical family of four because of cargo space, not the lack of a 5th (uncomfortable) seat…

    1. Tom A. says:

      Yeah, most of my family is in the vicinity of 6′ tall. Three of us across the back of my 2010 Mariner hybrid (basically a Ford Escape) is really tight…at least one person can’t even buckle up. 5th seats are overrated in modern cars because they are narrower.

      I used to drive a ’96 Dodge Intrepid – now that was comfortable for 3 adults across the back, no problem. Compacts that are listed as seating 5 adults really don’t seat 5 adults at all…4, maybe, or 5 if the 3 in the back are children…but that’s it. 5-seaters are jokes anymore.

  13. Schmeltz says:

    I think if the goal is to make the Volt more of a mainstream car, and appeal to mainstream buyers, then seating for 5 is a necessity. The argument that you rarely need seating for 5, or that the compact size of the current Volt is “good enough”, cavalierly ignores the fact that the mainstream cars are all 5 seaters. Our very own Lyle Dennis eventually had to leave go of his Volt and get a 5 seater Ford C-Max to accomadate his family. I’m in the same boat. So are most people. The seating for 4 in the Volt was a compromise due to the intrusion of the battery pack. Get rid of the compromises and gain sales.

  14. John says:

    I own an ’11 Volt, and the primary comment I would make would be on the mpg of the gas range extender engine. Yes, extra electric range would be greatly welcomed; however, I cannot help but long for the mpg I used to get in my former car – a Prius – when making longer trips.

    Over the course of one year of driving the Volt, I averaged better than 250 mpg. But I then needed to drive from Central PA to Ohio, and that one trip decimated my average down to “only” 140mpg average. Yes, still a phenominal average by today’s standards, but to see a year’s worth of very planned and conscious driving be signficantly reduced by one day’s driving stung a little bit.

    1. John says:

      And one last thought: I would be willing to sacrifice performance for efficiency on long trips where one would supposedly set the cruise to 65 or 70 and forget about it for long distances. I realize that may be easier said than done when considering this car doesn’t have a typical drivetrain configuration. Please note that I love my Volt, and I’m only commenting on how I would like to see the next generation evolve.

    2. ClarksonCote says:

      But as a counter point, your Prius averaged, say 48 MPG, and now your Volt averaged 140 MPG. If the Volt got 50 MPG in CS mode instead of 40 MPG, your average of 140 MPG would maybe go up to 141 or 142 MPG. The change of increasing the engine’s standalone fuel efficiency is not as significant as it sounds when you look at the true driving patterns that often don’t use that engine, and the corresponding overall MPG of the vehicle.

  15. John says:

    The Volt has consistently had much higher customer satisfaction than everything else on the road. Considering that, I’d say GM’s main focus should be on figuring out how they can further reducing the starting sticker price, and also hiring a new marketing company. There are so many misconceptions about how it works and what it is capable of, but it doesn’t seem like they get the word out.

    Sure, I’d like a 3 row 7 seater that’s faster and has a longer EV range and can pull a boat too though.

    1. Chris O says:

      …and soon you can have it. It’s called the Outlander PHEV, it will tow your boat, I think it will seat seven or at least 5+lots of luggage and all at a cost that’s lower than the Volt’s. GM should watch the competition.

      1. John says:

        Sounds great. I’ll be interested in seeing when it finally gets here if the price and lease programs are good. The Volt has killer leases. Mitsu will need to make sure they get $7500 credit – that helps it all come together. Price is important, but so is lease support. If we expect battery tech to keep improving, we have to expect resale value to be unknown – so I’d rather lease this kind of thing.

        Oh, sorry to the other person who is named John that posted ‘And one last thought..’ and then I coincidentally posted my own not long after.

  16. Suprise Cat says:

    They should make the Rex optional and offer different battery sizes.

  17. CW says:

    Wow look at all these people making demands! This triple 5 stuff is bull$%$#. There’s no way they’re going to get a 5 seater with 50 MPG and a 50 mile battery range that soon. As GM researched previously, most people commute about 35 miles a day so its not really necessary for the battery range. I have a VOLT with 2500 miles on it and so far my total MPG is about 185. Of course that’s not factoring in the cost of electricity. Think about it. Even if you had a 70 mile commute each day half of that would be on battery therefore bringing your MPG to roughly 70 MPG. That’s ONE FREAKIN’ GALLON of gas a day for a 70 MILE DAILY COMMUTE. Stop bellyachinq and just buy the VOLT already!

    1. Priusmaniac says:

      50 mpg of the range extender is not necessary. On the other hand a flex-fuel engine would allow electric and ethanol driving at last.
      Zero oil use, long range ability, affordable price and versatility in case of blackout.

  18. Open-Mind says:

    0 to 60 MPH in FIVE seconds, via electric two-motor all-wheel-drive.

    That’s the FIVE I want! 🙂

    1. David Murray says:

      You know.. this would probably help sell the car better than anything else. Granted, you’d be getting a different crowd of buyers. But honestly, for the size of vehicle that the Volt is, the high performance crowd is a better fit for the car than the “family man” concept they’ve been trying for.

    2. ClarksonCote says:

      If they didn’t limit the motor output when flooring the accelerator from a stop, I think they could easily shave 2 seconds off the current 0-60 time.

    3. Visitor says:

      Now you are talking. I think most people miss the point of how fun this car is to drive and GM is fighting a loosing battle by trying to see the vehicle on cost savings. Given its price, there is no financial point in buying a Volt. On the other hand, add luxury, gadgets, update the electronics, improve performance, now people will buy without caring what it costs.

  19. Spec says:

    Triple 5s would be great. But it will be hard to hit that AND reduce the price which is probably more important than any of those 5s. The gas-only 50MPG would be awesome. 50 mile electric range shouldn’t be hard with just a little more battery.

    1. GeorgeS says:

      They could get 20% more AER just by switching to the Sparks battery. They could drop the cost of the Car by switching to the Sparks TMS.

      http://gm-volt.com/2013/08/02/spark-ev-versus-volt-battery/

      Then go to a pure series machine and eliminate the 4ET50 transmission.

      Go to 3 banger RE.

      At this point we have 20% better AER . Now put in a bigger traction motor for more performance.

      put the batteries in the floor

      All these things make for a cheaper, faster, lighter, higher AER Volt.

      1. MnVikes says:

        By George, I think he’s GOT IT. 🙂

        Agree 100%

  20. pjwood says:

    I’d sooner take the triple fives, with a “55” AER and a 5th seat (modified battery stack). Leave the 1.4ltr alone, if it funds more cow bell.

    I agree, the i3 is closer to the ideal EREV formula. Getting the next 20 AER would sweep up most remaining “daily use” stats, including cold weather. EREVs don’t need 85 AER, especially at $400-500/kwh.

  21. They can make the inside a lot bigger if they put “slimmer” seats in. If the ICE gets significantly smaller (and lighter), then the battery can be partially moved to the front, to make more room in the backseat.

    They could make the ICE much smaller and simpler if they use it only at highway speeds to move the car, or to charge the battery in true serial hybrid fashion. The complexity of the transmission would be moot, and just have say two gears for running on the highway.

    They can improve the aerodynamic drag to gain a lot of range and efficiency. If the Cd was close(r) to the EV1 (0.20) then the 50 miles range could easily be achieved with the current battery.

    Neil

  22. Merlin says:

    How about 5 models of electric or voltec instead – Spark, Volt, ELR, minivan, small truck/suv? That’s the 5 they need to get better market penetration. Larger market share = economies of scale begets lower cost, etc.

    Volt 2.0 should definitely roll with a dedicated engine (3 cyl if that works out) and perhaps the Li-S batteries or other inbetween tech that gets at least 50 AER. I don’t much care about the 50 mpg in CS mode. ELR should go for the 5.0 sec 0-60. Volt 3.0 can ditch the T-shaped battery back and go for all new architecture and roll out a Malibu/Buick mid-size in the new battery tech around 2017/18.

    But get that mini-van and truck on the road already! Tons of skateboard type room there for large Spark-type battery

  23. evnow says:

    3 to 4 years is Tesla Gen 3 time frame ?

    Will 50 mpg, 50 mile AER, $30k Volt compete with 200 mile AER Tesla for $35k ?

    1. Taser54 says:

      Meh. Tesla has to survive 3-4 years first and foremost. Then it has to produce the Model X. Then it has to produce the Gen 3 at the price it promised.

      A lot of obstacles for Tesla to overcome first.

      1. ItsNotAboutTheMoney says:

        They also need to improve the speed of Supercharging without increasing the cost much.

      2. Daniel Cardenas says:

        >Tesla has to survive 3-4 years first and foremost.
        It is making profits so survival is trivial.
        >Then it has to produce the Model X.
        Adding a new shell to an existing platform is not a big hurdle.

        >Then it has to produce the Gen 3 at the price it promised.
        Did you see the estimate for Tesla’s cost for the battery? Only $12K.
        http://insideevs.com/tesla-battery-in-the-model-s-costs-less-than-a-quarter-of-the-car-in-most-cases/
        quote: 50 kWh of lithium power would only translate to a maximum of $11,900 in costs

    2. GSP says:

      No. (!)

      GSP

  24. doudis2 says:

    I say the Volt is a compact car and should remain so. If you want 5 seats then you do not want a Volt.

    50 mile range; that is inevitable.

    50 mpg; why not? If a TDI and Prius can do it then so can Volt 2.0.

    Finally. I totally agree that GM needs to adapt the Voltec tech in to other larger vehicles, but the Volt is a compact and is fine just as it is.

    Next you guys will be clamoring for a 5 seat Vette…oh the horror!

    1. GSP says:

      Prius gets 50 mpg on the fueleconomy.gov website, but TDIs do not. Their city mpg is not that great, and combined is about 40 mpg.

      Compare the VW Jetta hybrid mpg to the Jetta TDI automatic. The hybrid is significantly higher.

      GSP

    2. Priusmaniac says:

      99 % of sedans come with 5 seat, why make an exception?
      To sabotate the product on purpose ?

  25. James says:

    Wow – sure some empty-nesters buy Volts – yeah, I get it.

    Folks here who’ve been saying, “Oh Volt doesn’t need seating for 5…”, don’t get
    that a car design has to appeal TO A WIDE VARIETY OF BUYERS TO SUCCEED.
    Sure, you may be single, or the kids are grown up, or whatever…But having 2 kids,
    a Volt and a Prius – you’d be surprised at how many times we take the hybrid because
    we have a friend along, or grandma, or…. It’s not much to ask for – to seat one more
    person. It could be the difference between success of the model or it’s demise. A
    major knock of pure BEVs is many are tiny and are slated as car #2,3 or 4 – or basically
    the grocery-getter. Other cars in that family’s “fleet” serve the chores of Girl Scouts
    Mover, Playground Shuttle or Grandma-getter. Cars like Corolla and Camry sell like
    burgers at Sonic because at least they have that capability to allow a family on a budget
    to have just one car.

    Hundreds of thousands of us just keep asking – “Why doesn’t GM plan for an EREV MPV?!!!
    And it’s plain to see they just don’t have that in their plans. Why? Because the Equinox is
    their baby. It’s cheap to build and has an enormous profit margin. GM won’t even sell the
    Orlando in the ‘States because it just may chip away at those sacred Equinox sales. One
    thing is for sure – if 2nd gen Volt does eventually get here – it needs 5 seats.

  26. James says:

    Subway sandwich stores hit it out of the park with it’s “5 – 5 Dollar – 5 Dollar Footlong! ”
    campaign.

    My family even sings the darn song on the way to the establishment! The Tri-5
    jingle could be huge for GM. But better judgement says, “hey, most cars seat
    at least 5! “, so bragging that Volt seats 5 would be kind of dork-ish. Better to
    promote 50/50. “FIFTY MILES TO EACH GALLON OF GAS!” AND – AND –
    IT EVEN DRIVES FIFTY MILES USING ZERO GAS AT ALL- NOT A DROP!”
    WOW!”

    But then we need the clever jingle, ” FIFTY FIFTY – IT’S NIFTY! “…. lol

    OK, not that – but something that sticks in your mind. 🙂

    1. James says:

      But please GM — PULEEZ don’t bring back the Volt Dancers!

  27. Visitor says:

    Upgrade the electronics. Add intelligent cruise control. Improve the nav system. Little things matter.

  28. Mark C says:

    I am waiting for the 50 mile AER minimum, and at least close to 50 mpg of unleaded regular gas. Why would the Volt need Premium fuel when the same size engine in a different car runs on regular? To make it more upscale in some peoples imagination?

    1. Dan says:

      Mark C, I imagine that the “same size engine in a different car” is not built to use fuel that’s up to a year old.

      I’d rather have to fill up on premium once a year than to have to rebuy regular every six months.

      1. Rob Stark says:

        Premium fuel is not more durable nor IMO more prestigious LOL.

        It does not go through a superior refining process nor get better detergent.

        It simply has a higher octane number, more oxygen.

        In engines designed for it can increase horsepower and torque by about 2%.

        It used to be if you put gas with lower octane than the OEM recommended the engine would knock.

        Modern computer controlled fuel systems will almost certainly adjust to lower octane gas if that is what you put in it. Most luxury cars say premium is recommend not required.

        The exception might be ultra high performance cars like Porsche Turbos and Ferarris. In that case you may want to stick to premium.

        BTW If GM wants to keep selling under 29k Volts/Amperas worldwide every year they will listen to current Volt owners. If they want to sell 300k plus worldwide every year they will listen to what Prius owners and compact sedan owners want.