Tesla To Release Powerwall Version 2.0 This Summer

1 year ago by Mark Kane 48

Don't Have $3,000 Or More Than A Year To Burn? You Could Try To "Build Your Own" Powerwall

Tesla Powerwall

Elon Musk recently announced in Paris that Tesla intends to introduce a second version of the Powerwall home energy storage around July/August of this year.

Powerwall itself is a brand new product that is just entering market, so it’s puzzling why there will be second version so quickly?

The announced “step change” could be significant, but we don’t know yet in which direction (energy, power output, price – or maybe all three?).

You can find Elon Musk’s statement in the video above after 9:00.

Tesla Energy "Powerwall" Specs (click to enlarge)

Tesla Energy “Powerwall” Specs (click to enlarge)

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48 responses to "Tesla To Release Powerwall Version 2.0 This Summer"

  1. ModernMarvelFan says:

    Cheaper price would be a start.

    1. kdawg says:

      Would be nice if they included the inverter too.

      1. Sublime says:

        Agreed, would be great if it was a black box between the solar panel, grid AC, and home electrical panel.

        1. ModernMarvelFan says:

          Yes, it would be nice if Tesla offers the entire package.

          But I think Tesla is leaving that part to the sister company Solar City.

          1. Heisenberght says:

            I really hope that they don’t leave it to solar city. The most important thing when it comes to energy efficiency is integration of all components. By merging the car the wall and the roof to one virtual unit Tesla could achieve far more than most people think. I would not go as far as some others go and include the supercharger network but sure that would paint an even more surrealistic picture of Tesla bees swarming and harvesting energy and information. Sorry I think I got carried away..
            I just wanted to say : Tesla please add v2g and a nice piece of software. This will enable powerwall customers to not only use the mere kwh of the powerwall but also that more kwh of the car – when it is plugged in of course πŸ˜‰

            On Tesla motors club is a nice thread showing that even – very skilled – tinkerers can do quite a good job going off grid with used Tesla battery packs. Just imagine what a team of insider engineers could achieve. Now that x is done they can surely allocate some people to such a special forces team. If so, look out for a really astonishing powerwall 2.0 with – external aka car-mounted- touch panel control πŸ˜‰

            Heck can they please finally hire one lousy architect to design a triple Tesla garage. 3 slots called S,3,X with solar roof and integrated power wall home link doors and snakes? All your base! Will still sell at 300K (cars included) + destination fee. Just announce it Mr. Musk people will go crazy and pay 50K directly to get a place in the line. You can deliver any time you want… Any plans for 2019?

            1. ModernMarvelFan says:

              Doesn’t V2G defeat the purpose of Powerwall somewhat?

        2. jerryd says:

          As the inverters are still expensive but cheap for Tesla adding one wouldn’t be much as it needs charging which the reversible inverter can do, not unlike V2G.
          Next the price needs to drop.
          Tesla’s cost is under $160/kwhr yet charging $350/kwhr.
          There are a limited number of places $350/kwhr is viable as most of the US needs under $200/kwhr retail to be viable.
          It is still smarter to do golf cart lead now until lithium prices drop.

          1. Heisenberght says:

            I also think that 2.0 will add an inverter most likely with V2G. Just increasing kwh or kw peak would not qualify for a 2.0 but for a 1.1 imo with all the knowledge in house Tesla could design a pretty surprising product. Just think of the power wall connected to the Tesla s/x as one virtual unit. Car already has 3g or LTE or Wi-Fi, has sufficient computing power, has knowledge about the driver, powerwall gains knowledge about usage patterns regarding household. What else do you need for a close to perfect home energy command Centre? Software… They sure can set aside a team of 3 to spit out a better product than all existing. The only missing pieces are the inverter and the plug maybe a cheap controller board and some fuses. To my best knowledge the people at Tesla will not suffer major problems making the wall talk to the car and vice versa. Maybe by accident they realize that they convert more and more of your surrounding into a robot like monster in which you are allowed to live as a parasite. Regarding the price I think it will drop just very slightly or just stay the same. Heck people will run crazy if their home battery can talk to the car…

            Next thing on the Tesla to do list: make Tesla power wall talk to household equipment, light, heating cooling. Eat us all Tesla!!! Orb com the new apple πŸ˜‰

      2. R.S. says:

        Not necessarily, I guess Tesla could manufacture pretty cheap inverters too, but selling them separately makes more sense, at least for some customers. If you already have PV installed, you already own an inverter, so why would you want to pay even $50 more for an additional inverter? Or if you want multiple power walls for additional storage. So the addition of an inverter only makes the batteries more expensive.

        1. ModernMarvelFan says:

          ” If you already have PV installed, you already own an inverter, so why would you want to pay even $50 more for an additional inverter? ”

          Because they aren’t the same inverter.

          Typical Solar Inverters are DC to AC inverters that are grid tied.

          The Powerwall inverters would need to be DC to AC and AC to DC as well. It is two way designed to charge and discharge the battery independent of solar power available.

          Also, the solar inverters are designed to power rating of the panels, not the battery packs.

          Lastly, you can micro inverter for your solar panels which wouldn’t be able to “share” with your battery pack.

          1. Tech01x says:

            SolarEdge 7600’s can be expanded to add StorEdge capabilities that include handling a single PowerWall.

            http://www.solaredge.us/groups/us/products/storedge

        2. Sublime says:

          On top of what MMF said, it would offer modularity. If a powerwall failed, your other 1, 2, or however many could still allow you to function, at worst with a little more help from the grid.

        3. kdawg says:

          I was also thinking it would be a nice UPS system for people who don’t even have solar panels. That would expand Tesla’s market. You could grid tie one of these and then if power went out, use it to power your home for a bit.

          1. Sublime says:

            I know there are some places where people pay a premium for peak draw (say you use your blender, when you’re preheating your electric oven and microwaving something, all while the AC is running, that’s a peak draw of about 12kW and would cost you something extra at the end of the month). Using the powerwall as power buffer might make sense for those people if the price is right. Especially if they can get peak/offpeak pricing and use it to shift some of their peak draw to off peak charging.

            1. kdawg says:

              Yes, that would be a good idea. Would have to see if the efficiencies work out, so that you would end up saving money. Would also depend on the rate difference between peak and non-peak. Tesla could have a programmable Powerwall that would always source during peak hours (as long as it has juice) and then recharge at night.

              Might get tricky during the switch. For example if you are in the middle of microwaving popcorn and the Powerwall needs to go from battery power to grid power, how do you handle that transition smoothly?

              1. Heisenberght says:

                Microwave is most likely less than 1kw at least mine is, with America being bigger in everything maybe your monster -microwave is double πŸ˜‰

                Should not be any problem to switch if done correctly. Worst case I can imagine is that you hear a slight slip in the sound from the magnetron if frequency is not perfectly matched – which I also doubt it’s too much of a problem.

                Bigger chances for problems occur when you turn on the electric mover your wife turns on the hair dryer the AC turns on the fridge and all of them at the same time the switch to the grid/battery occurs. Might give problems with peak load or phase shift. But that is no real world problem as its imaginary anyway πŸ˜‰
                -1^(1/2)

      3. Sveno says:

        Would be nice if it doesn’t come with an inverter as I want my new house to be as much DC as possible.

  2. tftf says:

    Can anyone say “Osborne Effect”?

    I doubt Tesla planned to sell many 1.0 devices, otherwise this premature 2.0 announcement just killed those off until summer…

    1. ModernMarvelFan says:

      There is no Osborn effect since the original 1.0 was effectively sold out at last summer’s announcement.

      There is nothing to impact except for competitor’s product.

      1. tftf says:

        “sold out at last summer’s announcement.”

        Well, sales have been more than meager. Look at Tesla’s quarterly results.

        Selling out is easy if production is so limited.

        1. ModernMarvelFan says:

          “Selling out is easy if production is so limited.”

          That is very likely to be true since Gigafactory isn’t opened yet. Powerwalls have always been a product that is using the “spare” capacity of the Gigafactory. So there is no need to build more when there isn’t any capacity yet.

          If so, then your original claim of “Osborn Effect” still doesn’t apply.

    2. Josh says:

      I think your right. The 1.0 was to test what demand was for a product like that. After making a few and figuring out more customer wants/needs, Tesla is revising the product before going into higher volume production.

      Makes sense to me.

      1. sven says:

        Sucks for anyone who bought version 1.0.

        1. ModernMarvelFan says:

          It is always the case for “early adopter”.

          But the problem with waiting game is that you always have to wait.

          By the time you are late adopter, the technology already moved to something even better…

        2. jerryd says:

          sven, most were ‘sold’ on lease so doesn’t really effect them.

  3. walter says:

    Maybe it’s a 48 volt version to be compatible with standard inverters like sma sunny island, victron or studer

    1. Heisenberght says:

      Wow that would make it interesting for me too…

      Why the heck didn’t I even think of such a possibility (slap on the front head)

      Tesla please do that! πŸ˜‰ and please at a price affordable to a homeless one πŸ˜‰

      1. Mxs says:

        Didn’t you just ask for 300k Tesla garage???

        Sometimes I feel that the average income of people on this site is quite up there. Reality check …

  4. Ocean Railroader says:

    It sounds like the 2.0 version might offer maybe 10% to 20% more capacity for the same cost considering battery tech is now starting to get more powerful then the first generation of power walls.

    I think the 7 kilowatt power wall will become the 9 kilowatt power wall While the 10 10 kilowatt power wall will become the 12 or 14 kilowatt power wall.

  5. It might also be a tool to run some of the Gigafactory 1 Pilot plant output into simple and lower power tests.

    Or, they have worked out that the existing packs can handle higher than just 2 kW sevice load and they will be just re-rating them for higher output.

    It would seem to me that the 7 kWh version should be able to push 3.5 kW at 0.5C, and up to 14 kW at 2.0C. The 10 kW version, then, should be able to push 5.0 kW up to 20 kW, at the same 0.5C to 2.0C. Even if it became a max of 10.0 kW and 15.0 kW respectively, it would be a big step up!

  6. Josh says:

    The most interesting tidbit in there is that Tesla is going to start adding some EU plugs at their SuperCharger stations.

    This has to mean there is an EU manufacturer about to release a SuperCharger capable vehicle. Because no Tesla will be able to use those plugs.

    Start at the 15:00 mark to listen.

    1. Josh says:

      Correction, looks like it is just EU regulation forcing Tesla to have a CCS.

      From a post on TMC:

      “One thing that most people here does seems to overlook is the EU directive that will be effective from November 2017. It demands that all new DC charging-points have to:
      1. Have a CSS plug
      2. Have non-discrimination access
      3. Have “add-hock” payment
      4. Have a reasonable price.

      So, at least for the EU they will have to have a “pay-as-you-go” system. Whatever Tesla was planing to do, this may change their plans….”

      1. Heisenberght says:

        Don’t worry Eu directive has to be implemented through national laws. Lazy politicians. Only one interested Germany (protect home car makers) will not affect Tesla too much as supercharger network here can be considered as close to done.

  7. Cavaron says:

    With developments in Nevada in mind – I could bet that Tesla / SC will want to create a system with off-grid capabilities. A bigger battery capacity is one thing you need for that. A way to charge the powerwall in case of a bad weather period or a mailfunction in the solar system would be another.

    So maybe powerwall 2.0 will be ready to be charged from a Tesla car (vehicle to home) with power from a supercharger. The powerwall will meter the power transfered and you will be billed for that (so no SC abuse).

  8. Anthony says:

    The vision for this next-gen product, in the face of attacks on solar power like in the state of Nevada (which recently killed net metering and increased rates on solar power customers), should be to allow people to install a solar power system on their house, and have the batteries on-site to make sure as little is sold back to the grid as possible (and as much as possible is used to offset grid usage after the sun sets).

    Higher power output should be item #1 on the list. Whether it requires more kWh in the pack or advances in the heating/cooling of the cells to maintain higher rates. I don’t think we’ll see capacity bumps so quickly though. This low power output might be fine for CA and other fair-weather climates, but having to chain 3+ of them together to make sure it can run large AC or heaters is expensive.

    1. Heisenberght says:

      Insulation? Seems to not exist over there. Sorry for being so rude don’t take it personal but I really wonder why so many complain about energy prices dependency etc but nearly no one considers to build a low energy house. I wonder what are the prices for 3 pane windows in the US? Here they are not too much higher than the regular 2 pane windows…

      1. Mxs says:

        You really need o learn a bit more about North American mentality and energy prices …. Aka would Europeans drive smaller, more efficient, mostly diesel cars if fuel was as cheap as in North America? …. I am not saying I agree with the mentality, but I am not sure the Europeans are somewhat greener, so to speak.

  9. Someone out there says:

    They will probably increase the output power, 2 kW is not really good enough. Perhaps there will be a minor energy increase also but probably not very much.

    1. Mike I says:

      That spec page is from the initial announcement. Tesla has already announced increased the DC/DC converter power and the unit can output 5kW if my memory serves correctly.

      1. Someone out there says:

        Sure, Musk has muttered something about raising the specs but the official specs still says “3.3 kW” which matches the peak specification on the picture shown here. If it really did support more I’m sure they would have changed their information by now.

    2. Tech01x says:

      Updated spec has 3.3 kW continuous and peak.

  10. Basar says:

    It will be possible to lift it off the wall and fit it in the frunk as a range extender.

    1. ModernMarvelFan says:

      For what? 25 miles to 30 miles of “extension”?

      At what cost? $3000?

      LOL.

      1. Leeper says:

        For my imiev, that would be almost a 50% range increase! I would totally do that for $3,000.

      2. Basar says:

        With increased capacity you could drive a model 70 for everyday and 90+ for longer trips.

        At what cost? You could charge the difference of a 70 to a 90 at least.

  11. Bloggin says:

    I woud like to see the Powerwall hold enough power from a 4 car garage covered with solar cells, that it can top off the EV nightly, along with power the home, with at least 3 days reserve.

    I think 2.0 will drop the 7kWh and offer 10kWh and 15kWh, with cellular/wifi connectivity for monitoring and configuration.

  12. Bonaire says:

    My favorite thing is watching people talk about the Powerwall in so many ways with such a limited amount of knowledge of what a full system would actually do, cost and the energy contained could offer them. What Tesla needs to do is start to face reality that the US market (the richest buying market they have) will need larger powerwalls in the 20-30 kWh range. In fact, some McMansions would be better off with a powerpack of 100kWh. Generac generators usually are sized at 16KW to 22KW for whole-home generation. That is not kWh but KW of power. The home needs full surge-support for pumps and ovens and other things but a better solution is a battery that can handle multiple C surge output without needing the larger fuel-draw of a generator – the battery can supply only the power demanded at the time. However, to fully backup a home for a power-outage event you should plan for 2-3 days of power needs and be able to “refill” it with Solar PV. Cloudy days are poor power generation days for Solar PV so some off-grid homeowners with Solar use 5-days of clouds as their power production rating and plan for 20% round trip losses to/from the battery.

    The Powerwall is currently an enigma. When people see what a true cost to install one 7kWh or 10kWh battery is, they will of course just say “add another one or two” because they will be needed to actually do something. A single 7kWh powerwall is kind of a joke in terms of cost/benefit. SolarCity even said they would not install them. The 10kWh battery can be used as a simpler charge once and wait for a power failure type of box. The 7kWh is like their 10kWh Beta systems they installed in the prior years. Those actually could do something in terms of Time of Use sell-back of power in California. However, they also cost over $10K and got nearly that much back from the CA SGIP program.

    If people do not know how off-grid battery systems work nor how much they cost to construct and maintain, then they really have no clue of what the PowerWall will cost or if it will help them at all with their “needs”.

  13. JR says:

    Very simple, my request
    make it possible to charge you tesla directly with DC charge from the powerwall!