Nissan Exec Expects Next-Gen EVs Will Boast 310-Mile Electric Range

1 week ago by Steven Loveday 70

Nissan

Nissan LEAFs and e-NV200 at V2G station in the UK

According to Nissan, based on information from the company’s commercial vehicle division, the next-generation of EVs will surpass a 310-mile range for cars.

Nissan’s e-NV200 light-commercial panel van was released in 2013. It has garnered a decent amount of success for the company, with its hauling capacity of 1,697 pounds and 106-mile range.

Ponz Pandikuthira, vice president for product planning for Nissan Europe, and one of the motivators for moving electrification to Nissan’s LCV division, sees positive demands for the improved technology. He recently spoke to the U.K.’s Society of Motor Manufacturers and Traders. He shared:

Nissan

Nissan e-NV200

“We have more experience with EVs than any other manufacturer, and we’ve seen a huge uptake in the sales of the e-NV200, especially with delivery companies.”

“The threshold for the next generation of EVs is going to be significantly larger than those on the market right now. We’re expecting the step-up in range to take us to 250, 350 and 500 kilometers (300 miles) in range for cars.”

“Thankfully it’s very easy to pass that on to vans, because you can fit the powertrain and batteries to the platform because you have the space. The timing (for launching in the U.K. market) is still to be confirmed, but in the future an electric vehicle will be able to reach 500 kilometers in real-world conditions. Not just during the laboratory-testing process.”

“Electrifying commercial vehicles for short haul has its obvious benefits.“Something like the NT400 (flatbed truck), for example, is perfect and there are already companies retrofitting electric powertrains to garbage-collection vehicles.”

“For the long haul, it’s just a case of getting the battery costs down and also working out how to generate the charge.”

At the moment, Pandikuthira admits that many consumers still have range anxiety, and tend to prefer hybrids over fully-electric vehicles. He says that this is just a “stepping stone” as EV technology continues to develop and improve. He also believes that plug-in hybrids can be a bridge to all-electric vehicles, but it’s only a short-term solution, due to the configuration’s excessive weight.

“When we see hybrids, we see a pathway to full electrification. Nissan is obviously working towards zero-emission future, but there are several ways to get there. We’re already quite advanced in terms of mild- and microhybrid technology.”

“For example, the Note (mini-MPV) with E-Power is the best-selling vehicle in Japan. It works with a range extender, which uses a small combustion engine to charge the battery. This is something that could work with a compact commercial vehicle.”

“Then there is plug-in hybrid technology. At the moment, this gives a driver 100 miles (161 km) of electric range and lower emissions for urban driving. Obviously, there are challenges with this technology, because when you add a plug-in system you add a huge amount of mass to the vehicle, sometimes up to 400 kg (881 lbs). That’s why we see it as a short-term solution. Plug-in hybrids are a bridge to full-term electrification.”

For these reasons, Pandikuthira asserts that the time has come to build vehicles as all-electric models from the beginning. This is more cost-effective than dealing with hybrids and plug-in hybrids, and then working on a transition at a later date. While this may not be entirely possible quite yet, it’s the company’s target.

“Going forward, we’d like to define vehicles as EVs from the start. That makes it more cost-efficient from a development point of view, but over the next five years we don’t think that will be the case for all vehicles. That’s why we design them with a sense of interchangeability.”

Source: WardsAuto

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70 responses to "Nissan Exec Expects Next-Gen EVs Will Boast 310-Mile Electric Range"

  1. unlucky says:

    For the Leaf itself other sites have been reporting vastly different numbers. In fact there is a mooted pack size already. It’s a bit under 40kWh, but that figure is expected to be the usable amount.

    That would probably put the vehicle at under 200 miles range (but not much under). There is a suggestion that a longer range version would come a year later.

    1. mr. M says:

      This is because the Zoe has a 44kWh usable battery. They are all only speculating that the Leaf get’s the same battery

      1. unlucky says:

        I said under 40kWh, not over.

        38.4kWh is the rumor. I don’t see how that is just thinking of a Zoe pack.

      2. Peter says:

        The Zoe only comes with a 22 or 41 kWh battery, not 44 kWh.

  2. Terawatt says:

    Meanwhile, they are preparing to launch yet another slightly upgraded LEAF. If the rumours of a 40 kWh pack prove accurate, the ZOE is clearly the prioritized product, since it got there far ahead of the LEAF.

    I used to think Tesla Model 3 would force the others into action, but it seems they feel there’s still plenty of time. I really hope the Model 3 production ramp goes well and that it takes significant share from some of the incumbents most profitable products. Not much can get these old boys to move, but losing market share quickly should help. And they really deserve to.

    Too little too late appears to be Nissan’s new maxim.

    1. Leo says:

      I actually think they have the right idea pushing for lower costs. Tesla model 3 is good but will still be too pricey for most people. What we need is cheaper electric cars for them to take off, and doing a 40kWh version with a less polarizing body shape is going to be a success for Nissan.

      1. Rob Stark says:

        A new LEAF is too pricey for most people.

        The median American auto buyer will spend $12k on his next ride. A used car.

        1. SteveSeattle says:

          But auto manufacturers cannot make used cars

        2. Leo says:

          And you can get a used Leaf for well under $12k. And it will cost you a lot less to run than the equivalent gas car. So the Leaf is already there. Once the 30kW and 40kW models hit the used market at those prices it will be even more practical as a commuter for everyone.

      2. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        “Tesla model 3 is good but will still be too pricey for most people. What we need is cheaper electric cars for them to take off…”

        Nissan already tried to “cheap out” by not putting a battery cooling system into their Leaf. Didn’t work out so well for them, did it?

        What the EV revolution needs is more cars which are good enough to justify their price. Hopefully the Tesla Model 3 will be. Truly cheap EVs will have to wait until battery prices come down more than they have, which is going to take some time. The way to speed the process is by making more cars like the Bolt EV and the Tesla Model 3, and make them in large numbers; not by trying and failing yet again to produce a low-cost EV, because that would just create another failure like the CODA Sedan or the Th!nk City.

        Those wound up being vastly overpriced for their market segments because there wasn’t sufficient demand to justify production in large numbers, and with small production runs come high prices. That equation hasn’t changed, and isn’t likely to in the near future.

    2. Seuthès says:

      I don’t think Renault have the priority and Nissan is the second best.
      Nissan have to deal with their battery before to have LG Chem for their batteries.

      The Nissan ~40kWh will be avalaible under 30,000€ VAT Incl. in France and surely ~25,000$ in the USA.
      That will be a great deal for BEV.

    3. mr. M says:

      If Nissan will be the second company (after GM/Opel) where you can buy a decently priced 60kWh+ BEV. I don’t think they deserve to be punished for late market appearance. Only because you get not something better today does not means it’s Nissans fault. Look at VW, they want to be BEV-Marketleaders in 2022. I don’t know how they expect this to be come true.

      1. BenG says:

        Exactly: being the second to market with an affordable 60 kwh EV means they are ahead of 90% of the competition.

        The first gen Leaf is still the #1 seller globally 2017 through April, with 18,000+ sales. http://insideevs.com/68000-plug-in-cars-were-sold-globally-in-april/

      2. SparkEV says:

        Nissan deserves punishment if they do the following:

        1. Continue with their stupid no charge to piss off all other EV program (aka, no charge to charge).

        2. Not have active battery thermal management.

    4. DJ says:

      Why does Nissan deserve to lose market share? Because they’ve got more EVs on the road than virtually any other manufacturer?

      1. speculawyer says:

        Because they have hardly done a thing for plug-in cars since shipping the original LEAF.

        1. BenG says:

          Well, other than:

          Upgrading battery chemistry,
          Increasing storage from 24 kwh to 30 kwh,
          Heat pump cabin heating ahead of everyone else,
          Cutting price over the years, and offering huge incentives, now making the Leaf one of the most affordable compact 5 passenger vehicles you can buy in many markets, if you can use the full federal tax credit.

      2. Paul Smith says:

        Does anyone have the total global EV sales for Nissan vs Tesla, with a link to source?

        1. Miggy says:

          The Leaf is almost 100k sales above the Model S.
          Pl Model Sales
          1 Nissan Leaf 268.441
          2 Tesla Model S 170.799
          3 Chevrolet Volt 138.290
          4 Mits Outlander PHEV 127.341

          1. Miggy says:

            Check out EV sales Blog – World Sales

    5. John Ray says:

      Good luck with that. The Leaf will be selling in volume to paying customers around the world by Q1 2018. The M3 won’t even be out of the starting gate. And small 4 door sedans are not that sought after or profitable. Tesla isn’t even the leading producer of EVs. Some of you fanbois really need a dose of reality – and I think you’re about to get it.

      1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        Right, that’s why every auto maker entering the EV market is following Nissan, not Tesla; and why every auto maker is talking about competing with Nissan, not Tesla.

        Oh, wait…

    6. Tom says:

      The most likely outcome will be a choice and the entry level will be about 40kwh and there will be an optional higher capacity pack. There will be many for which 40 is enough and they’d rather save the money. 40 would increase range 33% roughly which would likely come close to 150 miles range.

  3. Monty Python says:

    More is better. If the next Leaf doesn’t offer a 60 kWh option from the start, people will move to Tesla or Bolt. A lot of folks lock in for a 3 year lease, so you might as well get the most range on offer when you sign. But 2020-2021 should be an interesting market.

    1. Leo says:

      > If the next Leaf doesn’t offer a 60 kWh option from the start, people will move to Tesla or Bolt

      Not if the Leaf is cheaper.

      1. Alan B. says:

        And more reliable (less costly to maintain) than a Tesla.

      2. ItsNotAboutTheMoney says:

        If the Leaf is _much_ cheaper.

      3. Monty Python says:

        I can lease a Bolt LT for $199/month with the Drive Green program in MA. Leaf 2 is gonna have to be pretty cheap then beat that with only 38 kWh.

      4. Monty Python says:

        But that’s beside the point. I want the 60 kWh. And now it’s in my price range. Why settle for a lesser car?

        1. Tom says:

          Your point is invalid. Nissan is reaching for a price point for the vast majority of buyers for which the Bolt is not in their price range.

          1. Monty Python says:

            You missed the point. Bolt is already cheaper. But if people want to spend more for less, that’s fine with me.

  4. Joe says:

    Nissan should move ASAP to CCS (150kW +) for charging method in the US & Europe

    1. unlucky says:

      I think they should go CCS in Europe and Americas too.

      I don’t know that 150kW is going to happen soon on a Leaf.

  5. Peter says:

    Leaf looks like pure ugly. Difficult to make it more ugly.

    This van on the other hand looks normal and only lacks a lager battery. How difficult is that to understand ?

    People at Nissan have very narrow minds.

    1. BenG says:

      The van could use larger battery, it just costs money, and this is a very price sensitive niche.

      Nissan is well aware of the needs/wants/costs surrounding the e-NV200.

      I’m sure the second generation will see a big improvement. I hope they also continue to pursue their pilot program of e-NV200s with an solid oxide fuel cell (SOFC) running on ethanol. That is the most promising fuel cell prototype I’ve seen.

    2. John says:

      The “ugly” Leaf still outsells the competition so what’s the problem?

      1. Stimpy says:

        It outsells the competition only because Nissan puts about $17k on the hood of each one. Not exactly a position of power.

        1. John Ray says:

          Don’t hate the player, hate the game.

  6. BenG says:

    I’m guessing the Leaf will get a 40 kwh and a 60 kwh option.

    Nissan is still a leader in EVs despite their 2cnd gen Leaf being a bit late. The first gen Leaf is still going strong: it’s still the top selling EV globally in 2017. Through April it led it’s next highest competitor the Model S by about 2,800 sales this year.

    And even in the US where we have many newer options, the Leaf is the 6th best selling EV so far this year.

    No shame on Nissan for that performance.

    1. Stimpy says:

      Can you name 6 BEVs sold in the US under 50k? I can’t!

      And Nissan has crazy incentives on Leafs totally up to $17k. That is unheard of on a new car. Not something to brag about!

      1. Jay Cole says:

        Nissan’s key to success has always been pricing, so I think even if one does not care for the offering itself…the fact they put out a true mid-size electric for always close to the lowest price of any is significant. And helps to keep pricing lower on other offerings.

        When it comes to overall adoption, if the 2018 LEAF only had 150 miles range, looked like dog-poop, but had a MSRP of $27,499 in the US…one could argue it would be far superior/more significant than 200 miles and $40k.

        We are seeing 60 kwh packs available (on discount) to the public at ~12k, so a 450 mile $40,000 (true pricing, not starting MSRP) is doable thing, let along the benefits of scale moving forward, it is just a matter of motivation getting the pricing to ‘the masses’…but to do that we need vehicles like the LEAF, the Bolt EV and (in theory) the Model 3 to break down those miles per $ barriers.

        For the first generation, it really was the LEAF continually pushing the MSRP bar continually lower for BEVs. So if you hated the LEAF, but liked/bought the Focus Electric, Fiat 500e, etc. you had Nissan to thank for not paying 35k+ or $350 leases on them.

        One now hopes for a repeat pricing performance for gen 2…because while there are skads of 200ish mile offerings coming to the US (+1 to new CARB ZEV maths) and Europe, there is no other unannounced BEV in the short term that has the potential to be a significant cost outlier to the norms.

      2. Carlos Ghosn says:

        1. Ford Focus Electric
        2. Nissan Leaf
        3. Chevrolet Bolt
        4. Fiat 500e
        5. Mitsubishi iMiEV
        6. Kia Soul EV

        Now that wasn’t too hard was it?

        1. alohart says:

          7. BMW i3

          1. Jay Cole says:

            …just to round it out for clarity’s sake (and no, the Honda Clarity doesn’t get on the list and make it a Baker’s dozen until August, lol)

            8. VW e-Golf
            9. Mercedes B 250e
            10. Hyundai Ioniq Electric
            11. smart ED
            12. Chevy Spark EV* (technically as there is still a half dozen new left in inventory, lol)

  7. Roy LeMeur says:

    The best move Nissan could do would be to make the e-NV200 van with 300+ mile range and market it in the USA. They wouldn’t be able to make them fast enough.

    1. BenG says:

      That would be a bold move, and I agree a good one. Only problem is the cost of the 100 kwh battery that the van would need.

      $18,000 battery makes for an expensive small delivery van. Depending on how long the battery lasts and on maintenance costs and reliability, a commercial operation would take a while to make back the cost premium.

    2. speculawyer says:

      Meh, I doubt it. That would be very expensive, not all that attractive, and a niche market.

    3. Jason says:

      All Nissan needs to do is redesign the layout of the Leaf battery pack, lay them flat in the floor of e-NV2000, put two of them in and you have a relatively inexpensive BEV van that can go almost 200mi. Honestly, how hard could it really be?

      This is where I find these manufactures pathetic. Tesla can figure out the electronics to allow 40,60,75,90 and 100kWh packs in essentially the same vehicle, but Nissan can’t figure out how to offer 24,30 or double them up and offer 48, 54 or 60kWh in a van which is crying out for this sort of EV capability. Let the market decide what size is best for their use case. Based on replacement cost another 24kWh pack should attract a premium $5k, of course there is some engineering of the vehicle to account for the increased weight, but should be easy peasy, especially when you see an example where their employee, in their own time, chopped a Leaf down and made a decent looking small ute.

      1. John Ray says:

        Right – just throw crap against the wall until you figure out what sticks – that’s genius. Clearly you aren’t in sales or marketing.

        Mature firms conduct market research and then provide the products that address the actual market need AND can be sold at a profit.

  8. William L. says:

    That’s about right, 310 miles = 250 real range. On par with everyone else estimate for next gen EV

  9. BenG says:

    There is huge public benefit when commercial vehicles go electric. Diesel delivery and service vehicles are ENORMOUS polluters, right down at road level dumping toxic pollution in our lungs.

    The government has an important role to play in reducing population exposure to toxic pollution from diesel trucks and vans. EVs will be the perfect solution, but cost is still an obstacle. Depending on local electrical and gasoline costs it could take a while to make up a $15,000 price premium compared to gas or diesel.

    1. BenG says:

      Solution:

      Carbon fee and dividend with a moderate but rising fee attached to carbon fuels. I’d say start about 25 cents per gallon gasoline equivalent. The fee is refunded 100% to legal residents of the US, full share adults, half share for children.

      Please pick up the call for a carbon fee and dividend, for the health of society.

    2. DJ says:

      I literally almost died (well not quite) yesterday. I was in a long line of traffic next to a FedEx truck that was just foul, worse than normal. Couldn’t escape the diesel fumes. Finally I just left like 4 car lengths in front of me so I would be somewhat far back enough from it. Got honked at but heck, it’s not like we are going anywhere when it’s a red light!

      So ya, I agree. Not to mention a large % of the vehicles have planned and expected routes so it’s not like there is a huge varying # of miles driven in a day like there can often be with passenger cars. Seems like it would be easier to plan it out.

  10. Taison says:

    The new Nissan leaf is not even out, then they talk about the next generation EV will be over 300 miles range, that sounds a lot of BS. Or the new Leaf would be a disappointment so they try to hype up a one that they don’t even have?

    1. DJ says:

      The Tesla Model 3 isn’t out yet they’re talking about a new Roadster and the Model Y.

      How is it BS? Do you expect companies to not talk about both the short and long term future??

      1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        The only thing Nissan has done for EV tech since the Leaf was first released in December 2010, is tweak the battery chemistry a bit so it wasn’t quite as oversensitive to overheating.

        If we could say the same about Tesla, if all Tesla was offering was a slightly tweaked Roadster; if Tesla had not started selling the Model S or the Model X, and was not now gearing up to produce the Model 3 in record numbers for an EV; if Tesla was not continually improving its cars and wirelessly sending out frequent upgrades to existing cars…

        Then nobody would be excited about Tesla, and no other auto maker would be trying hard to imitate Tesla.

        How many auto makers are trying to imitate Nissan? Hmmmm? Not a single one.

        One of these things (companies) is not like the other!

  11. Kevin C says:

    When will Nissan bring the eNV200 to the US?
    If they build it,
    we will buy it!
    150-200 miles would hit the ground running.

    1. DJ says:

      Ya, I think it would do reasonably well here actually even in it’s current offering.

    2. speculawyer says:

      It would seem like a no-brainer to sell cheap 150 mile range NV-200 to postal services worldwide. Why isn’t that happening?

      1. wavelet says:

        It is. The France and Australia postal services use the Renault Kangoo ZE.
        New Zealand Post also has several hundred small electric vans.
        German Post (DHL) actually rolled their own van, after VW dragged their feet… It raised enough interests that it turned out they’re actually selling the van ot extermal customers.

        https://cleantechnica.com/2017/04/13/dhl-deutsche-post-double-electric-delivery-van-production/

        And at least one (IIRC more) of the proposals for the huge USPS contract are electric.

        1. Kevin C. says:

          Those damn Socialists!
          Beating Capitalists at their own game. The nerve of these upstart roustabouts…l

          “From each according to their multilevel marketing schemes,
          to each according to their guaranteed return on investment”
          -Groucho Marx

      2. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        “It would seem like a no-brainer to sell cheap 150 mile range NV-200 to postal services worldwide. Why isn’t that happening?”

        I certainly can’t speak for postal services worldwide, but the U.S. Postal Service wants rugged vehicles expected to last 25-30 years. Ordinary “light duty” cars and light trucks can’t meet that standard.

  12. speculawyer says:

    Nissan needs to stop talking and start delivering.

  13. Tim Miser says:

    I think a plug in hybrid with a 150 mile range would be the sweet spot where you could always be fully electric except for long trips.

  14. wavelet says:

    Maybe Nissan should actually intro and sell 200mi vehicles before committing more verbiage on the generation after that?

  15. Dr. Miguelito Loveless says:

    Still waiting on the e-NV200 van to show up in the U.S.

    (Taps foot impatiently)

    1. wavelet says:

      Unfortunately, I suspect this won’t happen until/unless its (and comparable vehicles from other makers) ICE version is sold in the US.

      In Europe, the equivalents outnumber the US-sized pickups & vans by far (VW Caddy, Peugeot Partner/Citroën Berlingo, Renault Kangoo, Fiat Qubo & Doblò, Ford Transit etc.)
      While they usually have family-oriented MPVs, the ones for commercial use are prevalent.

      Service required for such a vehicle isn’t limited to drivetrains, so if the ICE version won’t sell in the US, neither will the electrics, at least until EVs are a big market in themselves.

  16. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

    “According to Nissan… the next-generation of EVs will surpass a 310-mile range for cars.”

    Translation:

    Pay no attention to the fact that we have completely let our BEV tech stagnate since 2013, or that we still haven’t shown any attempt to match the modern second-generation, 200+ mile BEVs. We’ll catch up by the third generation, honest!

    Dear Nissan:

    Actions speak louder than words.

    1. BenG says:

      Did you forget that Nissan increased the Leaf’s battery capacity from 24 kwh to 30 kwh in 2016?

      That’s a significant bump that increased range from 84 miles to 107 miles. How many EVs are sold even today that can beat that? Nissan is still ahead of many competitors like the e-Golf, 500e, Focus EV, etc …

  17. WARREN says:

    I think the new LEAF will be a compelling product in design, technology, and quality. Maybe it will have driver aids that surpass all others in its class. There are many aspects which make cars appealing to consumers. Everyone thought a 25 mile Prius PHEV would be a failure….

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