German Automakers Now Fear Tesla

1 year ago by Steven Loveday 96

The German auto industry has poked fun at Tesla and CEO Elon Musk in the past, and has never publicly voiced any concerns about the California start-up. As recently as last November, Edzard Reuter, former Daimler chairman, called Musk a “pretender” and said:

BMWs

BMW’s All-Electric i3 Ringing In At Only 81 Miles Of Range Compared To Triple Or More Miles In A Tesla

Tesla is “a joke that can’t be taken seriously compared to the great car companies of Germany.”

It was never expected that the small company, especially while losing capital, could ever push the boundaries enough to make experienced German automakers sweat.

Fast-forward to March when 325,000 eager fans around the world put $1,000 each down  in one week to reserve the upcoming Tesla Model 3 and times have changed (with the most recently tally totaling about ~400,000 reservations).

Ferdinand Dudenhoeffer, a German car industry analyst at the Center for Automotive Research at the University of Duisburg-Essen confirmed:

“The German carmakers are taking Tesla more seriously every day now. 

Germans have an enormous amount of pride in their engineering skills and believe they know everything that needs to be known about cars.

They used to think there was no way that anyone could possibly build cars as well as they do. And then along comes this young punk in California. They thought he didn’t have a clue about cars and treated him like a joke. And now they’re seeing that he’s leading the revolution.”

Many German automakers are already making electric cars, but of those, most are PHEVs. Hybrids have been the “thing” for the trusted companies, and plug-in hybrids seem to be an extension of that thinking. Tesla is proving that all-electric may be the way to go.

There are a few German all-electric models, like the BMW i3, but despite being priced lower than Tesla’s flagship Model S, a disappointingly short range has made sales marginal. This is pushing German companies to quickly get electric models to market. Tesla sold more electric cars last year in Germany than any other company.

After Daimler was victim to many complaints at a recent shareholders meeting, Dieter Zesche, Daimler chairman, pointed out that Tesla has yet to make any money. He said that his company will be delivering a competing vehicle with a range of around 310 miles soon-ish. He is confident that Tesla’s success can help others. He said:

“Tesla has promised a lot but has also delivered most of it.” There is a lot of excitement in the industry about the “overall appearance and approach Tesla is taking.”

“There is no doubt that getting new momentum from a new player is good.”

Claudia Kemfert, head of energy, transport and environment at the German Institute for Economic Research in Berlin, called German automakers careless. She explained that auto companies were “arrogant” and failed to see the competition of Tesla as other German companies have in the past with market-changing innovations like the MP3 player and the fax machine. Kemfert concluded:

“German carmakers have completely misjudged the gigantic economic opportunities of sustainable mobility. The German car industry is in the process of squandering the chances for the future just like the big utilities blew their chances with renewable energy. Tesla is at the same time both a danger for German manufacturers, but it’s also a wake-up call.”

Source: LA Times

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96 responses to "German Automakers Now Fear Tesla"

  1. MikeG says:

    Fear can be an excellent motivator.

    1. evcarnut says:

      YEA!! they _((the GERMANS))ALSO thought they were the superior Race back in the 1940’s Until The Great “JOE LOUIS” The Black Boxer ..Knocked the Big German GOON 0ut on his Ass ! !..Looks Like History is REPEATING!!!!

      1. przemo_li says:

        Second World War started 1st September 1939 by German bombardment of a Polish city at 4 o’clock in the morning without official declaration of war.

        1. evcarnut says:

          Sounds like you were there .. I am Not talking about the war…I am only giving an example, of how stupid some of these people are….

          1. DocDragon says:

            If you dig hard enough, you will find similar stories and hubris in *every* culture. It’s also ignorance that leads to righteousness.

        2. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

          przemo_li said:

          “Second World War started 1st September 1939 by German bombardment of a Polish city…”

          WW II started in 1931, when Japan invaded Manchuria. In 1937, Japan also invaded China.

      2. EVrules says:

        I am German and please, please no further comparisons! This is another kind of selfishness and arrogance, it isn’t about nationalities, it’s about pure profits, regardless the environment.

      3. Priusmaniac says:

        You have got some serious anti German attitude problem.

      4. Dan says:

        Life is too short to go through it with weird ethnic hangups. Keep the weird xenophobia out of this…and stop listening to Trump and Bernie. Real Americans will happily buy Japanese, German, and American made cars on their merits without getting hung up about who built them.

        1. Open-Mind says:

          “Life is too short to go through it with weird ethnic hangups.”

          I agree … we should let go of our ethnic hangups. Chronological order sounds good to me.

          So let’s start with our Mexican-American War hangups, like opposition to border security. After that, we should let go of our Civil War hangups, like southern flags and racial resentment. And for the finale, we let go of our WWII hangups, the much larger and more recent atrocities that were committed by Japan and Germany.

      5. Speculawyer says:

        Dude, really? We don’t need that kind of talk.

        Germany has been a model nation with their Energiewende.

  2. Brian says:

    I guess the i5 better really blow people away. A 200ish mile 0-60 in 6 seconds for 60-70k will NOT cut it.

    1. Aaron says:

      But… but… it’s a BMW! You should pay more for the marque! Oh, and heated steering wheel, turn signals (BMW drivers don’t use ’em anyway), etc.

      1. evcarnut says:

        The 0nly funny thing I see here is the cartoonish funny looking 13 & i8 amongst others ie: the goofy vw Beetle & so ON!

    2. evcarnut says:

      The I5 doesn’t Blow anyone away, Because IT SUCKS ! ! Expensive,,, A Ya! Das GUT ! Ya??

      1. Dan Hue says:

        Are you off your meds?

        1. SparkEV says:

          He’s just nuts. Think Murdock from the A Team.

          1. Chris O says:

            Frankly I think he is a fake made up by some anti EV agenda to make EV supporters look stupid.

          2. evcarnut says:

            Yea…., & I drive a Mercedes ! I must be really nuts now !!

          3. Dan says:

            I’ve just learned to ignore him. He’s too erratic to even be an effective troll.

          4. TomArt says:

            Billy! BILLY!! Where’s my dog, Billy? Where’d they take ‘im? Don’t tell me they killed him! Billy!

            Good ol’ Howlin’ Mad Murdock!

    1. evcarnut says:

      The Germans have many really “STUPID” Battery Configuration ..Now , that !..Is Comical …Just look at those utterly G00FY sequences. A Child engineer Can think better than that! ..L M A 0…

      1. EVrules says:

        It isn’T about the engineering capabilities, there are thousands of electric power trains in the industry, as well as good engineers. The CEOs are the ones who avoid strongly any innovation, they don’t want to invest in something new and risky which could decrease the quarter profits a bit.

        1. Rich says:

          Is it quarterly earnings or CEOs don’t want to risk their quarterly bonuses.

  3. SaturnV says:

    Cant even build a better car than Leaf.
    What a joke.

  4. Peter P says:

    The Germans are still late in their planning with a 310 mile range car for sometime in the future.
    Tesla is now building cars with over 300 miles.
    By the time the Germans have those cars ready Tesla will be making 500 mile cars

    1. Scott Franco says:

      For reasons I don’t understand, many insideevers have this idea that a range war is going on, Ie., the higher the better.

      It already isn’t true. Telsa just REDUCED their range (Model 3 vs. model S), and yet there is tremendous interest in the car.

      The next wave of Telsa competitors will, undoubtedly, be bigger range as if that is all that matters. A 200 mile Bolt is not equivalent to a 200 mile Telsa. A 300 mile Benz is not equivalent to or better than a Tesla, because the Tesla has reasonable fast charging and an extensive network.

      If leaf were to get a 300kW charger and 5 minutes to a %80 charge, this would be sufficient to change the way the car is used and perceived without increasing the net range of the car. It would be a practical long distance car given sufficient number of chargers.

      We need to exit this “range is everything” mantra. It isn’t. Battery size is weight, and carrying a 1000lbs weight with more charge than you need for daily use is both costly and inefficient.

      1. Seth says:

        I think of it more as “no other manufacturer has a 200mile (300km)” ev. And as of may 2016, that still holds true.

        The current crop of electric cars have been driven by the statistics agency that said that 60 miles cover 95% of the trips. And they built that, they must be right. right?

        It turns out that people really want something that covers 98% of the trips, and a fast charge network they can rely on.

        1. Rich says:

          I would add people want a car that will meet their needs for 7 years, not just the day it’s purchased. Another factor in the desirability of 200+ mile range cars are cold weather impacts and year over year degradation.

      2. Priusmaniac says:

        Perhaps, some day, range won’t be the main factor but we are not there yet and today range is indeed the most important parameter. That will last until we are at 400 miles, so we still have some progress to see until we get there. The same is true on recharge, we are at 135 KW but we need to increase to 1000 KW or at leasg to 500 KW. That’s a factor 7 of 4 more than the present fastest charger. So, we still have some way to go before saying something like “range or charging speed doesn’t matter”.

        1. Bonaire says:

          Range is a “rationalized argument”. EVs with a wide enough DCFC network need not be more than 200 miles of range. We don’t see enough EV sales internationally to believe that they won’t sell until they hit 400 miles of range. That is “American range” desires and not “International range requirements”.

          I was talking with someone the other night. He has traveled the world. He was speaking to someone else from our town who has not gone more than 50 miles from home. Ever. There are people who commute 20 miles a day and rarely take a trip. They could rent a car. They could car-pool. They could use their other ICE car. Whatever. The need for EVs to reach 400 miles of range is an outlier condition. What people want are EVs which can be leased for less than ICE cars to entice them into getting in them.

          I gave blood last night and my phlebotomist (sp?) asked me about my Volt. Told her that buying new does not save you any money but buying used might. Her need is to drive 50+ miles each way to various blood centers. A used Volt or Prius might do the trick. Until EVs actually save people money over ICE – the vast majority of the public just doesn’t care. About climate either. If they really cared, they would be lining up at their Chevy and Ford dealers and demanding efficient vehicles. They are buying trucks and SUVs.

      3. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        Scott Franco said:

        “For reasons I don’t understand, many insideevers have this idea that a range war is going on, Ie., the higher the better.”

        That’s certainly true. What’s so hard to understand?

        “It already isn’t true. Telsa just REDUCED their range (Model 3 vs. model S), and yet there is tremendous interest in the car.”

        Ummmm… no. We’re moving from the only BEV having more than 100 miles of range being a “premium” sedan, the Model S, which has an average selling price of about $95-100k; to suddenly multiple auto makers offering 200+ mile BEVs in a mid-priced category.

        Definitely a very substantial range increase from the ~80-90 mile range Leaf, i3, and Kia Soul.

        “The higher the range the better” certainly will apply at least until the average BEV has 300-350 miles of range. Beyond that, I think the law of diminishing returns starts applying. It certainly is an advantage to have a higher capacity battery pack, for faster charging and for longer battery life. But beyond, say, 300 miles of range even in very cold conditions with the heater running, any extra capacity seems questionable for the average driver. Of course, there will always be a niche for cars with longer ranges, for those who often take long road trips.

        1. Priusmaniac says:

          350 miles or 400 miles, in cold weather at 75 mph, that start to be close but it certainly isn’t 100 miles or 200 miles.
          Now, what you don’t want to experience, is that an aged battery would be reducing your range in a way that you couldn’t do that 350 miles anymore, or that you would have to avoid cold and rainy conditions to make it. So have some spare miles, above the 350 miles, when the car is new is no luxury. That is even less so if you want to tow something, or if you go on vacation with the car full of passengers and their luggage.

          1. TomArt says:

            Agreed.

      4. G2 says:

        Hear here!

  5. Taser54 says:

    Fear? No. Allowing Tesla to put all the effort into developing the EV market, Yes?

    Big companies do this all the time. Allow a smaller company to to take the initial risk and then come out with competing products that take advantage of their massive production capacity and customer base.

    There is one thing for being first, but once large-scale competition enters the equation, it’ll be just like the ICE market. Customers will separate themselves to their preferred marques.

    1. tosho says:

      Letting someone else develop the market combined with zero investments in infrastructure and battery factories will turn the grerman car manufacturers into simple “assembly lines” for korean batteries, chinese electric motors and american software.

    2. EVrules says:

      I’m in the (German) automotive industry (just an apprentice) but I got the same feeling, that the industry has to change tremendously within the next decade and I’m looking for new opportunities as soon as I’m qualified.

    3. Priusmaniac says:

      Kodak wouldn’t say it better! Look where they are now on digital cameras.

      1. wavelet says:

        Not a good example.
        Kodak never dissed digital cameras, and was actually responsible for some of the most usable ones early on.

    4. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      Taser54:

      “Big companies do this all the time. Allow a smaller company to to take the initial risk and then come out with competing products that take advantage of their massive production capacity and customer base.”

      That strategy didn’t work so well for Polaroid, Kodak, or Blackberry, now did it?

      Yeah, big companies do that all the time. And current market leaders who refuse to pursue new tech go bankrupt during disruptive tech revolutions “all the time”, too. The really sad thing is that it’s so easy to see coming, yet all too many companies bury their heads in the sand until it’s too late.

      1. Priusmaniac says:

        Car companies only see the negative aspect of losing their traditional business, but actually a car company doing the smart moves could also profit from the change. Imagine Subaru for instance, their traditional car sales are not phenomenal, so a smart CEO there would say let’s go electric, do the same flat battery as Tesla join the superchargers and sell new electric cars while the others wait. In quiet a small time, Subaru could be selling a lots, not only saving itself from small traditional car sales but instead jumping ahead among the new brands and at least be part of the future. Electrification is a new opportunity not a doomsday event.

    5. ItsNotAboutTheMoney says:

      Funny.

      No. The premium makes didn’t see any serious threat so they moved slowly and just complied with ZEV and EU regs.

      But Tesla has _already_ had a large impact on the premium market in the USA, and the Model 3 is going to have _more_ impact. Not a problem for VW, but BMW and Daimler need to have something else or cross their fingers that they can sell PHEVs in China to make up for it.

  6. Ian says:

    All existing automakers are being forced to discontinue 99% of their existing business model in the next 10 years and reinvent themselves. New companies starting from scratch have the edge right now if they can sell electromobiles…instead of automobiles. TM

    1. Anon says:

      Not so much with corporate folks like the GM Lobby, blocking direct sales of cars to customers. 🙁

      1. Ian says:

        Big auto should start clone corporations and name it Chevrolet electric or Ford electric and start producing the electric vehicles from these companies so when the time comes when electric dominates they can just pull the plug on the old companies.

        1. Anon says:

          Good idea. They can pretend to be bold, hungry startups that want to shake up the automotive industry, too. 😉

        2. Epicurus says:

          Excellent idea. In addition, they can’t sell their EV products effectively without dissing ICE vehicles which their existing dealers and salespeople won’t do.

          1. Ian says:

            Exactly, then you shed all the excess baggage that hinders EV production and adoption.

  7. alex says:

    “competing products that take advantage of their massive production capacity and customer base”.

    What production capacity? They have massive overcapacity (and debt) for ICE, but none when it comes to batteries.

    1. taser54 says:

      You are myopically focused on the batteries. 3rd parties are driving those costs down, no car manufacturer is going to have to worry about that (regardless of Tesla’s strategy).

      1. Chris O says:

        No third parties are building battery factories for Model 3 matching production runs.

        LG is building a factory in Poland to come on line in 2017 that can cook up 229,000 batteries, Mostly small ones for PHEVs. If only a single of the many car makers that are looking at LG for their battery needs decided to do a Model 3 sort of production run of a Model 3 spec car the total output of that factory wouldn’t be anywhere near enough to supply it.

        We’ll know when Germany gets serious about taking Tesla on when we get the report LG or whoever starts building Gigafactories.

        No such reports yet…

      2. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

        taser54 said:

        “You are myopically focused on the batteries. 3rd parties are driving those costs down, no car manufacturer is going to have to worry about that (regardless of Tesla’s strategy).”

        Tesla, BYD, and Nissan have all bet a very large amount money you’re wrong, by building their own battery factories.

        We’ll see just how well other EV makers do by competing for the limited supply of batteries that current battery makers are willing to make.

        The idea that EV makers will depend on third parties for battery supply, once they want to get into making long-range EVs in large volumes, is as wrongheaded as the idea they’d farm out making gas/diesel motors for their best-selling gasmobiles to third parties.

  8. Rick says:

    Sure, they were arrogant and dismissive of Tesla at first but now they get it. I would definitely not call it game over for them, but more like late to the party which is the case with 90% of the automotive world. It would be foolish to think that a few of those concepts and talks won’t materialize by 2020. German engineers take time to do things well, it’s their approach. Germans do make good ICE cars and I’m willing to bet they’ll make good EVs especially with all those patents Tesla generously opened up. One thing I’m curious about is will Tesla end up being equal to or better Germans at quality interiors and material choices. in addition, will the Germans and other car makers figure out a solution to charging infrastructure that’s comparable to superchargers. Time will tell.

    1. Scott Franco says:

      Name some famous German electronics makers. What is a famous german CPU? How about famous airplane makers? (mostly french and american, BTW). German manufacturing is centered around precision mechanics.

      Its not limited to Germany. The CEO of Zero motorcycles talked about the “silicon valley meme”, a set of electronic knowledge and philosophy of invention that is unique to the valley.

      1. Taser54 says:

        Siemens seems to be doing alright with 71 Billion Euro revenue in 2014.

        1. wavelet says:

          Ditto Robert Bosch GmbH which is about the same size…

      2. notting says:

        How many other countries with famous CPUs are there?

        BTW: Infineon (formerly the semiconductor part of Siemens) seems to be quite successful with mobile devices and automotive -> http://www.heise.de/newsticker/meldung/Infineon-profitiert-von-Autoindustrie-aber-enttaeuscht-mit-Ausblick-3089763.html

        I’m sure that somewhere I’ve still have RAM modules with Infineon chips.

        notting

        1. wavelet says:

          A lot of famous CPUs were done outside the US; many of Intel’s CPU were and still are done in Israel, as were some of Motorola’s and National Semiconductor’s, Marvel’s etc.

      3. EVrules says:

        There’s just a chance in solid state batteries, noone is currently leading in that kind of battery. The true challenge is “where to get the energy source” for the coming EVs, it isn’t so difficult to make a chassis.

      4. Robert says:

        You are right on cpu. But look up the story of Airbus. A major part of it is german based.

      5. Priusmaniac says:

        Germany doesn’t have access to anything in the closed garden Itar related and the associated money and technology bonanza. Accordingly Germany is rather doing better than many other countries in the same situation.

      6. Scott Franco says:

        Germany is a true puzzle when it comes to electronics, computers and specifically software industries.

        Its easy to understand why Japan and China lag significantly in software and programming. They don’t value originality and reward group think, none of that is a good basis for software development.

        Germany had an early start in computers, and has a sea of incredibly smart programmers, but most are unemployed, and are either creating freeware or trying to hack into your bank for cash. Germany has done a terrible job of encouraging computer startups.

        1. wavelet says:

          German culture isn’t a startup culture in general (note small business doesn’t mean startup; Germany has plenty of successful small businesses).

          As far as software goes, German companies virtually own the field of audio processing at all levels.
          Also see the Fraunhofer Institute.

          1. Loboc says:

            No one here has heard ov SAP evidentially.

    2. Heisenberghtbacktotheroots says:

      German engineers take time to do things well…

      Tell that to my wife! She thinks I am lazy sitting in the sun, drinking coffee. No I’m not. I’m just taking time to plan how to paint that wall… This way I can also read my favourite EV news site… Maybe I paint that wall in 2020 when my fellow colleagues will bring a real EV to the market 😉 (if by then their CEO allow them to do so…)

  9. evcarnut says:

    Anon, the L00SERS at GM cannot succeed without TAXPAYER bailouts & special government perks to keep them in business ., AND.., by “CHEATING” The Competition with the help of the AMERICAN GOVERNMENT in passing unfair “B S” trade Laws..to hurt Tesla for One!

    1. Anon says:

      One could argue that bailed out corporations that have by all measure __failed__, have been rewarded for such (repetitive) behavior by being artificially propped up by taxpayer money…

  10. JR says:

    I don’t Think German auto makers is loosing so much money on the Tesla competition for now, I mean the electric car evolution haven got to that part of the market yet, but they have lost prestige in the luxury segment all over the world in witch they was leading.
    But Tesla model 3 is a wakeup call for all of the traditional car industry. 400.000 orders show a real demand
    I think BMW did an effort but they got to push it much further.
    And car manufacture they cant sit around and wait for other industries to build the future charging infrastructure that will sell there electric cars, they got to invest now if they what to play catch up with Tesla

    1. Joe says:

      Recent sales figures painted a different picture for 2015: Tesla Model S outsold any other car in its category (S Class, 7Series, A8/7 etc), with only the S-Class coming in as a close second. And even more: exluding the S-class, the Model S sold more unites than all the others combined. I think that is something to worry some sales types in big autocorp.

  11. Get Real says:

    Not exactly correct. Tesla has started to seriously erode the sales of German luxury vehicles which is their highest margin segment.

    When the Model 3 starts shipping in large numbers it will do the same to the German’s mid-range sales which because of its volume represents a very big chunk of their revenues.

    I call it the “Tesla Effect” and it means innovate or risk slow death.

    1. Bonaire says:

      Erode? Sure. But seriously erode? Not yet. BMW sold 2.2 Million units in 2015.

      Also, In the United States Mercedes-Benz fared better than BMW, with U.S. sales of its Mercedes brand totaling 350,548 for all of 2015, compared with total BMW-brand sales of 346,023. When all vehicles are included, BMW outsold Mercedes-Benz in the United States, tallying 404,537 units in 2015 to 380,461 for its rival.

      http://247wallst.com/autos/2016/01/11/bmw-tops-mercedes-for-luxury-car-sales-in-2015/

  12. Anon says:

    “With fear, comes respect.”

    — Donald Trump

    1. Foo says:

      “Part of the beauty of me is that I am very rich.”

      — Donald Trump

      1. Anon says:

        I still don’t see it. 😀

  13. Forever Green says:

    In some markets around the world Tesla is selling more vehicles than Mercedes Benz and BMW combined. I thought that was the wake-up call. I don’t think the Germans have figured out how to compete with Tesla in this changing environment. I think they will figure out the recipe in the next 5 or 6 years. It will be interesting to see what happens when they do.

    1. Pushmi-Pullyu says:

      +3

  14. Just_Chris says:

    I really dislike stories like this and the racist rants that inevitably follow them.

    The automakers head quartered within Germany are multi-national. They are not one state owned company with one common approach or philosophy. VW group, BMW and Merc have totally different model line-ups and a totally different approach to electrification of their products.

    BMW and VW group are doing just fine if the model 3 starts to dominate the i3 will become better looking and more powerful with the Golf GTE and eGolf becoming more competitive as well. There is also room for an i5 that looks less like it has been in an accident and more like a normal car. The Porsche line up could change pretty quickly to compete with what ever the market throws at them. VW group also has upteen different concepts that it could pull out in a 2-3 year time frame.

    Merc. has a problem and I think it is caused by the fact that Tesla was their insurance policy. The idea being that if EV’s took off they could just buy Tesla and start a sub brand.

    Without Merc. there would be no Tesla, they not only invested in Tesla but they also provided significant support both technically and via their supply chain. Actions speak loader than words, if they thought Tesla was a mistake and stupid why would they have worked so hard with them?

    I am still not convinced that the relationship has totally ended but assuming it has then that is a problem. Merc is now sitting looking pretty bloody stupid no Tesla and no in house car. I think they can pull it back but it won’t be pretty. It’ll be like in 2011 with VW and BMW having nothing. Nissan had the LEAF and Merc was in bed with Tesla. All VW and BMW could do was through insane amounts of mud around while their engineering teams caught up.

    Victory for these guys is not having the best EV, victory is having the biggest market share. Tesla is winning battles but the war hasn’t even got started properly yet. In particular I think the i3 concept (as it is in the EU not as it is in its butchered form in the USA) is the strongest competitor to Tesla right now, if that car looked good, was a more sensible size and accelerated more like the i8 I think it could really give Tesla model 3 and its supercharger network a run for its money.

    I really wish Nissan would pull their finger out – I doubt I will ever buy a Tesla, BMW, VW or any other brand where the car is more than just a means of getting from one place to another.

    1. mxs says:

      Too much common sense in your post, you will be ridiculed in 5,4,3,2,1 …

    2. TomArt says:

      Yeah, I don’t know where the ethnic rants come from…it’s a shame, really.

  15. I *simply* cannot believe the *utter* arrogance of these people. Given what has been going on with VW (and if every other diesel car maker has not been up to the same fraudulent activity I will be very surprised) how *on Earth* do they have the front to come out with this sort of drivel, publicly (and expect to get away with it)?

    Even Ferdinand Dudenhoeffer has to ruin his grudging compliment by referring to Mr Musk as a ‘young punk’. Why not ‘young visionary’ or something equally polite and accurate?

    Edzard Reuter, former Daimler chairman, must be feeling extremely stupid nowadays – and quite rightly so – but at least I am glad to see that he is no longer in control of Daimler. But it will be a long time before the entrenched, Big Oil-prostituted thinkers of these huge organisations have finally been relegated to the past.

    1. heisenberghtbacktotheroots says:

      Hehehe.

      While “punk” is a four letter word, it not neccecarily is unpolite. In fact most people who have to spend their days in boring meetings admire those punks for the freedom a punk calls his own and which none of their money can buy. (Funnily it’s the quite the same kind of admiration when a “punk” calls someone a “capitalist”) When someone like Dudenhoeffer (who surely spends a lot of time beeing bored) calls someone a punk, that can be taken as a compliment.

      Hey Ho! Let’s go!

  16. Heisenberghtbacktotheroots says:

    After having read some of the above comments, I really hate “those Germans”

    Can I somehow become American? I saw on TV that they are fat lazy people (I’m already lazy, becoming fat won’t be that hard I guess… ). Somehow I am still confused as I also heard that they have slavery… Do they still kill gay people? Do I have to wear those kkk hats? What if I don’t like guns? What if I believe in science? Do I have to support the gulf war? I’m not sure what it is about? Weapons of mass destruction? Oil? really confusing… Maybe I should just just live on being German and just ignore those strange comments from people who obviously have not been outside of their beloved and superior homeland… Respectively their couch.

    Of note. I did not start any war.

    1. mxs says:

      As you have noticed, this site has a fanatical following of Tesla fanboys who hate anything other than Tesla and especially anything German made and especially VW made …..

      That’s the way it is … laugh it off.

      The delusion will end one day, it will just take time, exactly like ICE to EV will take time, something they fail to acknowledge. Because everyone should order or by Tesla and turn their autopilot on … (rolling eyes …).

      I take the site for what it is. When you really know what’s going in auto-industry, whether ICE or EV, there’s other sites to follow, shockingly, not.

      1. heisenberghtbacktotheroots says:

        Yeah laughing it off works on good days 😉

        Somehow my day recently became fine, so let me come back with more fun…

        Funnily I would consider myself “some kind of” Tesla fanboy. Thats mainly because when Germany introduced “Abwrackprämie” to support their car industry I claimed that it would be wiser to invest that money into battery production facility. I was happy to see that Tesla to some extent did exactly that, so they have a huge bonus.

        In fact, I also kinda dislike VW, BMW and Merc (but that’s more of a private thing…)

        That very fanboyism is the reason I keep visiting this site. (And due to that strange addiction to numbers the monthly scorecard…)

    2. TomArt says:

      Yeah, I don’t get it, either. We here in the US are too complacent, allowing the inexcusable things you mentioned, and others, to take place while we willingly remain distracted by toys and entertainment.

      What truly terrifies me, particularly in view of that Trump quote above about fear, we risk the likes of Trump actually becoming president, in which case, Germany will not be the only Western nation to have to live down an ugly chapter in World events.

      Also, note that it was pretty much just “evcarnut” and others were putting him/her in their place and/or ignoring the cRa$y RANTS.

      1. heisenberghtbacktotheroots says:

        You are right, I maybe should have mentioned that I (very happily) noticed that there was nice reply to that stupid bs by many other commenters.

        Normally I just try to ignore such, but this time I just had to say something…

        Sometimes I can laugh it off, but sometimes it really bothers me, that whereever I go people often know nothing about germany except WW, The Nazis and Hitler. (There are of course others who keep mentioning that we have the best engineers 😉 Somehow this one prejudice I really like…)

        Sadly stupidity is something we all will have to live with. On some days it’s easy. On some not…

  17. pjwood1 says:

    What’s dawning on the German car makers is American counterparts don’t have near the regulatory capture they have, at home. What’s worse is the idea Americans knew it, and are ready to grab share.

    I’m sure many German people would say their car companies are out of touch with them. I think that is precisely what the Works counsel is saying to VW managment, “your bad, not ours”. Even though we started it, to stereo type Amercians by their media is to miss how equally out of touch their politicians are with them.

    I plan to keep putting the popcorn on.

    1. heisenberghtbacktotheroots says:

      “I’m sure many German people would say their car companies are out of touch with them.”

      Count me as one of them…

      ” to stereo type Amercians by their media is to miss how equally out of touch their politicians are with them”

      Politicians are out of touch by definition 😉

      I do not stereo type. I type stereo. On steroids. Asteroids. I know exactly what American Dad looks like. Homer Simpson. And Family Guy!

  18. ticobird says:

    As a Tesla Model S owner I find it interesting how both the curious public and the established auto manufacturers have not understood the importance of a dependable and reliable away-from-home “fast charging” infrastructure. Sure, if you have no intention for daily travel beyond your battery capacity then it is not important especially if your household can afford multiple vehicles but I suspect most adopters want a single vehicle that can replace their ICE vehicle. That was and remains my insight that allowed me to choose to trade my ICE vehicle to Tesla and purchase my Model S. Once I realized I could rent an ICE when needed the choice was simple. It wasn’t even a hard decision to sell my second ICE recreational vehicle (2004 BMW E46 M3 Imola Red 6-speed) to a BMW fan from Canada.

    Without knowing exactly why I would become so enthused with my purchase I feel I would be omitting something if I didn’t try to convey the calming and relaxing nature of the lack of engine noise and gear shifting, oh and of course waking up to a full tank of electrons every morning.

    1. TomArt says:

      Yep, until a presumed, eventual, global CCS network of 100kW+ charging stations become a reality (if ever), Tesla recognized the need and made it happen. That’s one of the main reasons why I have a reservation for a Model 3.

      1. Bonaire says:

        Tom, Companies like ABB are well into creating dual-head DCFC charging stations. Now, who pays to install them? That’s the problem. The makers can make the equipment but then it’s the responsibility of “someone” to install them. Time will tell but if Tesla can do it using other peoples’ money and build debt to do it, someone else might find a more fiduciary way to do it for a flat result or even equitable profit.

      2. ticobird says:

        Don’t forget to mention the vast majority of EV owners will charge up in their garages. Sure, a dependable charging network is a huge plus for long distance travel but most driving occurs in daily doses that a sufficiently large enough battery will accommodate.

  19. Bonaire says:

    Currently – there is a catch. The German companies should fear Wall Street because… Tesla’s financial situation is one of loss and it requires further wall street funding to continue. Without Wall Street, there is no Tesla.